Recycling Container Oddroc

Discussion in 'Oddrocs' started by JLRockets, Jan 7, 2011.

  1. Jul 21, 2011 #41

    JLRockets

    JLRockets

    JLRockets

    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    The next step was to scruff the inside of the bottle. The specialty epoxy that we are using will adhere to the plastic of the bottle, but only if we scruff. We inadvertently tested this when I forgot to scruff before the initial adherence test. Scruffing is NOT optional! (But my guess is that wearing the bottle on your head is optional.)

    Jackson scruffing bottle inside.jpg

    jackson inside bottle.jpg
     
  2. Jul 21, 2011 #42

    JLRockets

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    We recently did three important test fits. First, we fit the fins into both layers of fin slots. All’s good there.

    Second, we put the rocket with dry fitted fins (but no winglets) into the minivan. Success! We have proved that we can transport the rocket, although the winglets will have to be attached at the launch site. (The fins are a bit crooked in the test fit picture because we didn’t haul the internal tube all the way down to the car.)

    The third test fit may be the most important one. This was the crucial window test fit.

    The width of the stairway up to our third floor workshop is substantially less than the 46 inch span diameter of the rocket without winglets. So, our previous plan was to do everything from fin attachment on in the garage, since we can’t get the rocket out the workshop door once it has its fins on.

    I showed my husband the rocket in the workshop with dry fitted fins. He suggested that I re-read Mike Mulligan and His Steam Shovel. For those of you who don’t remember this endearing children’s story, Mike Mulligan takes on a bet to dig a hole with his beloved steam shovel. He is so eager to win the bet and prove his steam shovel’s worth that he jumps right in on the digging – without considering how he will get the steam shovel out of the hole after he’s done. The steam shovel remains stuck in the hole, and eventually gets turned into the furnace for the new building. In other words, my husband was convinced that the rocket was stuck forever in the workshop and he would someday be sitting in an old rocking chair, reading a story to the rocket that never left.

    But, we are more clever than that. We put the back end of the rocket - with dry fitted fins, but no winglets – out the workshop window. It fits! We are freed from the inconvenience of working in the garage (this is especially important with the current heat in Chicago. The workshop is air conditioned, the garage is not). Our new plan is to complete work in the workshop, and then lower the rocket out through the window before the launch (belaying mechanism to be determined). This, of course, was Jackson’s idea. Chalk yet another one up to the Chief Engineer.

    jackson with fin test fit.jpg

    minivan test fit.jpg

    window test fit.jpg
     
  3. Jul 22, 2011 #43

    SMR

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    Wow, you've been busy. The pieces are all coming together nicely and the rocket is looking great. Have you considered building a winch beam into the ceiling of the workshop? It would certainly be helpful with this build, as well as with some of the projects you and Jackson will have in the future.

    :smile:

    beam1.jpg

    Screen shot 2011-07-22 at 2.26.20 PM.jpg
     
    Last edited: Jul 26, 2011
  4. Jul 26, 2011 #44

    ECayemberg

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    Judy, nice seeing you and Jackson at the launch on Saturday!

    I'm hoping it's an optical delusion, but it appears that once the fins are attached to the core tube at the proper angle and offset, it might be a tight squeeze on the top side of the minivan. I know the photo is of a dry fit only, but it appears to me that once the fins are secured in position, it may not fit. I hope I'm wrong!

    For transporting my Pyro Pumpkin series (about the same dia and fin size as your bottle rocket), we usually end up strapping it to a hitch hauler exterior to the vehicle on the way to Midwest Power. We have a Trailblazer...it fits, but not with other rockets, tools, and suitcases in place.

    Either way, great project!!!

    -Eric-
     
  5. Aug 6, 2011 #45

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    Good news! The picture is not fully representative of the actual dry fitting that we did. I hope I don't need to go into the details of the "discussion" we had about photographing the fitting versus doing the fitting. The long and the short of it is, we'll be okay. Thanks for noticing. These things are more important they look at first glance. The best laid plans of mice of men can get left in the attic if they don't fit out the window.
     
  6. Aug 6, 2011 #46

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    Alright, the work is heating up, but the posts are cooling down. This is a direct and logical correlation. The more time we spend on work, the less time we have to post. So, quickly, here is a some of our progress: painted fins are the drying rack (formally known as the bookshelf); internal support for rail buttons; bolts holding the bottom centering ring in place.

    internal rail button support.jpg

    bolts in bottom cr.jpg

    fin drying rack.jpg
     
  7. Aug 6, 2011 #47

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    More progress. This time on the winglets. We originally planned the winglets with a straight bottom edge for ease of cut (my suggested design). But our Chief Engineer found that design boring (typical teenager response). So, we entered the world of “advanced table saw skills”. With the help of Jackson’s grandfather, Florian, of aforementioned winglet fame, Jackson made a creative jig to allow for the angle cuts necessary to complete the final winglet design. They look pretty good. Maybe I should follow the teenager instinct more often!

    making jig for angle cut.jpg

    jackson with winglets.jpg

    stack of winglets.jpg
     
  8. Aug 6, 2011 #48

    JLRockets

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    Another effect of our slow posting is that, although we have informed the WOOSH community, we have not yet made it formally known that we have officially entered this project into the odd rock competition at LDRS. My apologies. This is actaully exciting news that we have failed to deliver.

    This means that we will be launching the bottle at LDRS. Because of the timing of LDRS in relation to Eat Cheese or Fly, we will not be able to launch the bottle at ECOF. We are giving all of our equipment, rockets included, to Tim Lehr of Wildman Rocketry at the conclusion of ECOF for transport to LDRS (Jackson can’t miss school – it’s a new high school, and all – so we are flying down. Thanks much to Tim for his willingness to transport our stuff and make the launch possible for us). If anything gets damaged at ECOF, we can’t fix it. So, the bottle will be making its maiden launch at LDRS.

    We greatly hope that the rocket will be fully intact after the LDRS launch, and ready for re-launch at Midwest Power.

    We have been filming our progress with a Discovery Science Channel camera (which is why the posts have slowed down!) We hope that we will not end up entirely on the cutting room floor, and that you can view our work on the Science Channel show.
     
  9. Aug 10, 2011 #49

    SMR

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    Thanks for the reminder, Judy. I moved my two ECOF projects from the basement workshop to the garage today. As the fins of one and the winglets of the other get installed, the clearance down the hall is pretty tight.
     
  10. Aug 22, 2011 #50

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    The Great Lowering has occurred. The rocket has made its window escape, and has been successfully liberated from its attic prison – ready to fly! Obviously, I have some explaining to do, since the rocket didn’t even have fins in my last post. I’ll catch up when I can.
     
  11. Aug 31, 2011 #51

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    The rocket is finished and all this is backfill, so I’ll run through it quickly.

    Here you see the rocket with fins tacked, awaiting work on the fillets.

    Fin can statistical rundown:

    • 40 total fillets
    • 6 pounds of epoxy poured (measured as input – there was much left in the mixing cups)
    • Over ½ gallon of foam
    • 1200 shop towels
    • 2 gallons of denatured alcohol
    • 3 shirts, 4 pairs of shorts rendered un-wearable except in the workshop
    • Over 1 million reminders to the Chief Engineer that we are working in a finished space – yes, all spills must be cleaned up (thus the 1200 shop towels and 2 gallons of denatured alcohol)

    fin can on operating table.jpg

    fin can awaiting fillets.jpg
     
  12. Aug 31, 2011 #52

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    Av bay – we decided to go with accelerometer based single deploy for ease of construction and to avoid air flow issues from the bumpy bottle. As usual, Jackson was in charge of design. And, as usual, he did a good job with it.

    av bay design.jpg

    av bay design 2.jpg

    av bay in place.jpg
     
  13. Aug 31, 2011 #53

    JLRockets

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    Here we have the rocket ready for the “swing test” – just kidding, we didn’t really swing a 100 pound rocket. But we did hang it from the ceiling to determine its actual center of gravity.

    Results of analysis: 30 pounds of nose weight made up of 25 pounds of lead shot mixed with 5 pounds of epoxy, foam, bulk plates and attachment bolts.

    Additional stats given the 30 pounds of nose weight:
    • Total rocket weight loaded: 105 pounds.
    • Total usage of hi-temp epoxy: one full gallon! That in and of itself is a special achievement. Very few rockets pack a full gallon of the good stuff. All this for a garbage can.

    nose cone weighting.jpg

    bottle before window exit.jpg
     
  14. Aug 31, 2011 #54

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    The big event – out the window! Jackson concocted a zip line so that the fins would not scrape against the house on the way down. He's one heck of a Chief Engineer!

    window exit 1.jpg

    window exit 2.jpg

    window exit 6.jpg

    window exit 7.jpg

    window exit 8.jpg
     
  15. Aug 31, 2011 #55

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    Success.

    charge test 1 small.jpg

    charge test 2 small.jpg

    charge test 3 small.jpg

    charge test 4 small.jpg
     
  16. Aug 31, 2011 #56

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    The label. I have to hand it to Mark Hayes at Sticker Shock. I literally told him: we’re calling it Lubin’s AP Soda – make it look nice. Sticker Shock did all of the graphic design, including logo design. Who knew they do product placement in addition to decals. Thanks Mark!

    Ap Soda Label final.jpg
     
  17. Aug 31, 2011 #57

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    In the minivan – it fits!

    On display at Eat Cheese or Fly, awaiting loading on the transport vehicle down to Kansas. We are (almost) go for launch! Saturday, Sept 3 at 9am. Kansas. Be there.

    bottle in minivan.jpg

    finished bottle at ecof.jpg
     
  18. Aug 31, 2011 #58

    JLRockets

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    Just Judy TRF Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

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    Wow! Seems like we did this all in one day. What a great way to build a rocket. Just kidding about that. The reason that I got so behind in posts is that talking about work slows the work. Jackson and I have worked very hard this summer. To come full circle, I repeat Sather’s post from the beginning of this thread:

    You are going to love scratch-built rocketry. The biggest differences, in my opinion, between a Wildman / Performance G-10 kit and a scratch-built are time and personal satisfaction. With kits, pretty much everything is there, pre-cut, and ready to assemble. If you don't include epoxy curing time, one could assemble a G-10 kit in an hour. While there is some skill involved in component alignment and epoxy application, the kits are generally well engineered and forgiving. Scratch-built rocketry, on the other hand, is more expensive and time-consuming, and not the least bit forgiving. You can easily spend a week building a single part, change the design spec, and have to throw it away. But, you get a real sense of pride flying something unique, of your own design, personally crafted from raw materials. Add to that the unique difficulties inherent in the recycling bottle. It's PLASTIC. No epoxy on Earth will stick to it, it shatters when cold, and it is not particularly aerodynamic. But, to develop complex problem solving skills, one has to start with a complex problem.

    I love this quote from Teddy Roosevelt... “It is not the critic who counts; not the man who points out how the strong man stumbles, or where the doer of deeds could have done them better. The credit belongs to the man who is actually in the arena, whose face is marred by dust and sweat and blood; who strives valiantly; who errs, who comes short again and again, because there is no effort without error and shortcoming; but who does actually strive to do the deeds; who knows great enthusiasms, the great devotions; who spends himself in a worthy cause; who at the best knows in the end the triumph of high achievement, and who at the worst, if he fails, at least fails while daring greatly, so that his place shall never be with those cold and timid souls who neither know victory nor defeat.”
    Absolutely true. We’re hooked.
     
  19. Sep 1, 2011 #59

    ECayemberg

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    Fantastic JLRockets!!! Best of luck with the flight and in general at LDRS! I LOVE the photos of the bottle zip-lining out of the second story window....wonder what the neighbors think...by now they probably already know.

    I can't be there...but my Dad and some of my propellant will be.

    Again, well done and happy flights.

    -Eric-
     
  20. Sep 1, 2011 #60

    stickershock23

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    Judy YOu are more than welcome. Sorry it did not go as well as we wanted. BUT it is looks BEAUTIFUL!! Good luck with it's first flight. wish I could be there!!!
     
    Last edited: Sep 1, 2011

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