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RIB

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Any updated information on these babies?
 

viciouspeanut

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Too bad Aerotech is having such a hard time getting NAR to approve new loads. This might make interested in some 18mm kits again
 

James Duffy

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Too bad Aerotech is having such a hard time getting NAR to approve new loads. This might make interested in some 18mm kits again
I seriously doubt that NAR S&T is the bottleneck here, despite what you might have read elsewhere. S&T works quickly and efficiently.

James
 

viciouspeanut

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Hmm, well no matter what the case is these little motors look like fun. Hopefully we can get them soon.
 

mikec

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I seriously doubt that NAR S&T is the bottleneck here, despite what you might have read elsewhere.
I've been hoping that somebody from S&T would post about this issue, but that hasn't happened yet. FWIW, the NAR BOD minutes from February say this:

The Board discussed the fact that S&T relies heavily on [committee chair's] relationship with
MIT, whose facilities we use for testing. [] suggested that S&T should build an alternative testing
system as insurance against the possibility of losing access to the MIT test cell... [motion approved] $5000 for a trailer, a mobile test stand, and new test equipment as needed.
See http://www.nar.org/orgdocs/board-of-trustee-meeting-minutes/
 

ksaves2

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Folks, little rockets that go up high end up getting lost easier than larger rockets that go up high. At least the motors are SU. Kurt
 

dhbarr

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Folks, little rockets that go up high end up getting lost easier than larger rockets that go up high. At least the motors are SU. Kurt
We have 18-24mm trackers now :)
 

Woody's Workshop

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Sounds like Aerotech/Quest should sue the pants off the supplier of the casings to me.
For lost revenue in sales, expenses of retesting and retooling if necessary, and as needed.
I think I won't hold my breath for new anything branded Quest.
Seams the rocket gods are against Aerotech from moving forward on anything Quest related lately.
Though, the new web site, IMHO, appears to have been hastily deployed without great thought.
The old site was much easier to navigate, and had a great deal more information on it.
Especially pertaining to older kits. Now it's gone.
 

Woody's Workshop

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Supplier of the casing? Am I missing some context here
From the link in post #3...

Chris MichielssenAugust 14, 2017 at 9:55 PM

Hi Aardvark,
As I understand it, the engines were NAR certified and ready to go into production. Then the supplier of the casings backed out. Quest had to find another domestic supplier and those engines re-tested.
 

RIB

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I wonder what Estes' response will be to these motors?
 

rstaff3

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I bet Estes will have no response. I am looking forward to flying a few but unless the price point is close to Estes, I don't think they will get a large market share. Time will tell.
 

Nytrunner

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Business deals fall through all the time. No need to go 'suit crazy.

I bet Estes will have no response. I am looking forward to flying a few but unless the price point is close to Estes, I don't think they will get a large market share. Time will tell.
If they have some really interesting/unique burn characteristics (for 18mm anyway...) then I think they'll find their place.
 

rstaff3

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I thought Apogee's Medalist motors were unique...but they didn't last. I liked the 10.5mm's and the F10s especially.

I am hoping for a higher avg impulse C and a D or two.

That being said, I liked those motors but did not fly lots of them.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Rocketry Forum mobile app
 

ATGM

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I seriously doubt that NAR S&T is the bottleneck here, despite what you might have read elsewhere. S&T works quickly and efficiently.

James
I would like to see your proof.
 

RoyAtl

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I bet Estes will have no response. I am looking forward to flying a few but unless the price point is close to Estes, I don't think they will get a large market share. Time will tell.
Estes has had a plan (you probably know this) for lower impulse pressed composite motors (using Vulcanite EB-75 propellant) for many years. Thus far they have never implemented it. They must think it's not a good route for their business. The Klima motors are apparently doing well in Europe. I was really hoping they'd export to U.S., and I suppose Aerotech/Quest examined that route but thought it best to make their motors here.
 

aerostadt

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I saw this ad, too, and thought is what is the advantage of a composite motor A or B motor that is 18 mm just like a black powder motor?
 

Kallahan11

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They are max NS for their class, the A is just under 10% more impulse than the Estes equivalent 18mm, the B is about 14% more impulse than the Estes B4 or B6
They have black smoke.
The A's and B's weight a tiny bit more than Este's, but that has to do with the casing, the C might weigh less and there is no equivalent to the D from estes in 18mm
They have very different thrust curve's, check them out at thrustcurve.org
Quest A3 http://www.thrustcurve.org/simfilesearch.jsp?id=2189
Quest B4 http://www.thrustcurve.org/simfilesearch.jsp?id=2191
for comparison.
Estes A8 http://www.thrustcurve.org/simfilesearch.jsp?id=1251
Estes B4 http://www.thrustcurve.org/simfilesearch.jsp?id=2100
Estes B6 http://www.thrustcurve.org/simfilesearch.jsp?id=875
 

Steve Shannon

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I saw this ad, too, and thought is what is the advantage of a composite motor A or B motor that is 18 mm just like a black powder motor?
Slightly less mass, more options for thrust profile, much less sensitive to temperature cycles.
On the down side BP motors smell better.
 

Winston

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I saw this ad, too, and thought is what is the advantage of a composite motor A or B motor that is 18 mm just like a black powder motor?
I'm looking at a D total impulse comparison because that's the only one I might be interested in. The D16 difference from an Estes D12: much faster thrust buildup, higher average thrust (16N vs 12N), lower mass (~25g vs 39.2-44.9g), cheaper at full retail prices (without doing a total impulse vs price comparison). Downside: considerably less total impulse (11.8Ns vs 16.84Ns), possibly more difficult to ignite, no booster (0s delay) version.

 

neil_w

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The D is really a baby D at best, which is a bit disappointing. Still could be a useful little motor though.

The C seems nice, very comparable in most ways to the C11 although a little lower max thrust. The rated liftoff weight of 5 oz seems disproportionately conservative, dunno what's up with that.
 

kuririn

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Got an e-mail today from RCS/Aerotech/Quest that my Q Jet order has shipped out! Can't wait to light these up.
 

Steve Shannon

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The q-jet motors have more total mass not less.
Interesting. That must be casing because the mass of propellant should be much less for the same total impulse.
Estes BP motors have a specific impulse around 60 s, whereas APCP motors typically have a specific impulse about three times that.
 
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