PMC? Kitbash? Clone?

Discussion in 'Oddrocs' started by kuririn, Feb 12, 2019.

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  1. Feb 12, 2019 #1

    kuririn

    kuririn

    kuririn

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    First, I saw this listed on JimZ's site, no plans or links
    5316 Space 1999: Eagle [​IMG] - - -
    My curiosity piqued, I found this on the Ninfinger website:
    http://www.ninfinger.org/rockets/catalogs/centuri76-3/763cen16.html
    Then I saw this eBay listing:
    http://rover.ebay.com/rover/1/711-5...0001&campid=5338413729&icep_item=183679895448
    AND, I remembered that I had this in my plastic model build pile:
    IMG_20190212_104241.jpg
    As well as a Fliskits Praetor with booster:
    IMG_20190212_104431.jpg
    So, are the rocket gods telling me something? I know that Daddyisabar flew an Eagle horizontally with streamers for drag stability. But has anybody cloned the Centuri kit and flown it vertically?


    Hmmmmmmm…………...
     
  2. Feb 12, 2019 #2

    GlenP

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    Looks like a good idea, definitely not an Impossible Mission, should you choose to accept it. (RIP Martin Landau)

    CometTV was airing Space 1999 recently, but I don’t think it is on the current schedule.
     
  3. Feb 13, 2019 #3

    grapetang

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    I love the Space:1999 Eagle Transporter design and had the kit as a kid. It was built but never flown and now completely lost. :( Cloning the polystyrene Eagle "nose cone" would be challenging in the past, but probably easier today (along with the ALCM).

    The Centuri Eagle was blow-molded and extremely light weight (body + 4x pods + engine pods & tanks + bottom thrusters). No tubing structure/spine. The MPC kit is probably heavier.

    My setup is still dismantled and I have too many sci-fi ideas to try but please do it! or someone do it!
     
  4. Feb 13, 2019 #4

    KenRico

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    This was my 2nd kit bought as a starter set in the 80s

    Launched my TIE fighter off the pad but never completed Eagle One as the styrene melted with glue beciming unusable.

    I know the nosecone has been available but would love to see a reproduction or upscale that i can finish assembling and then fly .

    Kenny
     
  5. Feb 17, 2019 #5

    kuririn

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    After ruminating about this for a while (or is it cogitating?), I did a dry fit of the model and weighed it.
    IMG_20190214_042115.jpg
    It came in at 4.1 oz. The Centuri Eagle module weighs 2.75-3 oz., per the catalog. And the only recommended engine is a C6.
    The good news is that there's more weight up front. The bad news is that a bigger motor is needed.
    So it looks like it would have to be a 24mm motor mount.
    Also, looks like the Centuri transport had smaller rear nozzles placed father apart so that a plastic nose block could be molded in to the rear and coupled to the main tube. Not possible with this model.
    I guess I could glue a nose block to the rear of this and fly it without the engine nozzles, but what would be the point?
    So I picked up a few small pieces of hardware from Home Depot and ordered a BT-50 nose block. When that arrives we'll see how everything comes together. In the meantime I'll build the model and work on some other projects that are stalled.
    To be continued.....
     
  6. Feb 18, 2019 #6

    rocketpunch

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    An 18mm D motor might be an option.
     
  7. Feb 18, 2019 #7

    GlenP

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    would a dowel fit in between the nozzles, then you could drill that into the balsa plug for whatever size body tube you wanted.
     
  8. Feb 18, 2019 #8

    kuririn

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    Looks like the original Centuri kit had an ST-9 tube for the main body. So if I leave out the 18mm motor mount I could fly it with BP Es, and Cs and Ds with spacer, and 18mm composites with adapter. Don't think the model can handle an F36 however.;)

    As they say, great minds think alike! But instead of a dowel I'm looking at a short length of threaded rod. I need the threads in order to make it removable for display.
     
  9. Feb 18, 2019 #9

    kuririn

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    Put together a "flight module", as Centuri calls it, to attach to the Transporter. Only dimensions I had were from the catalog, length of 11". No fin templates so I downsized the Fliskits Praetor fins to a BT-50 tube. Using EYEsim (or Open EYE?) this looks about right.
    IMG_20190218_131245.jpg
    Left a little over 1/4" open on the end of the tube for motor tape retention.
     
  10. Feb 19, 2019 #10

    Daddyisabar

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    I will tell Kidagain about this thread. He has built, modified and rebuilt the Centuri kit. That kit was light and your PMC is heavy so you will definitely need more motor as you are using the model as a nose cone. Done right you can get a recovery where the Eagle spins down to the ground just like the scene in the opening credits. I have seen it done once and it was cool.

    I was going to try the horizontal launch without streamers but have not worked up the courage and acquired another C 11 0

    I recall Kidagain using an E15 on his modified Centuri kit. 24mm is the way to go . 18mm would be the old AT reloadable D21 or SU D 24 if you can find one

    The progressive burn of the new Q jet D16 might not be the best but could be exciting.

    It would be cool to make the booster as bizarre as possible so it would look like something out of the second season of the show .
     
  11. Feb 19, 2019 #11

    kuririn

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  12. Feb 23, 2019 #12

    Daddyisabar

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    Yes. Clustered horizontal take off!
     
  13. Feb 24, 2019 #13

    kidagain

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    Kuririn,

    Spoke to Daddyisabar tonight about your project. Although your cloned booster looks great, I can't state enough that an 18mm is not enough to lift this off even in the most perfect of conditions. Daddy has been a witness a few times. I am assuming the model weight is similar to Centrui version. Furthermore, the eagle is just a big nosecone, so you will need to mod your kit to include the cone tube insert for parachute mounts if your going for the vertical lift. Regardless, make sure whatever you do make for a booster be sure the fins protrude far enough out to grab some lesser disturbed air for stability. I use punchy E engines to get it moving fast off the pad. I do have a open rocket file for this kit based on my booster mod. Please see images.
     

    Attached Files:

  14. Feb 24, 2019 #14

    kuririn

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    Thanks for your input, kidagain. If you see anything in the build that raises red flags, please feel free to alert me. I will absolutely be using 24mm motors for this brick.

    Well, the nose block arrived in the mail today, so I drilled a hole and attached the transporter mounting hardware.
    IMG_20190224_000749.jpg
    Need to get smaller washers, the ones I got were a hair too big for the BT-50 tube and didn't fit.

    Still need to cut a short length of BT-50 to make a shoulder for the block
    IMG_20190224_000655.jpg

    Drilled a hole in the rear plastic bulkhead
    IMG_20190224_002420.jpg
    And traced out a lite ply internal bulkhead
    IMG_20190224_001231.jpg
    Which will conveniently be epoxied to the two internal bumpouts in the rear of the transporter
    IMG_20190224_002659.jpg
    The transporter has been mostly assembled and base coated
    IMG_20190224_000608.jpg
    Except for the rear and small parts that need to be masked and painted off the rocket
    IMG_20190224_001218.jpg
    After painting I'll give everything a few days to completely dry and do the final assembly and decal work. See you then.
     
  15. Feb 25, 2019 #15

    kidagain

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    The original CG for the Centuri Kit is right at the top of the booster tube to the back of the tube insert on the Eagle. Booster length on kit was 10". So if you are going with 24 mm you will need to add some weight into the eagle cockpit as I did. I ended up using powered tungsten capped by Epoxy to get it right. This also means shifting the chute mount a bit forward. Once you get nose weight correct then you can hang test the eagle and find where the new CG. That will be your new attachment point for the chute line. You may want a slightly larger chute if you add weight to the PMC Eagle. I'd also recommend attaching carbon fiber rods the same the length of the trailing edge to strengthen. I chose to make the rods go TTW on the rebuild of the original design and it paid off. See attached image. Your fins looks close to original so you are good there. I do have the template for them if you need in the future. The real challenge with this kit is getting the chutes packed correctly in this small tube volume you are working with The 20" and 12" chutes will be snug along with the shockcord and dog-barf. Makes for some heart stopping moments at ejection. The original kit stand off is tall enough to clear the girders on top of the Eagle. I am willing to bet your standoff may be off center line even more do to the MPC Kit Detail. The Centuri Eagle measures 13" in length.
     

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  16. Feb 25, 2019 #16

    kidagain

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    One other thought is have you considered using a plastic nylon screw and bolt set-up? It will enable the CG to move farther forward giving you more stability. Less nose weight will be required as well if you chose this route. The catalogue and images in some of the online stuff that can be found were from early prototypes. So you can not trust all that was stated online or even the old materials scanned and uploaded.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2019
  17. Feb 25, 2019 #17

    kuririn

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    Thanks for that info!
    Prior to gluing the front section in, I calculated the difference in weights between the MPC kit and the Centuri transporter, as well as the difference between a D12 and C6 motor.
    Diff in wt. of transporters = 1.14 oz.
    Diff. in wt. of motors = .781 oz.
    So, if anything I expect the CG of this to be ahead of the Centuri model.
    This does not account for paint, epoxy and hardware which should bring it a smidge further forward.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2019
  18. Feb 25, 2019 #18

    kuririn

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    I used a metal threaded rod and nuts, should move the CG further forward than the lighter plastic.
     
  19. Feb 25, 2019 #19

    Ez2cDave

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    Gotta have a little "mood music" here . . .

     
  20. Feb 27, 2019 #20

    BABAR

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    Okay, here is a way to make just about anything into a rocket

    Take your fin unit above and put a ring fin around it

    https://www.rocketryforum.com/threa...-sight-240-calories-of-fun.47954/#post-466470

    The ring fin unit can serve as a stand for the rocket. You got a moon base rocket, print out a scene from the moon and put it on the ring fin. Or, in this case, style the ring fin as crater, with the rocket firing it out of the crater.

    The ring gives you tons of surface area to pull CP back, and you can move up the body tube size to go to 24 mm or more.

    Something of a limiting factor is stuffing your recovery chute into the rest of the rocket.
     
  21. Mar 13, 2019 #21

    kidagain

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    Hey did you all see the latest article in Sport Rocketry Magazine? Space 1999 Model Kit Conversion. Something in the air??
     
  22. Mar 13, 2019 #22

    kuririn

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    Haven't gotten mine yet, media mail takes forever to reach the islands. What does the article say?
     
  23. Mar 13, 2019 #23

    kuririn

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    Well, wasn't planning on doing an update yet but since I'm here, here goes:
    Full stack in flight mode:
    IMG_20190312_195722.jpg
    Display mode:
    IMG_20190312_202108.jpg
    Closeup of attachment hardware:
    IMG_20190312_195817.jpg IMG_20190312_200028.jpg IMG_20190312_200425.jpg IMG_20190312_200437.jpg
    Still need to fill/primer/paint flight module, attach a shoulder to the balsa block, rig recovery gear, attach landing feet and quad nozzles (decals need to be applied first since the pieces go over the decals), and clear coat the whole thing. Laters, gators.
     
  24. Mar 13, 2019 #24

    JERRYR708

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    I remember having that when I was a kid. It appeared really huge back then. I believe that mine might have been the toy version where all the pods disconnected and the side of the ship had a large door that opened up. There might have been action figures with the one I had. Would be awesome to see something like that capable of flying fairly decent.
     
  25. Mar 14, 2019 #25

    kidagain

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    Love that - Episode One Season One!!
     
  26. Mar 28, 2019 #26

    kuririn

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    Finally received the March/April issue of Sport Rocketry today in the mail. Read Matt Johnson's article on his MPC Eagle kitbash. He has a body tube going through the model up to the forward nose module, with a 24mm motor mount extension in the back and clear fins attached. He says it flew nicely on a D12-3, so I'm hopeful.
    In the meantime:

    Decal work
    IMG_20190328_052829.jpg
    The decals under the belly nozzles, landing pads, and quad verniers needed to be in place before cementing those on.
    Lots of decals, very tedious but getting there. Laters.
     
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  27. Apr 14, 2019 #27

    kuririn

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    Saw this listing on eBay yesterday:
    https://www.ebay.com/itm/Vintage-Ce...830157?hash=item469396958d:g:4xIAAOSwv4FcqMW7
    Hmmmm…. Maybe I should put this on eBay instead of launching it.

    …….……………………………………………………………...


    NAH


    I build to fly. Finishing the build:
    Glued a shoulder on the nose block
    Glued the launch lug and standoff to the body.
    Finished the decal work (what a PITA).
    Rigged the parachutes. Horizontal recovery for the Transporter. Standard for the flight module.
    Still, landing pads on legs are very spindly. Will probably break off on landing.
    Filled and primered the wood.
    Sprayed a flat black base coat on the flight module. Need to do some minor brush touch up on the nozzles.
    Time to light this candle. But not this weekend. Blustery conditions.
    Will post a video when I launch. Fingers crossed.
    0414190542.jpg 0414190546.jpg
    1555279396290.jpg 1555279266281.jpg

     
  28. Apr 24, 2019 #28

    BABAR

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    So engine and recovery device all in the flight module?
     
  29. Apr 24, 2019 #29

    kuririn

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    Yup, two parachutes. 12" for the module, 24" for the Eagle. Rigged for the Eagle to come down horizontally. Pretty much stock like the kit except for a slightly larger chute for the heavier transporter and no 18mm mount.
    Forecast is calm winds this Sunday so fingers crossed.
     
  30. Apr 24, 2019 #30

    Tobor

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    Good luck on Sunday. Plz post some flight pics.
     

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