Offshore activities?? (not gambling related of course)

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darisd

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Before you pass judgement, hear this out.

So I was at a work function with some fellow engineers, and in conversation it came up that I was into high-power rocketry. One of my colleagues immediately started asking me very detailed questions about what impulse I flew, altitudes, etc. I pointedly responded telling him he sounded knowledgeable, and he said it was a goal of his to place an object on the moon.

Now, this is not just "some dude at a bar", he is one of the most highly regarded engineers here, and he came straight out and said he rarely fails to achieve goals, but this one was just too hard. Others at the table mentioned that it should be easy, they have seen balloons on youtube at 140k ft. Both of us mentioned, almost in unison, that insertion into orbit requires guidance, which is strictly forbidden by the NAR and Tripoli here in the US.

So, another engineer (more casual and shoot-from-the-hip type) said "Why not just drive to Mexico, or better yet, launch from a boat"

Which I had to think about for a second. Ok, no way I am going to launch from Mexico, that's just insane. But the boat part. My response at the time was something to the effect of "well, you still have to comply with international accords with regards to allowable orbits, NTIA emission requirements..."

But the both of us, you could tell, were thinking the same thing. Licensure for a US spaceport is massively expensive, but a small boat is relatively cheap and operation costs could be shared at the club level. So what if? What are the legal roadblocks to going just far enough offshore? Would I never be able to come back without legal consequences? How far offshore is far enough? 12 nm? 200 nm? Are there airspace considerations? Who do I work with up to, say, 100k ft?

Information is sparse on the internet. I found this article in which some guy (John Gedmark) mentions only liability for collateral damage. Obviously, this would be a big concern with flight profiles exceeding, say, 50 kft if you were only 12 nm offshore, as a rocket that went wild towards land might have a chance of impacting onshore.

Just curious if anyone has played with this idea. It has been bugging me for weeks.
 
There are abandoned oilrig platforms in the Gulf of Mexico outside territorial limits. I've always thought one could be used for that purpose.
 
...insertion into orbit requires guidance, which is strictly forbidden by the NAR and Tripoli here in the US.

Exactly where is it prohibited by NAR or Tripoli? I have heard this claim from several people over the years, but nobody has EVER been able to cite the source.

What is prohibited is launching a rocket AT A TARGET.

As far as an orbital attempt, that would tend to indicate a multistage booster of some type. You will need to consider the trajectory of any spent stages or other hardware. and make sure that they don't fall back onto land.
 
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What is prohibited is launching a rocket AT A TARGET.

I guess it is semantics: what do you define as the target? Here, it is the moon. Or a highly elliptical LEO insertion orbit. Or the sun. Or the sky :)
 
If you take "at a target" to it's logical conclusion, it would make spot landing contests illegal...:D
 
If you take "at a target" to it's logical conclusion, it would make spot landing contests illegal...:D

True!

Assuming guidance was inertial only (perhaps GPS corrected) and the "target" was within a few degrees of vertical (until you were ready to move beyond 50k ft of course) I don't see why there would be a valid complaint.
 
I'm more interested in : where's he gonna get financial backing? This isn't a "hobby" project unless he's independently wealthy! Sounds cool, though!

If a club were into it, I could see the pull of a "rocket cruise". I bet you could get away with not owning the boat and just charter it once or twice a year for the club. Charge $300 a head just like they do for the weekend sport-fishing outings.

And heck, fish while you are out there.

Recovery would be tricky though. Would need a zodiac.
 
Sea Launch is the minimum size water launch system to get a payload to the moon. With a couple billion dollars of amateur funding it shouldn't be hard to duplcate, however getting the export license to take moon rocket technology out of the US. Priceless.

Actually would be way cheaper just of buy the launch.

Bob ;)
 
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