Neil
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I was just watching (yea, JUST WATCHING. I know its midnight, but I cant sleep very well these days... I ate something funny and it must have had dairy products in it, and my stomache isnt settled... Im lactose intolerant, so that makes for... Well... You get the idea. ) October Sky for like the billionth time, and I was pausing right in the middle of the big sequence of CATOs, and some of them it was quite obvious how they shot the failure, others not quite so... So I think this might be an interesting discussion topic...
First off... This has nothing to do with the CATO sequence, but it comes earlier in the movie, so I might as well have it first:
When they are building Auk 1 in the basement, they show them SODDERING the fins on... They might not have actually done this (its been a while since I read the book), but, with the metal tube, soddering fins on wouldent be very smart IMHO. There is not motor mount, and no paper lining, they just shoved the propellant in there with a big stick, in the movie at least. That would make the tube EXTREMELY hot. Im not too familar with soddering, but if the sodder melts on contact with the soddering iron... A metal tube with a $(#& load of rocket candy in it would get quite hot, wouldent it? You would think the fins would, in a manner of speaking, just melt away! If the propellant is hot enough to melt the washer they used for a nozzel, its certainly hot enough to melt the sodder holding the fins on, right? Either Homer Hickam didnt think his fin-attatchment methods through as thouroughly as we do now, or the movie makers screwed up big time...
Your thoughts? (yea, I can guess some of your thoughts... "Why the heck is this kid watching October Sky at midnight, and nit-picking Homer Hickam's early fin attatchment methods!?!?!" )
And now onto things having to do only with how the movie was shot:
#1. On the first or second launch mishap, a rocket goes land-sharking all over the place, flipping over about a dozen times.
Theres obviously a central motor similar to White Lighting, though it resembles the picture of the old Kosdon version that Ryan showed me one time... (im talking about the motors they used to film this, of course). But, while I was viewing it in slow-motion (gotta love this new VCR/DVD player... ), theres a second motor, with absolutely no flame at all... And very little smoke... An old AT E27, maybe? It was certainly small... Only the little smoke there was was coming out nearly perpindicular to the airframe, somewhere near the middle of the fin can section. It didnt look canted at all... Could they have stuck a motor straight into the tube at a 90 degree angle to the main motor? the reason I thought "E27" is, the motor would have to be small, with very little flame, but have enough power to cause the rocket to flip over and over and over. My guess is they were trying to make it look like the case had split, and it was thrusting out of two openings, nozzel and the crack, very similar to Craig Whittacres fatefull G75 flight last CMASS launch... He blew a hole in the side of the case, and the motor went MAD... A very different result than the movie version... It just made a few abrupt changes in direction, but never flipped... The movie version was going haywire, flipping over at least a dozen times..
Anyway, that was a very cool bit of filmmaking, however they did it! Kudos to whover made the film, they were pretty smart!
#2.
A few seconds after #1, a rocket pretty much chases them into a ditch and explodes... Is rocket-candy impact-sensitive like BP, so they could just shoot the rocket off a rail into the side of the hill, using trick photography as not to injure the actors, or did they use plastic explosives like in the LOTR FOTH Cave Troll sequence, where Legolas dodges the chain? (see LOTR special edition ) Again, a pretty cool bit of filming... But, I think they DID use seperate explosives seperate from the rocket... While I was watching it in slow-motion, I paused it right as the rocket hit... You can see the nose of the rocket maybe 4" into a huge fireball, the rest of the rocket is outside, without a scratch. If it were to explode on impact, wouldent the rocket be in the center of teh fireball? Tsk tsk tsk... Methinks they shot the rocket at a pile of things that go boom either at the press of a button, or when the rocket hits it. Its definetly NOT the body of the rocket that explodes, and if it were to explode, it would definetly be the body of teh rocket....
#3
In the final scene, where they shoot off the last rocket, they show the rocket lift off... (I thought "L850" for some reason... ) Then they cut to a different camera, showing the rocket going off into the sky... But it almost sounds as if another rocket motor ignited, though I am not sure if it was an airstart or a second stage... If it were an airstart, I might think it were a central L850 with two J350s airstarting... But if it were two staged, I would think a K550.... However they did it, the second motor(s) firing were a dead-givaway IMHO...
OK. Thats quite a rant, even for me, especially at 1:00 in the morning... Anyways, if you read this far, what do you think of all this? Dont get me wrong, I LOVE the movie (I have watched it about a billion times), but I just thought it would be an interesting topic to discuss...
Let the discussions begin!!!
First off... This has nothing to do with the CATO sequence, but it comes earlier in the movie, so I might as well have it first:
When they are building Auk 1 in the basement, they show them SODDERING the fins on... They might not have actually done this (its been a while since I read the book), but, with the metal tube, soddering fins on wouldent be very smart IMHO. There is not motor mount, and no paper lining, they just shoved the propellant in there with a big stick, in the movie at least. That would make the tube EXTREMELY hot. Im not too familar with soddering, but if the sodder melts on contact with the soddering iron... A metal tube with a $(#& load of rocket candy in it would get quite hot, wouldent it? You would think the fins would, in a manner of speaking, just melt away! If the propellant is hot enough to melt the washer they used for a nozzel, its certainly hot enough to melt the sodder holding the fins on, right? Either Homer Hickam didnt think his fin-attatchment methods through as thouroughly as we do now, or the movie makers screwed up big time...
Your thoughts? (yea, I can guess some of your thoughts... "Why the heck is this kid watching October Sky at midnight, and nit-picking Homer Hickam's early fin attatchment methods!?!?!" )
And now onto things having to do only with how the movie was shot:
#1. On the first or second launch mishap, a rocket goes land-sharking all over the place, flipping over about a dozen times.
Theres obviously a central motor similar to White Lighting, though it resembles the picture of the old Kosdon version that Ryan showed me one time... (im talking about the motors they used to film this, of course). But, while I was viewing it in slow-motion (gotta love this new VCR/DVD player... ), theres a second motor, with absolutely no flame at all... And very little smoke... An old AT E27, maybe? It was certainly small... Only the little smoke there was was coming out nearly perpindicular to the airframe, somewhere near the middle of the fin can section. It didnt look canted at all... Could they have stuck a motor straight into the tube at a 90 degree angle to the main motor? the reason I thought "E27" is, the motor would have to be small, with very little flame, but have enough power to cause the rocket to flip over and over and over. My guess is they were trying to make it look like the case had split, and it was thrusting out of two openings, nozzel and the crack, very similar to Craig Whittacres fatefull G75 flight last CMASS launch... He blew a hole in the side of the case, and the motor went MAD... A very different result than the movie version... It just made a few abrupt changes in direction, but never flipped... The movie version was going haywire, flipping over at least a dozen times..
Anyway, that was a very cool bit of filmmaking, however they did it! Kudos to whover made the film, they were pretty smart!
#2.
A few seconds after #1, a rocket pretty much chases them into a ditch and explodes... Is rocket-candy impact-sensitive like BP, so they could just shoot the rocket off a rail into the side of the hill, using trick photography as not to injure the actors, or did they use plastic explosives like in the LOTR FOTH Cave Troll sequence, where Legolas dodges the chain? (see LOTR special edition ) Again, a pretty cool bit of filming... But, I think they DID use seperate explosives seperate from the rocket... While I was watching it in slow-motion, I paused it right as the rocket hit... You can see the nose of the rocket maybe 4" into a huge fireball, the rest of the rocket is outside, without a scratch. If it were to explode on impact, wouldent the rocket be in the center of teh fireball? Tsk tsk tsk... Methinks they shot the rocket at a pile of things that go boom either at the press of a button, or when the rocket hits it. Its definetly NOT the body of the rocket that explodes, and if it were to explode, it would definetly be the body of teh rocket....
#3
In the final scene, where they shoot off the last rocket, they show the rocket lift off... (I thought "L850" for some reason... ) Then they cut to a different camera, showing the rocket going off into the sky... But it almost sounds as if another rocket motor ignited, though I am not sure if it was an airstart or a second stage... If it were an airstart, I might think it were a central L850 with two J350s airstarting... But if it were two staged, I would think a K550.... However they did it, the second motor(s) firing were a dead-givaway IMHO...
OK. Thats quite a rant, even for me, especially at 1:00 in the morning... Anyways, if you read this far, what do you think of all this? Dont get me wrong, I LOVE the movie (I have watched it about a billion times), but I just thought it would be an interesting topic to discuss...
Let the discussions begin!!!