New to High Power / Loc Patriot

[pedzola]

New member here. I built a lot of Estes models as a kid and now looking to try out something a little bigger.

As my first step back into model rockets I carefully built an Estes Patriot and then my first "mid power" kit, a Loc Patriot 2.6"



The loc kit was a learning experience. With a little help from some online videos I think it came together well. The included instructions were not helpful for a newbie. Used wood glue throughout and 3oz weight epoxied into the nose with a through-rod. Also added rail buttons and a chute protector. My first time using bondo, the red stuff in small tube from walmart, works excellent. Finishing has never been my forte.

Already looking forward to a bigger kit (maybe not a patriot - thinking a loc iroc) to get my level 1. Only problem now is finding a place to fly. I am in New Hampshire, any tips welcome. Not many options for high power clubs up here. There is a new group that will fly off the frozen Lake Winnipesaukee in the winter, but would rather not wait til then!

I ordered a Jolly Logic chute release for the patriot. If i need to fly from a smaller field that should help. I also got a 24" parachute for it - it came with an 18." Online chute calculators would lead me to believe i need something north of 30", but if loc thinks 18 is ok I will split the diff and try 24.

So hopefully I can find a place to fly. Looking forward to seeing a launch and getting into the next build. Thankful for the resources here on the forum.

Appreciate any feedback.

 

[YodaMcFly]

Nice looking rockets, and welcome back to the hobby.

 

[dr wogz]

Looks good! experience builds with practice!!

Where in New Hampshire? A few hours drive and you'll be at our field: www.CRMRC.org

 

[pedzola]

Where in New Hampshire? A few hours drive and you'll be at our field: www.CRMRC.org

Looks like 3 hours from me here in Southern NH. That would be a lot of driving in one day. But thanks for the heads up. Will have to keep an eye open for regional events.

 

[John Beans]

Once you get comfortable with bundling your chute for Chute Release so that it inflates quickly (that can take some practice, at first it may take 150 feet to open unless you modify your usually style), you can choose a lower release altitude and larger chute, for softer landings.

Usually you'd choose the smallest chute you could get away with to avoid drift, but with delayed deployment you can land it soft down low, and save some fin breakage.

Release altitude doesn't change the landing speed, unless of course your chute never inflates!

 

[pedzola]

Thanks for the insight! Cant wait to try out the chute release. Hoping for first launch 4th of July weekend. Will report back!

 

[pyrobob]

Nice finish on those Patriot's!

 

[YodaMcFly]

I love the Chute Release so much, I'm currently on number 4 ... And Jolly Logic's (John Beans') customer support is outstanding.

Due to the conditions at my regular field, I have settled on 300' as a good altitude; of course, YMMV.

 

[pedzola]

Launched the patriot twice yesterday with no issue. Nice straight and stable flights, recovered without damage. Flight 1, the chute release worked perfect and chute deployed at 200 feet. 2nd flight, chute released on ejection, but still recovered the rocket close to launch pad due to very calm conditions. Not sure what happened on 2nd flight, maybe it wasnt fastened correctly around the chute, I had loaded it up pretty quickly for flight # 2. Probably user error.

 

[YodaMcFly]

Congrats; looks like a nice flight. As for the 2nd flight, the chute release is " ... terribly unforgiving of any carelessness, incapacity or neglect."

Take your time setting it up. Follow John's instructions on folding the chute. Make sure the laundry's not too tight in the airframe. Make sure the CR is attached in some way (don't ask how I lost JLCR #3). Test the release (you know it has a test mode, right?).

 

[GalantVR41062]

Yes fallow the instructions and ground test the best you can. I have found if the rubber band does not have enough tension the pin may not release right away, don't forget vent holes in the air frame.

~John

 

[Kosmo]

Congrats on the launches and welcome back to the hobby. I love my chute release, but it does have it's foibles. Based on experience I would recommend erring on the side of releasing too high rather than low. Especially on bigger rockets I've set it for release at 300' and white knuckled it until the parachute fully inflated about 50' above ground. I usually go 500' now on the big ones.

Regarding premature release: I used to have the problem of the chute deploying right at ejection, it would happen about 1/3 of the time. It didn't seem to be an issue of stress, the device was never damaged, and the elastic never broke, it seemed like it was just releasing too early. I tried drilling small vent holes into the body (kind of like you would for high altitude flights for pressure stabilization--but with smaller holes) and since I started doing that I've never had a problem with premature release. Perhaps with the vent holes the chute release barometer more accurately senses ambient air pressure--which it can't do in an unvented body tube.

 

[pedzola]

Body tube has no vents, so perhaps that contributed to the issue on flight #2, releasing chute on ejection.

In any case, had a lot of fun finally flying this rocket after a careful (i.e., drawn-out) build. Very happy with the results, no damage at all on 2 flights. The chute release will be more critical for higher flights in the future. Im sure it will work perfect if I do my part to prep correctly. The 200ft release on flight 1 was excellent.

Now I need to find a larger kit for L-1, probably to fly this coming winter. Thinking maybe the Loc I-Roc. Or, maybe just another bigger patriot!

 

[YodaMcFly]

The rocket that I've flown the most with the CR, which I call "Flowbee" (also my L1 rocket), doesn't have "altimeter" vent holes in the booster section, but it does have a "pressure relief" vent (just one, relatively small hole, just to keep pressure differential from causing early separation), and it has never had a pressure-related problem with the CR. So, short version, don't go crazy with static ports just for the CR.



As for what to use for L1 ... You can't go wrong with LOC. Depending on budget, how much you enjoy building v. flying, etc, it wouldn't be a bad idea to look for something with a 38mm mount, that could handle a "J", but is still light enough to fly on an "H"; that would let you do both flights with one rocket ... Hmm, the I-Roc would work for that.

 

[bclark989]

As for what to use for L1 ... You can't go wrong with LOC. Depending on budget, how much you enjoy building v. flying, etc, it wouldn't be a bad idea to look for something with a 38mm mount, that could handle a "J", but is still light enough to fly on an "H"; that would let you do both flights with one rocket ... Hmm, the I-Roc would work for that.

My first L1 rocket was a LOC Hi-Tech. Great size to work on, 38mm mount, can't recommend it enough. I only didn't get that cert because it drifted too far. This was before the JLCR was a thing, the wind was up, and I flew it on an I55...lesson learned.

Another great option is Binder Design, and more recently, SBR / Fusion Rocket. These are the opposite end of the spectrum in terms of assembly instructions and what comes bundled with the kit.

 

[YodaMcFly]

My first L1 rocket was a LOC Hi-Tech. Great size to work on, 38mm mount, can't recommend it enough. I only didn't get that cert because it drifted too far. This was before the JLCR was a thing, the wind was up, and I flew it on an I55...lesson learned.

Another great option is Binder Design, and more recently, SBR / Fusion Rocket. These are the opposite end of the spectrum in terms of assembly instructions and what comes bundled with the kit.

I did my L2 with a Binder Excel, with DD. I've flown it on "I" and "J" motors.

I know a guy that tried to use an SBR Fusion for both. His L1 flight was perfect, and his L2 would have been perfect were it not for the CATO. I'm very interested in the SBR Thor.

 

[Handeman]

My first L1 rocket was a LOC Hi-Tech. Great size to work on, 38mm mount, can't recommend it enough. I only didn't get that cert because it drifted too far. This was before the JLCR was a thing, the wind was up, and I flew it on an I55...lesson learned.

Another great option is Binder Design, and more recently, SBR / Fusion Rocket. These are the opposite end of the spectrum in terms of assembly instructions and what comes bundled with the kit

As for what to use for L1 ... You can't go wrong with LOC. Depending on budget, how much you enjoy building v. flying, etc, it wouldn't be a bad idea to look for something with a 38mm mount, that could handle a "J", but is still light enough to fly on an "H"; that would let you do both flights with one rocket ... Hmm, the I-Roc would work for that.

As bclark989 and YodaMcFly recommended, go with something with a 38mm MMT for your L1. With 38mm you can fly the full range of L1 motors. I would recommend something like the LOC ISIS or some other rocket that will fly to an altitude that works on your field when flown on large I motors. You can add a JLCR for higher flights or add a LOC payload tube and electronics bay if you want to start doing dual deploy later.

Good Luck