Mid power to L1 cert transition rocket suggestions?

[4regt4]

(Perhaps this should be in HPR, but as it will be used mostly for MPR, I'm posting here.)

I'm looking to build a rocket that can be used as a "daily driver", park flyer on F to G (possibly E) motors, but won't go stupid high on an H for a L1 cert attempt. Sirius has the Eradicator, which looks to stay under 2000' on an H, but usable on smaller motors. I'm wanting to keep things simple for an L1 rocket, to not temp Murphy. So motor ejection, etc.

I'm not crazy about the looks of the Eradicator, I'm looking for something perhaps a bit more traditional. To keep within my specs, the rocket will probably have to be a bit "draggy". My Estes Executioner is a good example, despite being reasonably light, it won't get out of it's own shadow on an E. Perhaps I should sim a 29mm Executioner on F through H, but I suspect it may not work.

Hans.

 

[Scott_650]

(Perhaps this should be in HPR, but as it will be used mostly for MPR, I'm posting here.)

I'm looking to build a rocket that can be used as a "daily driver", park flyer on F to G (possibly E) motors, but won't go stupid high on an H for a L1 cert attempt. Sirius has the Eradicator, which looks to stay under 2000' on an H, but usable on smaller motors. I'm wanting to keep things simple for an L1 rocket, to not temp Murphy. So motor ejection, etc.

I'm not crazy about the looks of the Eradicator, I'm looking for something perhaps a bit more traditional. To keep within my specs, the rocket will probably have to be a bit "draggy". My Estes Executioner is a good example, despite being reasonably light, it won't get out of it's own shadow on an E. Perhaps I should sim a 29mm Executioner on F through H, but I suspect it may not work.

Hans.

The 29mm version of the Balsa Machining 3” School Rocket with the extended airframe and payload bay options would be a good choice and it’s fairly inexpensive. Any of Scott Binder’s 3” rockets from his new Fusion Rocket company would be solid choices though it might take a full F to fly one fully optioned with a payload bay and altimeter mount.

 

[Spitfire222]

Perhaps a 2.6" cardboard Madcow DX3?

 

[Antares JS]

The LOC Deployer is great if you're interested in dual deploy at all. Flies well on 29mm G's and H's.

 

[4regt4]

The LOC Deployer is great if you're interested in dual deploy at all. Flies well on 29mm G's and H's.

Dual deploy..... In the future. For now, it's baby steps. I'd like to keep this one on motor ejection.

Edit: Oops, I looked at the wrong rocket. Forget the folloiwing: I'll have to sim it, but the Deployer is listed at only 15oz. It might be a bit too high on a G or especially H.:

Hans.

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[4regt4]

Perhaps a 2.6" cardboard Madcow DX3?

Might work.... Sub 1000' on an F, mid 1000' on a G. They don't list usage on an H, but perhaps I'll see what a sim shows.

 

[4regt4]

The LOC Athena is listed as using F through I. But they don't show estimated altitudes, so it looks like I have to warm up the laptop containing OpenRocket.

 

[Antares JS]

Dual deploy..... In the future. For now, it's baby steps. I'd like to keep this one on motor ejection.

Edit: Oops, I looked at the wrong rocket. Forget the folloiwing: I'll have to sim it, but the Deployer is listed at only 15oz. It might be a bit too high on a G or especially H.:

Hans.

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In that case... perhaps the PML Bumblebee. Has a 38mm motor mount but flies just fine on 29mm G's with a short delay and an adapter. I don't think I would want to try it on an F though.

 

[rocketgeek101]

Might work.... Sub 1000' on an F, mid 1000' on a G. They don't list usage on an H, but perhaps I'll see what a sim shows.

I guy in my club likes to fly his 2.6" DX3 loaded down with dual deploy electronics etc on G's. Goes pretty high... an H might be pushing it without some form of dual deploy or tracking. I would look for something 3" in diameter or bigger.

 

[rocketgeek101]

Something like the LOC Forte might be ideal for your needs: https://locprecision.com/collections/rockets-3-1-diameter/products/forte

 

[4regt4]

The 29mm version of the Balsa Machining 3” School Rocket with the extended airframe and payload bay options would be a good choice and it’s fairly inexpensive. Any of Scott Binder’s 3” rockets from his new Fusion Rocket company would be solid choices though it might take a full F to fly one fully optioned with a payload bay and altimeter mount.

I'm not finding a 3" School Rocket on Balsa Machining website. Is it listed somewhere else?

 

[4regt4]

Something like the LOC Forte might be ideal for your needs: https://locprecision.com/collections/rockets-3-1-diameter/products/forte

Yes, I actually had that page open on my screen. I think it might be "too much", as it's fairly light. They list flights to 3880', but don't say what motor that is on. I'd like to be able to fly 24mm F and G with an adapter, which is probably a stretch in a rocket with a 38mm tube. And max out around 2000' on a small H.

 

[DigBaddy]

4" T-LOC? https://locprecision.com/collections/rockets-4-00-diameter/products/t-loc-4

 

[jmasterj]

I'm not finding a 3" School Rocket on Balsa Machining website. Is it listed somewhere else?

I think the nose comes have become unavailable and therefore the kit is unavailable. I can't find it either.

 

[dhbarr]

Der Big Red Max would go fine on an H97, H115, H123, H135 or similar, and should do fine with a Chute Release. I'd probably get the Plywood Upgrade in case of a hard landing.

 

[4regt4]

4" T-LOC? https://locprecision.com/collections/rockets-4-00-diameter/products/t-loc-4

This has possibilities. 29mm motor. Only real concern is if/when I try for L1, the stabilizers on the tips of the fins could break. Which would be a bummer. Perhaps if I reinforce the crap out of them....

Hans.

 

[jmasterj]

This has possibilities. 29mm motor. Only real concern is if/when I try for L1, the stabilizers on the tips of the fins could break. Which would be a bummer. Perhaps if I reinforce the crap out of them....

Hans.

They'll be fine.

 

[4regt4]

Der Big Red Max would go fine on an H97, H115, H123, H135 or similar, and should do fine with a Chute Release. I'd probably get the Plywood Upgrade in case of a hard landing.

I have an unbuilt DBRM, and I think I have the plywood bits laying around somewhere. I think I was assuming it would be overwhelmed by an H. Estes lists altitude at 1100' on an F15, so I'll have to sim this on other choices. Shouldn't be hard to find an OpenRocket file on this one.

I'd like to use an AT 24/40 for most uses and go with single use 29mm motors for the few times I'll go bigger. An L1 would likely mean getting a 29/180 mount, which means I'd no longer need the SU G motors.

Hans.

 

[boatgeek]

One of my TARC students is using a LOC Forte for a cert flight shortly. It's around 2500-3000' on a small to medium H. I think it was about 750g all up, so an F42 should lift it OK. As far as adapting, it might be worth building a 38mm-24mm adapter out of some scrap tube and a few centering rings. You could also ask LOC if they could give it to you in a 29mm motor mount as a custom item.

Really, any rocket with a 29mm motor mount 2.6" and above would be fine for the task, especially if your plan is to get your L1 on a baby H and then build a bigger one later to fly the full range of H and I. For something like the Deployer, you could check a sim to see if it would fly without the payload bay--just stick the nose cone right to the fin can.

 

[mikec]

Might work.... Sub 1000' on an F, mid 1000' on a G. They don't list usage on an H, but perhaps I'll see what a sim shows.

My cardboard DX3 built stock goes to about 1800 feet on a G64, 2500 feet on an H128 and 3300 feet on an H180. I like to put a tracker in for the H motors.

 

[dhbarr]

I have an unbuilt DBRM, and I think I have the plywood bits laying around somewhere. I think I was assuming it would be overwhelmed by an H. Estes lists altitude at 1100' on an F15, so I'll have to sim this on other choices. Shouldn't be hard to find an OpenRocket file on this one.

I'd like to use an AT 24/40 for most uses and go with single use 29mm motors for the few times I'll go bigger. An L1 would likely mean getting a 29/180 mount, which means I'd no longer need the SU G motors.

Hans.

Baby H's should be absolutely no problem -- lots of HazMat-free G options in 29/40-120 as well.

 

[4regt4]

One of my TARC students is using a LOC Forte for a cert flight shortly. It's around 2500-3000' on a small to medium H. I think it was about 750g all up, so an F42 should lift it OK. As far as adapting, it might be worth building a 38mm-24mm adapter out of some scrap tube and a few centering rings. You could also ask LOC if they could give it to you in a 29mm motor mount as a custom item.

Really, any rocket with a 29mm motor mount 2.6" and above would be fine for the task, especially if your plan is to get your L1 on a baby H and then build a bigger one later to fly the full range of H and I. For something like the Deployer, you could check a sim to see if it would fly without the payload bay--just stick the nose cone right to the fin can.

I think that's a bit over my targets. I'd like to keep it around 2000' on a baby H.

Hans,

 

[4regt4]

Baby H's should be absolutely no problem -- lots of HazMat-free G options in 29/40-120 as well.

Happened to already have an OpenRocket sim file. Put in a very arbitrary selection of motors from each class. Goes over 400' on a BP E, and up to 2000' on an H128. So it's truly a flexi-flier.

I'm going to find files on the other suggestions as well. This is an interesting search.....

Hans.

 

[Scott_650]

I'm not finding a 3" School Rocket on Balsa Machining website. Is it listed somewhere else?

I hadn’t looked at the BMS site for awhile - both the small SR and the 3” 24mm and 29mm versions are gone. If they’re gone for good that’s a real shame because those were very nice, basic kits

 

[Scott_650]

This has possibilities. 29mm motor. Only real concern is if/when I try for L1, the stabilizers on the tips of the fins could break. Which would be a bummer. Perhaps if I reinforce the crap out of them....

Hans.

One of our club members has flown a 4” T-Loc on some pretty spicy motors with no damage to the finlets. I have an unbuilt 4” T-Loc and some extra body tube that I’m planning on building for DD with no worries about the strength of the finlets - YMMV

 

[4regt4]

One of our club members has flown a 4” T-Loc on some pretty spicy motors with no damage to the finlets. I have an unbuilt 4” T-Loc and some extra body tube that I’m planning on building for DD with no worries about the strength of the finlets - YMMV

Didn't mean damage from high thrust, I was concerned with the landing! Our club field has a very rocky landing area, and the place I'd most likely try for L1 is a desert with sagebrush. I've broken fins at both locations, but on rockets that are admittedly less robust.

Hans.

 

[Dave Pritts]

You might consider the 3" LOC IRIS. Simple to fly, easy to build, and a pretty robust rocket.
Fly mine on G & H motors. Best of luck with your certification.

 

[Scott_650]

Didn't mean damage from high thrust, I was concerned with the landing! Our club field has a very rocky landing area, and the place I'd most likely try for L1 is a desert with sagebrush. I've broken fins at both locations, but on rockets that are admittedly less robust.

Hans.

Ah, that could be a concern - we fly off a working farm, so the tilled fields can be hard but otherwise fairly soft. What’s worse is when the corn is over 6 foot!

 

[pathtouch]

I have a 54mm LOC Nuke Pro Maxx that was tons of fun. Flew on a few motors ranging from F29 to H133. You could probably modify it to be a little shorter and lighter to work better with lower impulse motors. The F29 on a 6 ft rod was barely stable unless it was dead calm.

 

[David_Stack]

Sounds like you are looking for something reminiscent of one of the original Estes Pro Series kits... A number of model rocket hobbyists got their L1 using models like the Partizon, Scion, and especially the Leviathan. Estes discontinued the line, but at least one enthusiast is producing clones of those models and selling via that auction site under the seller name/ID "jbassham".

In addition, the folks who run Launch Lab Rocketry offer up a 'conversion kit' to allow you to recreate the Leviathan using a Estes Big Daddy as the starting point. https://www.launchlabrocketry.com/shop/p/estesleviathanbigdaddyconversionkit