Maybe plastic fins and nose cones aren't so bad after all...

[MacTech]

I admit it, I'm a Luddite, an old-school traditional rocketeer, growing up as a child of the 1980's, all my Estes rockets were paper body tube and balsa nose cone/fin construction, the only real variable was streamer vs. chute, and I leaned towards streamer, as it made losing the rocket to the Sky Gods less likely, even as a kid I hated losing rockets, I lost enough to lose interest in the hobby until a few months ago...

so, my mind has been firmly entrenched in the mindset of Balsa Good, plastic BAD!

the predominance of plastic in the E2X kits didn't help either, too simple to build, gimme some challenge here

so, I'd be lying if I said I was disappointed with how common the plastics have gotten, most kits I've seen or handled have a plastic nose cone, and balsa fins, where's my traditional balsa kits, darn it (and get off my lawn while you're at it! )

recently, when playing around in OpenRocket it hit me, a big advantage of plastics in model rockets...

plastic is *heavier* than balsa!, for some reason I always thought that balsa was heavier...

as I'm a fan of "slow and low" flights, weight is a good thing in my rockets, it keeps them from flying too high and escaping, a well designed set of plastic fins and nose cone is a simple way to add weight to a rocket and slow it down, plus, it's less prone to denting and dings

dont get me wrong, I'm still a Balsa guy, and given a choice between identical kits, one with all balsa and paper tube construction, and one with plastics , I'd take the all balsa kit every time, but I don't feel the need to hate plastic fin/nose cone kits anymore...

that said, I reserve the right to still hate RTF and E2X kits, they're too simple, too easy, no challenge to build, to get to know your creation, they have no personality, soul, or presence, they just *are*

 

[KenECoyote]

...that said, I reserve the right to still hate RTF and E2X kits, they're too simple, too easy, no challenge to build, to get to know your creation, they have no personality, soul, or presence, they just *are*

I love working with wood kits and building things (and over-building things ); however I'll have to say that an E2X kit got me started on this great hobby. Some love the build aspect, some love the launch aspect and some love both. I love that we can choose what we want (sorry K'Tesh!). :grin:

 

[KennB]

MacTech, if you'd like to get back to balsa, check out Fliskits.
Great designs and lots of them.

 

[MALBAR 70]

I always keep a few E2X kits in my build pile for those times when I just want to build a rocket in one sitting. It helps to break up long, tedious builds too.

I'll second Ken on Fliskits. Real builders kits, all balsa and paper.

 

[KenECoyote]

If you really want to go "deep woods", get a plan pack from TLP (The Launch Pad). It gives you directions on rolling your own MMT and even body tubes (at least for the AMRAAM AIM 120A). I'd love to do that one day...rocket from scratch. Yes, I am a man of extremes. :wink:

 

[Cabernut]

For your balsa fix, the Estes Phoenix Bird has balsa fins, solid balsa nose block/coupler and balsa nose cone. And it's one of their clearance items.

My preference is plastic for the nose cone. Won't get dinged up. However the fins must be wood of some sort. I don't like plastic fins at all either. If I wanted more weight & drag, I'd go with thick basswood fins instead. Just my :2:

 

[EXPjawa]

I like using balsa for a lot of reasons too, but I'm migrating away for fins (to basswood) just for strength reasons. The balsa I can buy locally pales compared to the harder grade stock that Estes uses, so it has to at least be papered to hold up. I do like balsa for nose cones, but I get frustrated with how easy it gets dinged and gouged. OTOH, with the increasing availability of 3D printed plastic, I've really been reevaluating my take here. The simple fact that I can potentially print more complex, detailed parts that I simply wouldn't be able to easily do with wood is very appealing. I've also been thinking about 3D printing fins or other detail parts for certain applications, again, because it opens up possibilities that simply didn't exist before.

 

[KenECoyote]

Good point about using plastic in place of balsa in order to add weight...I also thought balsa nose cones were heavier, but I have very few and never compared.

However LP rockets, balsa fins may slow down the rocket more (which is what you're aiming for) or be the same as plastic since the plastic fins, while likely heavier, usually have tapered leading edges and are thinner. Just a guess.

 

[neil_w]

dont get me wrong, I'm still a Balsa guy, and given a choice between identical kits, one with all balsa and paper tube construction, and one with plastics , I'd take the all balsa kit every time, but I don't feel the need to hate plastic fin/nose cone kits anymore...

that said, I reserve the right to still hate RTF and E2X kits, they're too simple, too easy, no challenge to build, to get to know your creation, they have no personality, soul, or presence, they just *are*

I'm not quite sure I grasp your ongoing use of the word "hate" with regard to RTF and E2X kits. They serve a very useful purpose in the hobby. No one is forcing you to buy them.

I built a few E2X kits with my daughter, and we've had a good time with them. I have 0% chance of getting her to work with me on any real builder's kits.

I've even thought about about picking up an E2X or two just to fill a couple of gaps in my lineup, which I could then fly aggressively without caring too much about losing them.

However LP rockets, balsa fins may slow down the rocket more (which is what you're aiming for) or be the same as plastic since the plastic fins, while likely heavier, usually have tapered leading edges and are thinner. Just a guess.

The plastic fins (and especially 1-piece plastic fin cans):
a) are always perfectly straight
b) have very small cross section and are very smooth
c) are really strong, you're gonna lose them before you break them

So they may not be much fun to build but they sure do fly.

 

[Flyfalcons]

My daughter sure likes the E2X and ARF rockets. I let her pick any kit from the wall the other day. I think she was pretty happy with her selection. And yes, the plastic fin cans make for consistently straight flights.

 

[neil_w]

Great smile!!! (And great avatar)

 

[KenECoyote]

My daughter sure likes the E2X and ARF rockets. I let her pick any kit from the wall the other day. I think she was pretty happy with her selection. And yes, the plastic fin cans make for consistently straight flights.

Awww...how can anyone not like that?

 

[GlenP]

I was surprised to get an Emerald Streak E2X kit as a present from my son for Christmas. These are typically on the shelves at Michael's. We built it together in one day and were able to fly it the next. No painting required. I have been waiting out the rainy weather for getting some other kits painted for quite a while, the Scorpion and Lynx shown in the picture above were just finally finished after several months.

Photographs and the face card just don't do the Emerald Streak justice, the reflective sparkly wrap (green upper body tube is pre-wrapped and is actually a payload section and a great place for an altimeter) is really quite brilliant on the shelf, on the pad, and in the air. If I were to paint anything on this rocket, it might be the nose cone black to match the fins. The fin can is internal, integral with the engine mount, and the fins are TTW with pre-cut slots in the body tube, very nice and strong construction. It is a great small field flier on a B engine, it would probably do well on a C with no wind or a streamer instead of the stock chute. It has it's place for sure, a very kid-friendly rocket, for kids of all ages. Variety is the spice of model rocketry.

 

[hcmbanjo]

While I am usually a "build" guy, I've learned to appreciate a well designed plastic fin can.
If the plastic is high impact and flexible there are no repairs!

 

[MacTech]

Perhaps "hate" was too strong a word, after all, the kits are generally solid and they fly well, there's just no sense of "soul" with an E2X kit, technically competent, yes, but lacking in "personality"

its roughly akin to automatic vs manual transmission in cars, or Glock vs. 1911 in handguns, Mac vs Windows
(Manual/1911/Mac for me, thanks )

and good points above about keeping a few on hand to satisfy quick builds or getting kids hooked on rocketry....

incidentally, my biggest surprise recently was my attempt to deliberately lose my Mini Amazon (E2X Amazon with one body tube, leftover parts from my second Tandem X launch kit...

i shoved a C6-5 in it, and launched it, expecting the Sky Gods to take it, imagine my surprise when it had a Bertha-esque slow-ish liftoff, a perfect climb to apogee, and a smooth, if overly long descent (19" rocket under an 18" chute with the biggest spill hole cut in it), I have to admit, I was impressed by the little scrapper, it's earned the right to be repainted and is a valued part of my fleet, a beater no longer...