Dude, Tim goes to Red Glare every year!! Place a good order for what you think you will fly the next season with Tim during the holidays sales and put in the message box "Delivery to Red Glare" and then pick it up. No shipping, no hazmat.
Loki Research Motors/Cases
- Thread starter G's Monster Rocket
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Dude, Tim goes to Red Glare every year!! Place a good order for what you think you will fly the next season with Tim during the holidays sales and put in the message box "Delivery to Red Glare" and then pick it up. No shipping, no hazmat.
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I love my Loki stuff.
The non-hazmat 38mm loads up to J from Loki make ordering just a few loads economical versus paying for shipping Aerotech. If you fly 38mm stuff, and don't like having to buy a bunch of stuff at once, that's a big plus.
Loki also makes the largest 38mm and 54mm motors available. Multiple 38mm K motors and a 54mm M, plus the largest 54mm L motors.
Research is easier with snap ring cases, since fewer parts are single use. (Arguably better for the environment...)
Loki has a better reliability than Aerotech or (shudder) CTI.
And I just love Loki cocktail motors.
All that said, I still fly Aerotech, too. Why?
29mm and smaller motors.
More commonly available.
More propellant options.
More case options.
I can get them on sale.
And it's what I started with back in the day.
Most of the launches I attend do not have a reliable vendor. And I don't fly enough to justify a big order with any regularity. If I want a 38mm motor for an upcoming launch that I don't already have in my stash, it's order a Loki motor. I stock up on larger Loki motors when I see a vendor with them at launches, and put in an Aerotech order online less than once a year.
The non-hazmat 38mm loads up to J from Loki make ordering just a few loads economical versus paying for shipping Aerotech. If you fly 38mm stuff, and don't like having to buy a bunch of stuff at once, that's a big plus.
Loki also makes the largest 38mm and 54mm motors available. Multiple 38mm K motors and a 54mm M, plus the largest 54mm L motors.
Research is easier with snap ring cases, since fewer parts are single use. (Arguably better for the environment...)
Loki has a better reliability than Aerotech or (shudder) CTI.
And I just love Loki cocktail motors.
All that said, I still fly Aerotech, too. Why?
29mm and smaller motors.
More commonly available.
More propellant options.
More case options.
I can get them on sale.
And it's what I started with back in the day.
Most of the launches I attend do not have a reliable vendor. And I don't fly enough to justify a big order with any regularity. If I want a 38mm motor for an upcoming launch that I don't already have in my stash, it's order a Loki motor. I stock up on larger Loki motors when I see a vendor with them at launches, and put in an Aerotech order online less than once a year.
If not retail $ for AT, what then?
Neutronium95
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Multiple vendors offer 10% off everything. Balsa Machining will do 25% off on reloads and DMS motors if you preorder, which means a 4-6 week wait. The Wildman Wednesday sale this year was 32% off for club members, and motors will ship early 2023. You can always find Aerotech below MSRP, and if you are willing to wait, or especially if you save up for a big sale you can get stuff for significantly below MSRP.
Edit: That said, if I didn't live in California, I would definitely fly Loki on occasion. Lots of good non Hazmat 38mm motors, and some truly remarkable motors in larger sizes. I haven't yet flown one, but there are a few that will be worth the effort to fly at an out of state launch.
I did that in 2022 and will get this year's BF order there in 2023. I guess I wasn't entirely accurate.
I really want to fly the Loki 54/1200 C-Star motor, but there's no 54mm Cocktail so the hardware cost is just too steep for me. I really value variety.
Wait, Loki has a C-Star? Or is that just another name for White?
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bet he means the "star" grain J820. ...very nice motor!
Yeah, sorry. White with a star grain.
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More Loki 54mm loads would be nice. Hopefully Scott is reading this thread...
rkoenn
Retired NASA Shuttle Engineer
Well about 20 years ago when I was preparing to get my Level 2 I was using a Loki J528. I had it in my recently completed Public Missiles Black Brand X. At ignition the engine blew up breaking the casing around the rear C-ring groove and blowing the nozzle and propellant onto the street. We were flying in Palm Bay, FL in February 2006. The rocket did get pushed about 50' into the air and also deployed the chute fortunately. The rocket was only damaged at the resin nozzle adapter section and the engine adapter up inside fortunately. I repaired it later and got my Level 2 in May at Freedom Launch in SC. A bit of a while later Steve (don't know his last name) flew his beat up very large scale Orbital Transport on a J528 as well and it blew up! He blew the forward end off the casing at the C-ring groove and his rocket was badly damaged. We had both purchased our propellant in January down in WPB at the Gator launch. Loki gave me a new casing and propellant load which I used in SC for my level 2 cert. I flew their engines in H and J class a half dozen times and was pleased overall but they do blow up and real good when they do.
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terryg
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I love the loki cocktail. Purple is amazing for a night launch!
mtnmanak
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It is not easy to design, certify and produce new motors, even when using proven formulas. It is a lengthy and expensive process. Aerotech has vastly more resources than Scott and it still takes Aerotech the better part of two years to move a new design from concept through testing and certification and then ramp up production. Getting a motor through the entire process to be certified for commercial sales is not easy at all. It also presents a huge financial risk for the manufacturer as they have to assume all the up front cost to get the motor into production and hope there is enough demand. I love flying Loki motors and do hope Scott continues to innovate, but I also understand how difficult it is to change his product lineup.
GrouchoDuke
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Like others have mentioned, Loki motors are outstanding. Their non-HAZ selection is great & they have lots of options depending on what you're looking for. The J1026 and K627 are epic 38mm motors.
You also asked about CTI. In the L1/L2 range, their 38mm motors are dead simple to use. Prepping them to fly is essentially the same as an AT single use motor (except you have the screw them into a CTI case). They have lots of propellant options too. If you want something easy to fly, it's really tough to beat CTI 38mm motors. Their case spacers also let you use several sized motors in a given case. That's a sweet perk.
You also asked about CTI. In the L1/L2 range, their 38mm motors are dead simple to use. Prepping them to fly is essentially the same as an AT single use motor (except you have the screw them into a CTI case). They have lots of propellant options too. If you want something easy to fly, it's really tough to beat CTI 38mm motors. Their case spacers also let you use several sized motors in a given case. That's a sweet perk.
A number of posts were discussing cost per impulse. I'm also on the fence about trying Loki motors. Mainly due to limited vendors and buying into another casing ecosystem. However, neglecting sale discount pricing on Aerotech, what's HAZMAT and what isn't, the sunk cost of acquiring new cases, etc, I'm finding the price per N-s pretty much equivalent. Note that the chart uses Aerotech pricing before recent price increase. I think the only real surprise I found was that I'm far better off going big... Personally, I think the I377 and I405 are calling me though.
Me as well. In my highly scientific and non-quantifiable "Cost per WOW" rocket motor metric, the I405 does very well.
One of my favorite motors is the Loki K627 (38mm). It's expensive, but has the most ommph in a 38mm commercial motor. I also learned a lot about long motors after building and flying several.
I also just started using some of his nozzles for characterizing 38mm research motors - his polished nozzles are fantastic quality. Cleanup is a breeze off the polished face.
Tony
I also just started using some of his nozzles for characterizing 38mm research motors - his polished nozzles are fantastic quality. Cleanup is a breeze off the polished face.
Tony
Well-thought and well-done graph!
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Thread 'SBR 4” Thor flies on a Loki I405 at Tulsa Rocketry launch'
https://www.rocketryforum.com/threa...-a-loki-i405-at-tulsa-rocketry-launch.160702/
Yes…it has the WOW factor.
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Does anyone know if any commercial motors have magnesium in them? Which motor designations and manufacturers would be helpful. Thanks!
