LOC Magnum 3E Blue Tube Clone Build

[neond7]

I had built a LOC Magnum 3E a few years ago, with a small mod - a 54mm MMT instead of the normal 75mm MMT. I regret that decision as it really limits my motor choices now that I'm moving up into 75mm hardware and reloads.

It's an easy fix - build a blue tube Magnum clone! I downloaded a rocksim file for it and ordered some tubes, an avionics bay, and centering rings from Always Ready Rocketry. They did an excellent job with cutting and slotting the tubes.





I also ordered some fins from Binder design as I have very little wood working capability. Mike Fischer uses some really nice 12 ply birch, he had cut my L3 fins a few years ago so using him again was a no brainier. He did not disappoint.



I'll also be using an SCP thrust ring and an Aeropack flanged motor retainer.



In order to keep the proper Magnum look this rocket will use an authentic LOC nose cone.



I will have enough 75mm blue tube motor mount left over that I can use the extra piece on a LOC Big Nuke 3E that I just started.

The blue tubes will be getting a 1x wrap of 6 oz and a 1x wrap of 3 oz fiberglass. That should fill in the spirals..... Lol.

 

[ColumbiaNX01]

I had built a LOC Magnum 3E a few years ago, with a small mod - a 54mm MMT instead of the normal 75mm MMT. With an impending level 3 cert flight, I regret that decision as it really limits my motor choices.

It's an easy fix - build a blue tube Magnum clone! I downloaded a rocksim file for it and ordered some tubes, an avionics bay, and centering rings from Always Ready Rocketry. They did an excellent job with cutting and slotting the tubes.

View attachment 290038

View attachment 290039

I also ordered some fins from Binder design as I have very little wood working capability. Mike Fischer uses some really nice 12 ply birch, he had cut my L3 fins a few years ago so using him again was a no brainier. He did not disappoint.

View attachment 290040

I'll also be using an SCP thrust ring and an Aeropack flanged motor retainer.

View attachment 290041

In order to keep the proper Magnum look this rocket will use an authentic LOC nose cone.

View attachment 290043

I will have enough 75mm blue tube motor mount left over that I can use the extra piece on a LOC Big Nuke 3E that I just started.

The blue tubes will be getting a 1x wrap of 6 oz and a 1x wrap of 3 oz fiberglass. That should fill in the spirals..... Lol.

WHY are you doing fiberglass wraps?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? It is blue tube!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No need for added reinforcement. All you will be doing is adding weight and not much strength. Now if you vacuum bag it with the fiberglass then its a different story.

 

[dixontj93060]

Whether vacuum bagged or not, there is no need for fiberglass with Blue Tube.

 

[ColumbiaNX01]

Whether vacuum bagged or not, there is no need for fiberglass with Blue Tube.

agree!!

 

[neond7]

WHY are you doing fiberglass wraps?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????? It is blue tube!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! No need for added reinforcement. All you will be doing is adding weight and not much strength. Now if you vacuum bag it with the fiberglass then its a different story.

I was going to do a tip to tip glass on the fins anyway (which does add a LOT of strength), so it's an easy thing to do the rest of the tubes. I actually wanted to add some weight - should add about three pounds - as I'll be flying on large L and an occasional M impulse motors and I want to stay under the 10k waiver at the field I fly at. My other LOC Magnum is fully glassed and it hits 5k on K impulse motors. I'm happy with that, I'm not going for altitude records.

If I was planning on flying on J motors then weight would matter. I've glassed blue tubes before, they don't soak up as much epoxy as Kraft tubes do once the glassine is stripped.

 

[cbrarick]

I bet there isn't a 3 inch motor out there that will rip the fins off if you glued them on right.

But if that's what you like to do, go for it!

(gotta ask, wouldn't it have been easier just to do it all in fiberglass tube and skip the lengthy process of glassing that which will not be sanded??)

 

[Pyropetepete]

Glossing the whole thing is not needed.

Okay glass the fins so they can take a hit but if you glue and fillet right you should be good.

If you want weight foam the fin can. Then add nose weight to balance it out.

Use some thick filler to fill the spirals. Wood dust and wood glue is good.

 

[neond7]

I'm confused why everyone is so adverse to a little fiberglass on blue tube. I kinda enjoy it and have had great success with my previous rockets.

Last weekend I fiberglassed both tubes for my LOC Big Nuke 3E. After the fins are on and fillets applied, I'll do a tip to tip on them as well.



By using the 3oz as a veil layer, it needs minimal sanding before shooting a high build primer. I think glassed tubes are much easier to paint than Kraft.

Anyway, this build thread will start making progress as soon as I pick up another gallon of West epoxy later this week.

 

[bill2654]

I've enjoyed watching your other builds Jeff. Glass On!

 

[rharshberger]

I'm confused why everyone is so adverse to a little fiberglass on blue tube. I kinda enjoy it and have had great success with my previous rockets.

Last weekend I fiberglassed both tubes for my LOC Big Nuke 3E. After the fins are on and fillets applied, I'll do a tip to tip on them as well.

View attachment 290081

By using the 3oz as a veil layer, it needs minimal sanding before shooting a high build primer. I think glassed tubes are much easier to paint than Kraft.

Anyway, this build thread will start making progress as soon as I pick up another gallon of West epoxy later this week.

Im with you, I glass because I like it.

 

[DAllen]

Is it necessary to glass BT? Awww hell naw.

Does it make you happy? Apparently so...glass away...

If you're not having fun doing this hobby you're doing it wrong.

 

[neond7]

Just to clarify, I'm not implying that blue tube needs to be reinforced, even on M impulse motors. I know the original blue tube had issues with humidity and heat, which could cause warping of the tube, but I understand those issues were fixed with version 2 of the tubes.
My goals for glassing are to add a little weight to keep altitudes reasonable and I like the finished surface.
Of course I still have to make a successful level 3 cert flight in two months (with a different rocket). If that rocket tanks I can always use this one as backup.

 

[dixontj93060]

If you're not having fun doing this hobby you're doing it wrong.

+1.

 

[Pyropetepete]

Shocked how it soaked all the epoxy and went brown seeing how blue the tube is.

 

[neond7]

Shocked how it soaked all the epoxy and went brown seeing how blue the tube is.

Lol.... No, those were the tubes from a LOC Big Nuke I glassed last weekend. I had peeled off the glassine which is why they were darker than normal Kraft tubes.

I've glassed blue tubes before, they just turn darker blue. They wet out really nice and don't soak up too much epoxy. The Kraft tubes take a lot more to properly wet out.

 

[Pyropetepete]

Lol.... No, those were the tubes from a LOC Big Nuke I glassed last weekend. I had peeled off the glassine which is why they were darker than normal Kraft tubes.

I've glassed blue tubes before, they just turn darker blue. They wet out really nice and don't soak up too much epoxy. The Kraft tubes take a lot more to properly wet out.

Kraft would. It soaks everything up. I've blue not so willing to soak everything up.

 

[rharshberger]

Lol.... No, those were the tubes from a LOC Big Nuke I glassed last weekend. I had peeled off the glassine which is why they were darker than normal Kraft tubes.

I've glassed blue tubes before, they just turn darker blue. They wet out really nice and don't soak up too much epoxy. The Kraft tubes take a lot more to properly wet out.

Its definitely best to peel the glassine from Loc tubes before glassing, you get a better product in the end, since the FG adheres better because of the epoxy soaking into the cardboard.

 

[neond7]

Picked up a new gallon of West epoxy yesterday so I was all set to laminate the first tube after work today.

First I cut measured out enough fiberglass for a 1x wrap of 6oz and 1x wrap of 3oz.





It took nine pumps of epoxy to wet out both layers and the switch band. Here it is wrapped up in Teflon peel ply. I rotated it every few minutes to avoid epoxy pooling at the bottom of the tube - had that happen once.



After about three hours it was ready for the peel ply to come off.



The overhang is easy to trim when it's still green.



With two thick centering rings already in the tube, the weight was 27.95oz before glassing and 37.70 after. I just pulled and weighed the rings and they are exactly 4oz. Always Ready Rocketry uses the thickest centering rings I've ever seen. Very nice item.

Tomorrow I plan on fiberglassing the fin section.

 

[dixontj93060]

9+ oz seems like a lot added, but can't argue with the results as the tube looks awesome!

 

[RocketRob]

I used 12 oz glass tip to tip on my 5.5 Blue Tube L3 bird and it is stiff!

 

[Pyropetepete]

That does look cool. Loads of weight but it's going to take a pounding.

Why not make an system to rotate the tube automatically for you.

 

[neond7]

That does look cool. Loads of weight but it's going to take a pounding.

Why not make an system to rotate the tube automatically for you.

It actually should only add about two pounds by the time it's done - not any concern when using large "L" and "M" motors. And no spirals to fill!

At one time I did have a rotisserie setup, but it disappeared when I moved back in 2014. Once I glass the fin section later today I only have one more glassed rocket in the planning stages (a Thor clone). Unfortunately, my garage is getting so full of rockets that I don't have room for many more.....

 

[Banzai88]

Unfortunately, my garage is getting so full of rockets that I don't have room for many more.....

Obviously time for a new garage.

 

[Pyropetepete]

It actually should only add about two pounds by the time it's done - not any concern when using large "L" and "M" motors. And no spirals to fill!

At one time I did have a rotisserie setup, but it disappeared when I moved back in 2014. Once I glass the fin section later today I only have one more glassed rocket in the planning stages (a Thor clone). Unfortunately, my garage is getting so full of rockets that I don't have room for many more.....

Id like to learn too glass but getting all the stuff here in the UK ain't cheap

 

[Tim51]

Id like to learn too glass but getting all the stuff here in the UK ain't cheap

Not trying to hijack Jeff's build thread here but there are cheap sources for CF wrapping here in the UK - check out these skinning starter kits: <<https://www.easycomposites.co.uk/#!/starter-kits>>. The nice thing about the resins from Easy Composites is they're relatively odourless compared with standard FG epoxies.

Anyway - back to the LOC Magnum 3E Clone - very nice build so far and really envious of that SPR anodised thrust plate!

 

[neond7]

Status update: Booster section glassed!

The fiberglass measuring and cutting was uneventful.



I glassed one side of the avionics bulkhead. Strictly for ease of cleanup of ejection residue, those are already some THICK bulkheads.



After about 2.5 hours, the peel ply was ready to pull and I trimmed the overhang and opened up the fin slots.

 

[neond7]

Made some progress on the avionics bays, got all the u-bolts and hardware attached. I'll epoxy the rail guides to the avionics sleds tomorrow.



I had enough blue tube motor mount left to use on both the LOC Big Nuke and the Magnum Clone. After a CTI burn through a few years ago, I learned how quick the Kraft tubes burn through. I suspect the blue tube could handle it better - hopefully I'll never have to find out.

This week I should start tacking fins. Once all are tacked, I'll pull the rear centering ring and add internal fillets.

 

[Nick@JET]

Great technique and a cool build - learning a lot, love the garage organization too!

 

[neond7]

Slow but steady progress.

I roughed up the G10 plates with an exacto knife where the sled rails will attach. As you can see I'm working on two rockets at the same time. Great for multitasking.



I then applied a bead of Aeropoxy structural epoxy and pressed the sled rails into it and added some weight to maintain good contact while the epoxy cures.





I dabbed the leftover epoxy on the t-nuts for the back of the rear centering ring. These keep the SCP thrust ring attached.

 

[neond7]

I had sent the wrong fin length to Always Ready Rocketry when I ordered the tubes so the slots were about 3/4" too short. Easy fix with a Dremel.





Once I lengthened the slots I did a test stack of the components.



I put three washers between the rear centering ring and the SCP thrust ring - that allowed the top of the centering ring to perfectly line up with the bottom of the slot. It also allows enough room to add a decent fillet behind the rear centering ring (after fins are on) so it won't ever break loose.

Now that I'm comfortable with how everything will line up, I'll epoxy on the top and middle centering rings tomorrow. Then I'll epoxy that into the body tube, leaving the rear ring loose so I can add internal fillets once the fins are tacked.