Level1 Project

[Karl]

First off I carn't get any pictures , my Digital Camera will not turn on

Right im gonna get to work on my first Level 1 project tomorow , based around the basic 4FNC. It's going to have a 38mm motor mount , 5mm MDF Centering-Rings & 3mm Plywood fins.
But I do have one question , what do I do with the motor mount , I know Whiteglue/PVA/WoodGlue is out of the question for securing the motor tube to the centering rings , but what could I use , No More Nails ? I was going to Fiberglass it to add support but I carn't find my Epoxy & Resin , I am not having a good day

 

[lalligood]

Assuming you are using paper tubes, au contraire, mon freire...

Scuff up the MMT tube with 150-200 grit sandpaper & aliphatic resin (yellow wood glue) is *at least* as strong as any epoxy when it comes to wood-wood & wood-paper joints. Just don't use yellow wood glue on plastic!

Repeat after me: Don't underestimate the power of yellow wood glue.

See www.rocketmaterials.org for proof...

 

[Karl]

Yep im using paper tubes , and as soon as I get the 38mm motor tube (later this week) , I will scruff it all up like you said , thanks for that
The best thing about woodglue is that it dries clear , and is easier to shape fillets made from it

 

[GL-P]

Yep, the stuff I have is like 2 tons per square inch That's plenty. When you find your epoxy, use it for fillets

Good luck!

 

[Stymye]

and most important ...fix the camera!

 

[gerbs4me]

you can use wood glue on high powered rockets?

 

[Karl]

stymye: I have another DigitalCamera but it's quality is like 50 mega pixels lol (Kodak EZ200)


GL-P: I have normal WoodGlue , and some stuff called 'Evo-Stik Weather-Proof WoodGlue' . Ahh no , the stuff I carnt find is Fiberglass Resin & Hardner (I dont know why I called it epoxy ). But could it be used as fillets , I mean this stuff dries harder then any Epoxy will ever do.


gerbs4me: Seems so , I wouldn't of thought it would hold up myself.


Ohh and beware it's gonna be on a Pro38 H153/I205 . Will it hold?

 

[lalligood]

Originally posted by gerbs4me
you can use wood glue on high powered rockets?

gerbs,

Check out my tube fin rocket review over at EMRR. I used very little epoxy overall & I even used white glue for originally attaching the centering rings to the MMT tube! I'm also working on a funnel fin rocket that only uses epoxy for fillets on the launch lugs--nothing else would "build" that high. I used yellow wood glue, polyurethane glue, & a tiny bit of CA for the bulk of the build! (see this thread for more information.)

I'm certain both designs have & will benefit from greater performance because of using lighter & less adhesives.

HTH,

 

[GL-P]

Originally posted by Karl
Ahh no , the stuff I carnt find is Fiberglass Resin & Hardner (I dont know why I called it epoxy ). But could it be used as fillets , I mean this stuff dries harder then any Epoxy will ever do.

That's either regular epoxy or polyester resin which I've never used for fillets but have used for fibreglass.

 

[Karl]

Yes I think this stuff widely differs from normal 2-part epoxy. Normal filleting epoxy sometimes get's a BIT warm. But the fiberglass gets so hot , it can melt through plastic cups

 

[gerbs4me]

I didn't think it would hold up either

 

[Karl]

Well the construction will start today , as will the 10..9..8 article.
My package has arrived from Apo11o , including a 38mm motor tube & a 1x1meter square of 3.48mm premium plywood. Im gonna go to Halfords later to pick up some nylon cord , body filler , epoxy & spray paint.

 

[Karl]

Well I jsut got back (went to B&Q instead) , and I picked up some Scotch 'Blue tape' , araldite rapid , paint & nylon cord. Im gonna have something to eat and get cracking on her I think I'll make the motor mount & cut the fins out today.
Im gonna make the motor mount using the araldite ( this stuff is SOLID ) . And fillet the fins using white glue / PVA ect. But with the white glue , Im gonna apply VIGEROUSLY! with the strength of this stuff , it's gonna need a whole load!

 

[Karl]

UPDATE :

I chose the shape of the fins , and made a stencil out of #2 cardstock , cut it out and traced the shape onto 1.5mm premium ply wood ( Added TTW bit ) .

Cut out each fin.

Made 3 centering rings using 5mm MDF with a central 42mm hole to hold the 38mm motor tube.

Sanded all the fins down together to get rid of flashing & to keep them all the same shape.

Sanded the surface of each fin (3) to make it smoother and ready for basecoat.

Marked up the Bodytube , and cut out the slots for each fin.

Coverd the Aft & Top centering ring with aliminium tape to act as a heat resistor and to stop the wood burning from the exhaust flame & ejection debis.

Glued in aft centering ring , and the first fin ( after scruffing up the motor tube)

Pictures to folow.

 

[Karl]

 

[Karl]

Update :

The BT has now had 6 coats of undercoat on to hide the spirals . I will put another 4 on and see how she looks , if they arn't gone I will cover them with woodfiller.
The last fin has been put onto the Motor-Tube , aft centering ring is going NOWHERE so thats a good sign . I'll sand the fins a little more & clean up the mmt where the fins are attached.

What I will do today :

Glue #2 centering ring in place using Araldite .


Problem(s) :

I can either epoxy the nylon cord to the motor tube , and slide the top centering ring over the top. But is there any other way of attaching the cord ? Like putting a screw - eye in the top centering ring and tying it to that ?

pics to come
Cheers
Karl

 

[Ryan S.]

I pt a U bolt in the top CR and attach to that.

 

[Karl]

Thanks Ryan S.! I'll try to find one down at my local DIY store.

I've done a little bit of work to find out roughly how much this thing will weigh.
The nosecone , 'chute (3.5ft) , nylon cord (6m) , and motor mount ( inc 3xfins , centering rings & motor tube) weighed in at 16oz.
Karl

 

[Karl]

Hey all , I've made some progress since the last post . Just a few pics to keep yall entertained They are a dry - fit of the mmt in the rocket.

#1 : Estes Porta Pad for size comparison
#2 : Picture of the rocket with all 6m of nylon cord out , that I hope will work as a shockcord.

#3 : View of the mmt , they still need to be filleted & the fin slots are just a bit to small , can be trimed.

 

[Karl]

#2

 

[Karl]

#3

 

[Karl]

I again apologize for the POOR quality in the pictures , until I get my other digi cam fixed , this is what I am stuck with

 

[Karl]

Ok shes weighed in at 2g now , without fin fillets or motor/casing. So after the fillets are done , im looking at around 2.1/2g . Is this the right weight for launching her on a Pro38 2grain H-I?
Karl

 

[GL-P]

You mean kilograms right?

 

[GL-P]

2.5 kg= 5.5 lb

You should be okay on an I, 2 grain. The H will be a much lower altitude though. You might want to try the H143SS. It's a 2 grain motor but will give your rocket more of a kick.

 

[Karl]

Thanks GL-P!
Ok , I would like to get about 2000-3000ft out of her at least . So next week I'm gonna order a Pro38 3-4 Grain casing ( not yet decided ) a parachute to suit & a altimeter.

Can anyone suggest a altimeter please , this is what I'm after :

One that can be used just for measuring how high LPR/MPR/HPR stuff went.
Can be used to trigger deployment at apogee
Can be used for dual deployment.

Cheers
karl

 

[GL-P]

I have an RRC2. I haven't gotten the chance to fly it yet but I've heard good things about it. G-Wiz is an acceleration based altimeter so it can do dual deployment and also do airstarts or multiple stages. I've heard thought that accelerometer based ones do some weird things sometimes. There's also the RDAS which is probably the best and most adaptable but I think it's a little bigger than the others and more expensive. There is also perfectflite which are the cheapest but I don't know how well they work. These altimeters will fit in a 38mm-54mm tube. Perfectflite and Bon Nova do have stuff for LPR also

https://www.jcrocket.com/altimeters.shtml

I think Olsen is OOP though

 

[xenon]

I have a PerfectFlite MAWD that I've used about 6 times now. It has a lot of flexibility like adjustable mach delay (2-14sec. in 2 sec. intevals), adjustable main deployment
(300-1700ft. w/ 2 sec intervals), 1 second apogee delay(when using two altimeters). It works great! about the same price as a MissileWoks.

The H143 will work in a 5.5lbs rocket but the H153 has a higher initial thrust.

Good luck

 

[Karl]

Thanks for the comments! I do have a optional payload bay that I could use but this is only a level1 rocket and I dont want to make it dual deploy just incase it's a overkill. I've heard alot about MAWD's , like you carnt use it near to metal because the metal sometimes makes a magnetic field?
Karl

 

[xenon]

Originally posted by Karl
Thanks for the comments! I do have a optional payload bay that I could use but this is only a level1 rocket and I dont want to make it dual deploy just incase it's a overkill. I've heard alot about MAWD's , like you carnt use it near to metal because the metal sometimes makes a magnetic field?
Karl

I think you are thinking of the MAD (Magnetic Apogee Detector), these use the earths magnetic field to detect when the rocket tips over.
MAWD (Mini Altimiter with deployment) could probably be used around metal without problems because they use barometric pressure to measure altitude