LEUP vs. LUP

[jraice]

I have heard the BATFE now has an LUP (limited use permit). Does anyone know what it does? Does it ever expire? What would I need to get one???

Thanks,
Jordan Raice

 

[rstaff3]

The best I remember the application process is about the same (both require printing, etc) but it is cheaper than a LEUP. You then can only buy regulated items a set number of times a year.

 

[UhClem]

The process for getting and the requirements for a Limited Permit (type 60) and a User of Low Explosives permit (type 34) are identical. Same application, fingerprints, photograph, inspection storage, etc. Don't confuse the Limited Permit with a User (Limited) Permit. The later is $75 and good for a single acquistion only.

The Limited Permit is good for one year and the LEUP is good for three.

The Limited Permit costs $25 for the first year and $12 a year to renew. The LEUP costs $100 for the first three years and then $50/three years. If you do the math, you will save $51 the first three years and then $14/three years after that.

With a Limited Permit you can only acquire explosives six times per year. You cannot purchase from an out of state vendor. You cannot transport what you have bought out of state. You are strictly limited to no interstate activities.

If you think that you can get by with only intrastate activities and renewing every year isn't too much of a hassle, you can save a couple of bucks with a Limited Permit.

 

[jraice]

So the permit that is $25 and 12 to renewal is which one? I looked at the application and all I saw was the LUP, limited use permit, it was $75. The $25 one sounds great, what is the type # for the $25 one?

 

[UhClem]

Originally posted by jraice
So the permit that is $25 and 12 to renewal is which one? I looked at the application and all I saw was the LUP, limited use permit, it was $75. The $25 one sounds great, what is the type # for the $25 one?

"Limited Permit (type 60) "
"The Limited Permit costs $25 for the first year and $12 a year to renew."

 

[Rocketjunkie]

Originally posted by UhClem
If you think that you can get by with only intrastate activities and renewing every year isn't too much of a hassle, you can save a couple of bucks with a Limited Permit.

It's just as hard to get, doesn't exempt you from the storage requirements, and limits you to in state and only 6 transactions per year.

When I last talked to my ATF agent, he told me there were exactly **0** LUPs issued.

 

[swimmer]

Rocketjunkie,

At least in Kansas there have been two LUP's issued, and one of them is mine and the other a rocket buddy . If I had to do it again I'd go for the LEUP and just may do that one of these years. The LUP requires the same amount of intrusiveness as a LEUP and the restrictions are the same as you noted. The cost difference is not worth the additional restrictions, ie. 6 purchases per year, extra paperwork, no interstate buying or flying, etc.

The LUP was not hard to get, in fact, the ATF agent was very informitive and personable during the interview. After the official stuff, and she was real official, she was interested in my rockets and wanted to get her boys into the hobby. I had to contact her several times with questions and she was always accomodating.

Typical government though, I had to send my permit back once cause the premisis address was wrong and I received four information packets in the mail. Anybody need a Orange Book?

The LUP does make extra work for your motor vendor, however, I have not found a motor vendor yet that minds. Motor purchases=profit.

If any one is trying to chose between a LUP and a LEUP, go for the LEUP would be my advice.

 

[jraice]

Legally any motor H or above need one. Almost all vendors will sell you H-smaller J at the launch, some require the permit to buy K and above at launchs but the vendors I know of let me buy any motor I want as long as I fly it that day or that weekend. If you want to legally have any motors shipped to you or you want to store motors H or above you need one. The only reason I would get one would be if you plan on going to launchs that don't have vendors... all my launchs do so I just buy from them the day of the launch.

 

[Jerry Irvine]

I have heard from many users the LUP is a waste and a LE*P is the way to go.

But those same folks have not read and uderstood 27 CFR 555.141-a-8 too. And associated 27 CFR 555.141 definitions, PADs.

Perhaps you should. And read it to your agent and insist he do his duty and respect the fact of some goods being exempt per the regulations.

Jerry

 

[urbanek]

I would never advise someone to go for the LUP (type 60). The type 34 permit is the way to go. If you have a local vendor, or a friend with a storage magazine, get a letter from him/her stating that they will take possession of any excess material you may inadvertently end up with. This works very well.

It is always a good idea to know the Orange Book well when you apply for your permit. When my local agent interviewed me, I knew as much about the regs as he did, so the interview was fairly long, but the magazine inspection was done via email.

What you want to sound like to the agent:
A: Like you know the regs inside and out.
B: Like you will follow the regs (and you don't think they're all that much hassle)
C: That you will never cause him/her any problems

Feed them the right BS, they go away.

urbanek

 

[jraice]

The reason I want the LUP type 60 is because I go to 3 or 4 launchs a year that have to vendor. When there is a vendor I just buy at the launch. The 6 times I can use the LUP type 60 is plenty!!!

 

[urbanek]

Originally posted by jraice
The reason I want the LUP type 60 is because I go to 3 or 4 launchs a year that have to vendor. When there is a vendor I just buy at the launch. The 6 times I can use the LUP type 60 is plenty!!!

If you go outside your state, or if the dealer is from outside your state, the Type 60 does you no good. If either case holds, you must have a Type 34 permit to buy.

A good motto (if you must have a motto) is 'Never say never.' It would be sad to say something like "I never go to out of state launches and I never buy from out of state dealers" and then put your money down. You'll regret it sooner rather than later when you find that LDRS might appear in the next state over in two years, or if your last in-state dealer closes shop and the only dealer showing up at your launch is from over the state line.

Not saying you can't do it, just saying that experience tells me that it's not the best choice.

urbanek