Lakeroadster's X-Wing Alpha Build Thread

lakeroadster

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Time to add a first stage!

I had promised, I think it was @BABAR , or maybe @jqavins, that I would fly the X-Wing, before flying it as the sustainer with the Tie Fighter as a booster attached. Their advice was sound, and honestly, I owed it to the X-Wing to give it some flight time.
 

jqavins

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I gained a lot of respect for you folks that post up flight videos and photos. We were so focused on not losing the rocket since it was its maiden flight, that I wasn't able to get any apogee or recovery photo's.
The best way is to get someone else to do it. You watch the rocket, and a second person takes the pictures/video. Since your wife is learning what fun it all is, you need a person number three. (I'd volunteer, but it's kind of a long trip.)
 

lakeroadster

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I can't tell you how unreasonably happy it makes me to see that you finally got to launch some rockets. Look forward to seeing flight reports now for *all* of them. :)

Thanks Neil.

It's been unseasonably wet here this year, so no fire bans. I'm just so hardheaded / nostalgic that I wanted to launch the way we did back in the day. Just a couple of us out in a field, close to home. I felt like a kid again.
 

Daddyisabar

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I forgot to post a photo of our launch site. 8,200 feet elevation, Continental Divide to the west.

View attachment 525469
That area has a really Good View! Those liitle rock hills look so close. If your model lands on top of one it is just a short scamper up the side of the hill to recover. ;)
 

gdjsky01

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Nice job! Well done. I am trying to get out for the first time in 5 years... first my body gives me an issue, then the 21 year old car, and now ROC goes and cancels the July lunch for unspecified reasons. :(

Again nice job. Glad the spouse made it out!!! My wife used to... alas before her medical issues... :(

BTW: JMO but videos of rockets are 99.8% overrated. Too small an image scale, can't keep up, and no one sets the camera for fixed infinity focus. Hence most of the video is the autofocus hunting. :)

Again congrats!!!!! :clapping::bravo:
 

lakeroadster

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Finishing up the gap stage tube & flight prep.

Gap Stage Tube
  • I used thin CA to glue couplers to both end of the clear BT-55. This wasn't something I originally had planned on, but the clear tube was just to flimsy to get a nice snug fit with the sustainer.
  • Masking tape was used to get a heavy interference fit into the Tie Fighter booster, and a snug fit into the X-Wing sustainer.
006 - Copy.JPG 008 - Copy.JPG

____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Flight Prep
  • I used shipping tape to build up a retainer ring on the back of the booster. This ring keeps the rear stability shield in place.
  • The metal motor clip goes through the shield, inserts into the slot in the body tube and is secured using to pieces of wire. This is wire left over from spent e-matches I previously used on other flights.
000.JPG 001.JPG 002.JPG 003.JPG 005 - Copy.JPG
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
Concerns
  • The insertion of the gap staging clear tube into the sustainer is only about 1/2". If I were to build this again, I'd have made sure to have at least an inch. I just never planned on using a booster with the X-Wing. Hopefully the snug fit will be good enough to hold the sustainer in alignment, yet not so snug as to prevent it from being spit out when the sustainer motor fires.
____________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

With any luck we'll get the good soaking rain here they are forecasting, and we can burn some black powder on this rocket and The Lifting Rocket later this week.


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GlenP

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Looks like you have only one single vent hole at the sustainer nozzle end of the staging tube, which is probably enough venting for good staging, but might give a slight sideways kick during the staging. You might consider adding an identical hole on the opposite side, but not totally required, the staging event is pretty quick and you probably will be fine. At the speed of staging, the small side thrust at the instant of staging might not really alter the flight path at all.
 

lakeroadster

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Looks like you have only one single vent hole at the sustainer nozzle end of the staging tube, which is probably enough venting for good staging, but might give a slight sideways kick during the staging. You might consider adding an identical hole on the opposite side, but not totally required, the staging event is pretty quick and you probably will be fine. At the speed of staging, the small side thrust at the instant of staging might not really alter the flight path at all.

Thanks... Easy enough to do.. I'm headed to the barn right now...

Update: Double Your Pleasure, Double Your Fun, Add Two Vent Holes, Instead Of Just One.

Thanks again @GlenP

012.JPG
 
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Daddyisabar

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Total loaded weight under 14 oz. Or 396 grams? Do you trust your computerized sim? More importantly, do you trust in your feelings? Use the force Lake.

The D12 0 needs to have enough thrust to get if off the rod fast enough for stability and to keep it straight before Chad staging at a decent height above the rod. Thin, warm air at altitude should help. A lot of clear plastic base drag on the hind end to slow down booster.

Any dreams lately? Quiet your mind a listen for the midichlorians....
 

lakeroadster

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Total loaded weight under 14 oz. Or 396 grams?

11.5 Ounces

Do you trust your computerized sim?

Open Rocket shows stability = 0.098.... so I guess the answer is... meh

Any dreams lately? Quiet your mind a listen for the midichlorians....

Are you psychic or using The Force

I had a dream last night that I launched the F-79 and it ground hit and proceeded to break into pieces like a porcelain dinner plate.
 

Funkworks

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The same sustainer could be used with interchangeable boosters. Like a regular TIE. Or the TIE "Interceptor". Or Jabba's sail barge.

Just a thought.
 

Daddyisabar

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Hummmm...hard to tell the future is.

Vader had him him locked on but hesitated for an instant when he felt a unforseen disturbance in the force. A rebel friend had changed his ways and had come to assist.

Where are your rebel friends now?

My Lord, will 11.5 oz. With all that drag make it past the RSO table? ...He is the RSO.

What if it crashes? Will he be crushed? ... He will simply build another. Everything is progressing just as I have foreseen.
 

BABAR

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Consider a removable wrap of parchment paper inside your clear section for flight purposes. Negligible mass, but without something like this I expect the tubing will not be clear after first flight.

Any chance you can get a longer rod? This is a very draggy rocket and borderline lift capacity for the D12. Could you save a few grams by downsizing the upper stage to an A10-3T?
 

lakeroadster

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Consider a removable wrap of parchment paper inside your clear section for flight purposes. Negligible mass, but without something like this I expect the tubing will not be clear after first flight.

Any chance you can get a longer rod? This is a very draggy rocket and borderline lift capacity for the D12. Could you save a few grams by downsizing the upper stage to an A10-3T?

I bought (2) clear tubes... one for launch, one for display. I really want to see what the ejection charge does to the tube. Inquiring minds want to know.

Consider a removable wrap of parchment paper inside your clear section for flight purposes. Negligible mass, but without something like this I expect the tubing will not be clear after first flight.

Any chance you can get a longer rod? This is a very draggy rocket and borderline lift capacity for the D12. Could you save a few grams by downsizing the upper stage to an A10-3T?

Multistage stubby odd rocs that don't look like the classic 3NC/4NC arrow rockets are heavy.

This rocket is very similar to my Ahpla in regard to Velocity Off Rod.
  • 25.5 mph for Ahpla
  • 25.9 mph for the X-Wing/Tie
Estes states the max lift-off weight for a D12-0 is 14 ounces. 11.5 ounces isn't borderline. My Ahpla was 14.1 ounces... now that was borderline, actually over the line.

Our thin air here at 8,200 feet is a good thing in respect to many of these characteristics.
 
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BABAR

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I bought (2) clear tubes... one for launch, one for display. I really want to see what the ejection charge does to the tube. Inquiring minds want to know.



Multistage stubby odd rocs that don't look like the classic 3NC/4NC arrow rockets are heavy.

This rocket is very similar to my Ahpla in regard to Velocity Off Rod.
  • 25.5 mph for Ahpla
  • 25.9 mph for the X-Wing/Tie
Estes states the max lift-off weight for a D12-0 is 14 ounces. 11.5 ounces isn't borderline. My Ahpla was 14.1 ounces... now that was borderline, actually over the line.

Our thin air here at 8,200 feet is a good thing in respect to many of these characteristics.
my bad, I was mixing responses with posts, I read @Daddyisabar comment about “396 grams“ (and assumed that WAS your mass) and missed your very CLEAR response of “11.5 oz.” It’s have been some Jedi mind trick. They cut out the part in the movie at the cafe is Mos Eisley where Luke and Obi Wan were eating, Obi Wan kept saying, “Luke, use the FORK……don’t use the spoon, use the FORK.”

still recommend going with the lowest thrust black powder motor you can find In sustainer. Kinda wish they had an A10-5T. As I said, I haven‘t had problems gap staging smaller bore sustainer motors, but I feel more comfortable with larger bores.
 

lakeroadster

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.... They cut out the part in the movie at the cafe is Mos Eisley where Luke and Obi Wan were eating, Obi Wan kept saying, “Luke, use the FORK……don’t use the spoon, use the FORK.”

Princess Leia could easily have helped minimize the confusion by explaining to her brother what Obi Wan was saying, but she couldn't hear anything with those big headphones she always wears.​
1660671138211.png 1660671204866.png



.... still recommend going with the lowest thrust black powder motor you can find In sustainer. Kinda wish they had an A10-5T. As I said, I haven‘t had problems gap staging smaller bore sustainer motors, but I feel more comfortable with larger bores.

I read something just the other day where they said that hot gasses actually ignite the motor, not the hot flaming bits. Whos knows? But I do know that D motor will have a serious amount of both spewing up at the C6-5.​
This is my 1st gap staged rocket, and my X-Wing is the "least robust" design of any rocket it my fleet. It may well end up being a sacrifice to the Gods of Staging, or the Gods of Stability.​
 
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lakeroadster

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Luke's Swinging in the Rain,
Darth's Swinging in the Rain,
What a Glorius Feeling,
The Force is with.... Us Again.

Reading through my previous posts here I noticed when I did the last swing test (using a wooden dowel as the gap staging tube) I had mentioned I would do another swing test in the final configuration.

So, I did just that... this time putting the camera / tripod out in the barn, since there was a very light rain falling. I channeled my inner Gene Kelly, and Obi Wan.

This rocket flies stable, much better than it did with the wooden dowel mockup swing test. I'm thinking this is due to the lighter weight (no heavy solid wood dowel) thus the rocket can respond quicker to aerodynamic forces.

I usually spin the rocket much faster, but didn't due to the staging tube. Even at the low spin rate, it's still stable.

The test was a confidence builder for me. This bird is "Go For Launch".

 
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BABAR

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Looks great. I think Luke will shake off Vader and the Death Star is toast
Princess Leia could easily have helped minimize the confusion by explaining to her brother what Obi Wan was saying, but she couldn't hear anything with those big headphones she always wears.​





I read something just the other day where they said that hot gasses actually ignite the motor, not the hot flaming bits. Whos knows? But I do know that D motor will have a serious amount of both spewing up at the C6-5.​
This is my 1st gap staged rocket, and my X-Wing is the "least robust" design of any rocket it my fleet. It may well end up being a sacrifice to the Gods of Staging, or the Gods of Stability.​
Those were pretty fancy imported headphones. I believe they were of Danish origin.
 

lakeroadster

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We drove by the launch site today and had a discussion with Launch Control (aka my wife). It was determined that no future launches can be made due to the amount of tall dry grass.

Major bummer.

Launch Control did suggest that perhaps a launch could be made in the event of a blanket of snow. later in the year.
 
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