Lakeroadster's Lifting Rocket

Discussion in 'Scratch Built' started by lakeroadster, Dec 27, 2018.

Help Support The Rocketry Forum by donating:

  1. Feb 21, 2019 #211

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    No idea... but I bet Bill Gates knows.

    However, when you take a pdf file, and zoom out to see the entire drawing, then make a jpg... it's an "ignition wipe". When you zoom in on Detail B and make another jpg... it's an "ignition wire".

    Technology marches on.

    Launch Support TLR Rev 0 close up.jpg Launch Support TLR Rev 0.png
     
    Rktman likes this.
  2. Feb 23, 2019 #212

    Rktman

    Rktman

    Rktman

    Eric Noguchi

    Joined:
    Mar 5, 2017
    Messages:
    844
    Likes Received:
    38
    Extremely meticulous, creative and well-thought-out build. Ever consider designing for or contracting out to outfits like Estes or Apogee?
     
    lakeroadster likes this.
  3. Feb 23, 2019 #213

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    Thanks. I'm retired. I'd consider it if there were no deadlines. But that's rarely the case.
     
  4. Feb 23, 2019 #214

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    Started applying Gorilla Glue fillets to the fins yesterday. I'm making them as small as possible, then plan to stain the wood with Spar Urethane.

    Anybody ever stained / coated balsa with Spar Urethane? I'm still working on final paint scheme, but at this point I'm still thinking "Steam Punk" but with a NASA Gemini Salvage Yard Twist.

    001.JPG LIFTING ROCKET PAINT 001.JPG
     
  5. Feb 23, 2019 #215

    neil_w

    neil_w

    neil_w

    Pencil Pusher TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2015
    Messages:
    7,309
    Likes Received:
    1,346
    Location:
    Northern NJ
    My standard recommendation would be to try it on a test piece, see if you like the look before you commit.

    Looking forward to seeing this thing in pigment!
     
  6. Feb 23, 2019 #216

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    Here's my 1st draft of the paint scheme.. Comments or Suggestions? Drawing TLR-0 Rev 4 Sht 1of 5.jpg LIFTING ROCKET PAINT 002.JPG

    Gemini_3.jpg 338055main_srb-1600_946-710.jpg
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2019
  7. Feb 24, 2019 #217

    BABAR

    BABAR

    BABAR

    Builds Rockets for NASA TRF Lifetime Supporter TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    4,785
    Likes Received:
    642
    Nice. What kind of camera you gonna put in the tail?
     
    lakeroadster likes this.
  8. Feb 24, 2019 #218

    neil_w

    neil_w

    neil_w

    Pencil Pusher TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2015
    Messages:
    7,309
    Likes Received:
    1,346
    Location:
    Northern NJ
    That'll be very spiffy indeed.
     
    lakeroadster likes this.
  9. Feb 24, 2019 #219

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    I'm not sure at this point. I'll be working on the revised Cargo Bay design today. The new design doesn't have the BT-80 to BT-60 transition.I want the motor mount to be removable, probably via screws. This will allow a bolt in camera mount, or bolt in mounts for other stuff too.
    _________________________________________________
    Proposed Cargo Bay
    New Cargo Bay.JPG
    _________________________________________________
    Previous Cargo Bay
    Previous Cargo Bay.JPG
     
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2019
  10. Feb 24, 2019 #220

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    Started gluing the internal fin can fillets today. Also redesigned the Cargo Bay and did a couple rendering of the new paint schematic.

    LIFTING ROCKET 2019-02-24 002.JPG

    001.JPG 002.JPG 003.JPG 004.JPG 005.JPG

    Drawing TLR-4 Rev 2 Sht 1of 7.jpg
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2019
  11. Feb 25, 2019 #221

    Rockyt

    Rockyt

    Rockyt

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2014
    Messages:
    193
    Likes Received:
    26
    Here's my first try @ staining rocket fins. I loved the way it turned out. It was left over minwax from another project. The strip below the nosecone was a laminate sheet meant for scrapbooking, but you really can't tell the difference.

    Clearly, I'm a fan of your 'salvaged' rocket look. I love the weathered look a wash of black/brown for the silver sections, but a light wash of thinned down black would really make them pop, assmiung you are going for a 'shinier' rocket feel. :)

    Just, don't use a sponge brush...I'd recommend a paper towel or small flat brush to do it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2019
  12. Feb 25, 2019 #222

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    Thanks for posting. That is indeed awesome. How did you do the rivets and steel straps? Steam Punk Rockyt 001.jpg
     
  13. Feb 25, 2019 #223

    Rockyt

    Rockyt

    Rockyt

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2014
    Messages:
    193
    Likes Received:
    26
    The rivets are 'pearl' stickers of varying sizes from the sticker/scrapbook section of hobby lobby (Took a few trips as the 40% coupon is a 'one per day thing') and the straps are just cut strips of manila folder or cardboard, depending on thickness I wanted. They were glued to the rocket with a small gap that was then filled by CWF and sanded smooth. You can see the remnants on the collar in the first 2 pics of my quote above.
     
    lakeroadster likes this.
  14. Feb 25, 2019 #224

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    Thanks again Rockyt.. :)

    Spent "Day 2" on the internal glue fillets. Looking good thus far.

    Here's a photo, with a CAD view of the MM for reference.

    002.jpg
     
  15. Mar 1, 2019 #225

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    I Get By With A Little Help From My Friends...

    Finished the Fin Can. Glued the rear centering ring in. I've been weighing the Fin Can sub-ass'y each day since I glued the internals... it keeps getting lighter as the internal glue fillets dry.

    Started building the Cargo Bay today. It sure helps to have extra materials on hand. I used a C-60, BT-60 and Centering rings to help align the bulkhead to the BT-80.

    P.S.: The candle holder that is holding up the Fin Can is called "Circle of Friends" gives new meaning to the term "Light The Candles".
    The Native American statue in the photo is made from ash... from Mount St. Helens.​

    001.JPG 003.JPG 002.JPG
    Drawing TLR-4 Rev 3 Sht 2of 9.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2019
  16. Mar 2, 2019 #226

    Crawf56

    Crawf56

    Crawf56

    Pig Soooiiieee!! TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2016
    Messages:
    1,157
    Likes Received:
    149
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Paragould, AR
    Using cereal box cardboard to make conic wraps? Brilliant! :cool:

    Is there a method for a fit, or is it trial and error?

    By the way, I used to mess around with old cars (1955 Dodge Royal). In a pinch, used cereal box cardboard for gaskets.
     
  17. Mar 2, 2019 #227

    OverTheTop

    OverTheTop

    OverTheTop

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 10, 2007
    Messages:
    3,137
    Likes Received:
    687
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Melbourne Australia
    Rocket is looking spectacular :cool:.

    +1. Works a treat and I have never had a problem when I have had to resort to this.
     
    lakeroadster likes this.
  18. Mar 2, 2019 #228

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    Thanks for the comments ;)

    Good timing on that question... I just finished installing the forward cone this morning on the Cargo Bay. Here are some photo's that show how I make the conical transitions.

    I use this online calculator to develop the template: http://craig-russell.co.uk/demos/cone_calculator/

    I cut the template, lay it on the cardboard, mark around the exterior and then use scissors to cut out the template.

    After the cone is finished and glued onto the rocket I scuff up the colored portion with sand paper and then apply superglue to the surface to stiffen it up. Then lightly sand again before priming.

    001.JPG 002.JPG 003.JPG 004.JPG 005.JPG 006.JPG 007.JPG 008.JPG
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2019
    mbeels likes this.
  19. Mar 2, 2019 #229

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    Dry fit of all the components. This thing is a beast.. well, a LPR beast anyways. :p
    010.JPG

    011.JPG
     
    Scotty Dog likes this.
  20. Mar 3, 2019 #230

    Crawf56

    Crawf56

    Crawf56

    Pig Soooiiieee!! TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 16, 2016
    Messages:
    1,157
    Likes Received:
    149
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Paragould, AR
    Excellent description. Greatly appreciated. ;)
     
  21. Mar 8, 2019 #231

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    More design changes. The Cargo Bay doubles as a carrier for a motor mount. This allows either a 24mm motor, or cargo. I wanted a bolt in motor mount. That lead to a bolted faux motor nozzle extension.

    Here's the end result.

    TLR-4 Rev 4 Sht 1 of 10.jpg TLR-4 Rev 4 Sht 6 of 10.jpg TLR-4 Rev 4 Sht 7 of 10.jpg
    Drawing TLR-0 Rev 7 Sht 3 of 5.jpg LIFTING ROCKET 2019-02-24 002.JPG
     
    Zertyme likes this.
  22. Mar 10, 2019 #232

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    More progress today on the Cargo Bay. Installed the studs into the bulkhead and fabricated the motor mount and the motor nozzle extension. Not done yet but pretty pleased with the end product thus far.

    001.JPG 002.JPG 003.JPG
     
  23. Mar 10, 2019 #233

    neil_w

    neil_w

    neil_w

    Pencil Pusher TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2015
    Messages:
    7,309
    Likes Received:
    1,346
    Location:
    Northern NJ
    Sorry if I missed this earlier... do you have an estimate what this thing is gonna weigh?
     
  24. Mar 10, 2019 #234

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    I just weighed it. It's currently 1 lb 0.4 oz.

    Open Rocket says 1 lb 3.7 oz.

    I'm guessing it'll actually be about a 1-1/2 lbs
     
  25. Mar 10, 2019 #235

    BABAR

    BABAR

    BABAR

    Builds Rockets for NASA TRF Lifetime Supporter TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    4,785
    Likes Received:
    642
    Sooo, at least two D engine better light!

    Curious, will open rocket simulate the flight with only two engines?
     
    lakeroadster likes this.
  26. Mar 11, 2019 #236

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    Yes it does. I have multiple simulations, from (1) D-12 motor up to (4) D-12 motors, and even (3) Aerotek E30's.

    (2) D12 Motors in the cluster firing gives an altitude of 281 feet and a flight duration of 19 seconds.

    (1) D12 Motor produces a lawn dart that ejects the laundry on the ground.

    I may end up using an Aerotek E-30 in the Cargo Bay, along with the (3) D's in the Cluster. Lots of options

    2019-03-11 Open Rocket Simulations of The Lifting Rocket With Rear Mount CM Cargo Bay .jpg One D12 Lights In Cluster.jpg Two D12 Light In Cluster.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019
  27. Mar 11, 2019 #237

    neil_w

    neil_w

    neil_w

    Pencil Pusher TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2015
    Messages:
    7,309
    Likes Received:
    1,346
    Location:
    Northern NJ
    Woohoo, 3xE30 baby. You may want to try 3xE15 as well, I love those motors.

    What are you doing with the ejection charge in the cargo bay motor? Is it vented out somewhere?
     
    lakeroadster likes this.
  28. Mar 11, 2019 #238

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    The bolt in motor mount has a long BT-50 tube that mates with the empty motor mount in the fin can. Therefore even if all the cluster motors don't fire, the ejection from the cargo bay motor will deploy the chutes..... at least that's the plan. ;)

    Please explain your experiences with E-30's and E-15's... what do you like or dislike about them?

    Drawing TLR-0 Rev 7 Sht 3 of 5 Paint.jpg
     
    Last edited: Mar 11, 2019
  29. Mar 11, 2019 #239

    neil_w

    neil_w

    neil_w

    Pencil Pusher TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Jul 14, 2015
    Messages:
    7,309
    Likes Received:
    1,346
    Location:
    Northern NJ
    Haven't used the E30 yet. I tend to like longer burns rather than high thrust. The E15 has enough to get all my 24mm (and my 29mm Trajector) moving nicely off the pad without teleporting. I have no doubt the E30 is great too, E15 just works better for a larger number of my rockets.
     
  30. Mar 11, 2019 #240

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    lakeroadster

    Lone Wolf... No Club TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2018
    Messages:
    1,507
    Likes Received:
    405
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Colorado
    I like it, less of a kick in the pants. And it works well with the D-12's also. An E-15 in the Cargo Bay and no cluster motors might be a good initial shake down run.

    E-15 in Cargo Bay with 3 D-12 Cluster Motors.jpg

    E-15 in Cargo Bay with No Cluster Motors.jpg
     

Share This Page

Group Builder