Krylon Spray Paint Problem

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kevindcornwell

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Thanks! You echo another poster who also had problems with Krylon clear.

I'm not going to use it again. I guess I have to find something else to hold the decals in place and give the finish a wet look.
I had the same problem with the Krylon clear topcoat - on my fins even - and they'd been sitting for two weeks. I'll never waste my time/money on it again.
 

kevindcornwell

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Is that the brand?

I like how Dupli-color flows, but...wow, it takes a few coats to get consistent coverage. I do like the quick dry between coats of lacquer, tho.

As others have pointed out, spray guns are awesome, but unless you have a fairly beefy compressor and some ventilation and proper PPE...
I use guns and I just shoot outside (under the house - the house is built on stilts 12 feet high. I'm in Hawaii) so I don't get to complain about bugs, but it makes it easy. Also, I use a Wagner finish sprayer which has it's own air source built-in. I also have a proper HVLP and a small airbrush. I use SCUBA tanks for my air source. ( I have free air fills for life due to another story, if I didn't I'd have a compressor.)
 

kevindcornwell

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For the record, I NEVER understood the $500 world class rocket project, the agonizing over ever single minor insignificant little detail and laminar flow of every molecule of air flowing from nose cone to fin tip and hours upon hours of research and simulations, and then complaining about a $12 paint job.........

The paint I'm referring to are artist colors, usually used for comic illustration or graffiti type art. Available locally from art supply houses, or like everything else rocket people buy.....ONLINE from a variety of vendors. Catch sales and it's as cheap as Rusto or Krylon bought locally (even with shipping) with NONE of the BS problems (even if you don't read the directions). Usually covers in 2 coats with nominal 400grit wet sanded primer of any brand to look amazing.

Use a good clear coat to top coat it, the clear gloss of each brand works well
. I use Eastwood 2K or Spray Max 2K 2 part polyurethane rattle can. 2K can be buffed easily to an automotive shine, but alone is rock hard and super shiny. Look up some YouTube videos of the paint and the clear.

http://www.plutoniumpaint.com/

https://www.montana-cans.com/

https://www.spraymax.com/en/products/product/clear-coats-and-spot-blender/2k-clear-coat/

https://www.eastwood.com/paints/2k-aero-spray-paints.html

For the record, you can get into a spray rig and PPE for under $150 and have VERY nice results, just commit to the learning curve and the cleaning. Plenty of threads on it right here at TRF.
On my world class rocket, actually both of them, I spent about $60 each on paint. That was about 10% of the cost. My Rockets only look good before their maiden voyage. After that I don't care, however, it's fun to start shiny. It's also fun to not have to justify why I just spent $200 on paint at Ace Hardware. And then do it again a couple weeks later. I'm still looking for the perfect shiny paint system that cures fast, sands easy, requires minimal effort, and requires no justification when I show off my toys to The Chancellor and Weekly Allowance Parser.
 

gldknght

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Wrinkling paint is an annoying problem and nose cones seem to be the worst offenders. I’ve pretty much switched to Testors exclusively for plastic cones. I think it’s all about how aggressive or “hot” the solvent component of the paint is and since Testors is specifically for plastic models it seems to work better. Yeah, those little cans are pricey and getting a good color match can be tricky but compared to the pain caused by ruined paint jobs it’s worth it to me. YMMV.

I think I read somewhere that Rustoleum and Testors are made by the same company.
 

neil_w

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Yup, same company. Doesn't guarantee compatibility or color matching, though. Best to ask the company when in doubt.
 

Scott_650

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Yup, same company. Doesn't guarantee compatibility or color matching, though. Best to ask the company when in doubt.
Unless Rustoleum takes the time and expense to formulate the same paint with a different smell the Testors branded model paint uses a different solvent/carrier solution than the other Rustoleum branded paints. So far the half dozen or so plastic cones (and a couple of fin cans) that I’ve painted with Testors haven’t wrinkled - I’ve had runs since shifting between model paint and general purpose paint (esp the 2X variety) take different techniques. Light but wet coats of Testors seem to work best for me while Rustoleum 2X takes a couple of fairly heavy coats so it can flow smoothly. Not making ANY claims of being an expert of ANY kind, just sharing what’s worked for me.
 

neil_w

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I've heard it mentioned once or twice by someone around here that the modeling paints like Testors and Tamiya have finer pigments than the Rusto stuff, and lay down smoother (totally separate issue from crinkling, of course). The Tamiyas are lacquer, though.

I've been tempted to try them but after accumulating a stock of half-used Rusto colors I feel obligated to use those, at least until I really run into problems.

The shorter cure times of lacquers are *really* tempting, though.
 

gldknght

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Any really hot lacquer based paint really should be sprayed in very light coats over a lacquer compatible primer when painting plastic.

When I use the 2XRustoleum rattle cans, I usually spray a couple "dust on" coats, Let them dry, then 2 or 3 progressively heavier coats. When I have the finish I want, I like to let the model "bake dry" in the sun, if weather permits. If I can't bake them in the sun, I set them up in front of a fan to blow dry, but only after the paint has dried to the "dust free" stage. If I don't bake or fan the subject, I've noticed that the 2X Rusto will stay sticky for days.
 

mbeels

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I'm just glad that Krylon changed their lids from the semi circle finger grips (left), to the triangular finger grips (right). I broke too many nozzle tips trying to get the old lids off. Very frustrating. Maybe I was doing it wrong, but the new design works much better!

P5211288_r.jpg
 

yorn

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I'm just glad that Krylon changed their lids from the semi circle finger grips (left), to the triangular finger grips (right). I broke too many nozzle tips trying to get the old lids off. Very frustrating. Maybe I was doing it wrong, but the new design works much better!
I stabbed myself with one of those lids when I crushed it between my thumb and index finger trying to remove it, lol.
 

Gunstar

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It's a staple of rocket painting, been proven for years. Use without fear. Note that the name and bottle changes frequently. 1 bottle, like 1 bale of barf, might be a lifetime supply.
Can you brush it on or does it have to be done with a airbrush? I've had Krylon gloss clear mess things up too.
 

neil_w

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I use a foam brush to apply it. Some folks spray it out of a standard spray bottle, slightly diluted with Simple Green (@Gary Byrum recommends 3 parts Future to 1 part Simple Green). Others airbrush it, thought I don't think I've heard any details on that. I may try switching to the spray bottle approach, although it means I'll need to move the process to the shed.
 

Philip Tiberius D.

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Ugh... you caught me at the right time. Having coffee while thinking of painting the nose cone of my "newest creation" a Apogee Zephyr painted in the Porsche 917 (Steve McQueen) / Ford GT40 Gulf colors. I couldn't find an exact match so I went to an auto paint supply house and they were very happy to take $90+ dollars from this slightly eccentric middle age man (I hope my wife doesn't read this post). Started painting yesterday and all I can say is I should have tried Tamiya/Testors/Anybody else... I'm definitely not $90 happy with the application of the paint and that's using a initial spay of something that makes paint stick to everything. Paint came out in spurts (even when shaken for 5 minutes) - the blue applied much better than the red/orange but overall the angels didn't sing when I was painting. Haven't tried Dupli-color but a quick look on Amazon (and possible a trip to Michaels) I noticed "Artist" spray paint sets, I'd be interested to know anyone's experience with these. I have used Tamiya Silver on 2 smaller rockets and the finish came out wonderful btw...
 

kevindcornwell

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Ugh... you caught me at the right time. Having coffee while thinking of painting the nose cone of my "newest creation" a Apogee Zephyr painted in the Porsche 917 (Steve McQueen) / Ford GT40 Gulf colors. I couldn't find an exact match so I went to an auto paint supply house and they were very happy to take $90+ dollars from this slightly eccentric middle age man (I hope my wife doesn't read this post). Started painting yesterday and all I can say is I should have tried Tamiya/Testors/Anybody else... I'm definitely not $90 happy with the application of the paint and that's using a initial spay of something that makes paint stick to everything. Paint came out in spurts (even when shaken for 5 minutes) - the blue applied much better than the red/orange but overall the angels didn't sing when I was painting. Haven't tried Dupli-color but a quick look on Amazon (and possible a trip to Michaels) I noticed "Artist" spray paint sets, I'd be interested to know anyone's experience with these. I have used Tamiya Silver on 2 smaller rockets and the finish came out wonderful btw...
Duplicolor (not rattle can) is the closest I've come to paint nirvana. It's heavy and still more expensive than I can justify. So, I continue looking, but laquer/paint seems to be a cut well above the rest in the context of application & drying.
 

beantownJPL

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Hi all ... I'm fairly new to rocketry, but have done tons of model airplanes. Rarely use paint on planes (almost always used films and decals), so don't have an awful lot of painting experience.

I was really happy with how this build and paint job came together. Gave it all a nice wet sand with 800 grit, applied the decal and striping. It had cured 24 hours, and then I shot the clear. Wrinkle city. The nose cone is great! The lower part of the model ... not so much.

It still looks good from a few feet away, but this ain't gonna be a display model! I'll try sanding down the wrinkles ... might be able to mitigate it some. At least the decal didn't get destroyed.

Thinking of switching over to acrylics instead of enamel/lacquer. Anybody have any thoughts on using acrylics instead? They sure smell a heck of a lot better...

 

neil_w

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What kind of paint was it? 24 hours is definitely not enough for enamels to cure before recoating.
 

beantownJPL

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What kind of paint was it? 24 hours is definitely not enough for enamels to cure before recoating.
It was the Rustoleum "Painter's Touch" 2x stuff. I didn't figure it needed a very long cure time since I used the same type of paint for the color coat. I've painted other models the same way without issue. Weird.

Any thoughts on using Acrylics instead of enamels?
 

neil_w

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Same kind of paint doesn’t matter... enamels (especially the Rusto 2x) need a lot of cure time after the initial 1 hour painting window. I always leave *at least* 3 days, often much longer.

I’ve only just started using acrylics for doing touch-up work. I think they’re probably most used by airbrushers but I’ll defer to those more experienced in that area.
 

beantownJPL

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Same kind of paint doesn’t matter... enamels (especially the Rusto 2x) need a lot of cure time after the initial 1 hour painting window. I always leave *at least* 3 days, often much longer.

I’ve only just started using acrylics for doing touch-up work. I think they’re probably most used by airbrushers but I’ll defer to those more experienced in that area.
I've tried my hand at a bit of airbrush work too. This was using thinned down Testors enamels, and the cheap Testors single-stage airbrush. Stunk up my workshop pretty good, and I KNOW those fumes can't be good for me. Another reason I'm thinking of going to Acrylics.

I used the came can of clear on that one ... only negative result was a bit of curling on the decal on one edge near the top, the rest stuck well and stayed down. I was a little nonplussed, but I learned to live with it.

 
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neil_w

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Stunk up my workshop pretty good, and I KNOW those fumes can't be good for me. Another reason I'm thinking of going to Acrylics.
On the other hand, the Tamiya acrylics stink like nothing I've ever used. I tried a bottle of their black thinking "water-based" meant "odor-free". Not so. :eek:

Right now I'm experimenting with Vallejo for brushwork, very little odor. Not as durable as the enamels or lacquers from what I gather, but OK for my purposes.
 

beantownJPL

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Amazing job. WAY more patience required than I have for a little Estes LPR kit!
 

IluvRocketry14

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i don't use Krylon, I use Rustoleum. It's a different formula and cures more like rubber in the early stages. I prefer Rustoleum
 

beeblebrox

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i don't use Krylon, I use Rustoleum. It's a different formula and cures more like rubber in the early stages. I prefer Rustoleum
You just need to use the right Krylon... Rustoleum sucks. THIS Krylon works, it's like the stuff from 30 years ago. The stuff from Small*Mart is

You can get it here: https://www.fullsource.com

1b075ad5-162e-45af-98b6-3457a248acf8.jpg
 

Cmac

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...Finally, why Kilz primer? I'm curious...
My question is not a challenge. I'm too new to this for that.
Why not Kilz? That brand just seemed to me to be the natural choice.
What style or brand do you like for a novice builder?
I'll be taking your advice on the adhesion promoter and better quality primer.
 
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IluvRocketry14

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You just need to use the right Krylon... Rustoleum sucks. THIS Krylon works, it's like the stuff from 30 years ago. The stuff from Small*Mart is

You can get it here: https://www.fullsource.com

View attachment 406848
i disagree. I have no issue with Rustoleum. If you see my Sky shark that i painted in a bee pattern, i used Rustoleum and the finish came out amazing, i didn't even need to prime and sand the spirals away.
 

Blast it Tom!

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So... what is the recovery from this? I'm doing Chris M's "Pigasus" and had a beautiful finish going. Somebody here gave me the idea of a quick seal coat of the masked color so the if any seepage got under the tape it's be the masked-off color, not the color you're spraying. So yeah, the white was the Rustoleum "Painter's Touch" 2x stuff, as our hapless thread starter here, I waited about a half an our and oversprayed with Tamiya pink (yes, I'd tested on scrap). But I got two areas of wrinkle, one about the size of a quarter and two thin lines of wrinkle along the launch lug, It's a mess. I sanded and re-shot after 24 hours and it's sill ugly, but not as bad. It wasn't universal, just two spots.

Would a longer cure possibly help? What can I use to smooth the roughness created by the wrinkles, I sure don't want to sand down to a paper body tube.

Thanks to all for the additional resources!
 

samb

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...

Would a longer cure possibly help? What can I use to smooth the roughness created by the wrinkles, I sure don't want to sand down to a paper body tube.

...
Possibly, but I've seen reports of this happening after a week of the base coat crying. Sanding out the wrinkles is the only way I know to fix this. You have to decide how smooth "smooth" is for yourself. If you can see or feel it it will show. My current working hypothesis, always subject to change with new knowledge, is that this happens when some unmixed propellant and carrier chemicals from the second spraying hits the surface. Paint brand doesn't matter <ducks>. Possible reasons for it:

clogged nozzle
incomplete mix
the rocket gods messin' with you

I try to remember to clear the nozzle when I finish using a can that I will be reusing. Some folks keep extra nozzles in paint thinner. I understand aftermarket nozzles are a thing but I haven't tried them. I almost always give my cans a warm water soak before use. When I think I've shaken them enough I'll go another 30 seconds. When I do all that and it happens again, I'll wipe the wrinkled area as quickly as possible before it dries so I have less to sand.
 

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