K.A.T.E

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CPUTommy

Thrust cures All
Anyone running this setup?

If so, Any issues/problems ?

Thanks,
Tom

Bat-mite

Rocketeer in MD
I've seen it demoed a few times and it seems like a really cool thing. I would love to have one, but the price point excludes me. Even if my club bought the receiving system, I couldn't afford the transmitter!

CPUTommy

Thrust cures All
Model: Mx110 Transmitter
Price: $895 Includes transmitter, battery, USB cable, 110V USB charger, 12V USB charger and User Manual. Model: Mx120 Receiver Price:$1395

Includes receiver, batteries, audio cable, USB cable, User Manual and Quick Start Guide.

I need a winter project, and im pretty sure the rocket has to be built "around" Kates Transmitter, I told my wife today at lunch that there is another woman.. Her name is Kate... She wasent amused, until I played some of the sound files.. Then it was ..

Kate is kinda cool...

im pretty sure that's the first step to acquisition. I mean, it is like an insurance policy right ??

H_Rocket

Death by Powerpoint
KATE would likely be responsible for DBR

"Divorce by Rocketry"

But if you want to go down in flames try out the Black Magic Missile Works UFC3 Flight Management System - the god emperor of altimeters

$6825 for a full system. Add$2800 for a digital data down link.

:flyingpig:

CPUTommy

Thrust cures All
She Purchased yet another "designer" dog with no input from me.. Guess Fair is Fair..

Her "Honney look what I got"
Me " awwwwwww"

is it wrong to assume that will work the opposite way?

Me "honney, check this out"

Bat-mite

Rocketeer in MD
Kate is very WOW-oriented, but a cheaper combo of downloadable altimeter and GPS tracker can provide the same information. If hearing it talk to you during flight, realizing that you could still lose or destroy the transmitter on any flight, is that important to you, go for it!

The better scenario, in my mind, is to have the club buy the receiver, and then club members get into a group buy for the transmitter, and share it for high altitude launches.

Salvage-1

Certified
Yes, KATE is WOW... but, if you want to stand there and listen to your rocket talk to you on the way up, tell you where your rocket lands, and even walk you to it...

TeleMetrum or TeleMega will do the same thing..

Bobfly

I have been flying the KATE System for a year now. Vern's system works great! Launch audiences love the realtime flight tracking audio which gets played over the PA system. I just purchased a second rocket unit to use in the event that one of my rockets lands in a tree.

Having a second rocket unit will allow you to fly another rocket while waiting for the tree climber. I ended up in a tree during June's URRG three day event. The club's tree climber, nicknamed Squirrel, was able to retrieve my rocket in five hours. There were so many rockets in the trees that some flyers had to have their rockets mailed back to them days later.

Vern is working on a staging altimeter that will communicate with Kate. Kate can then transmit the data to your handset.

Yes the the system is expensive. I think the quality and function justify the price. A Club could purchase a complete unit and charge flyers a per flight cost for its use. A couple of friends could share a unit and the cost.

All the best,
Bob

CPUTommy

Thrust cures All
Oh my gawd... "it may have shreaded"

Wow !!!

OverTheTop

Well-Known Member
TRF Supporter
Remember the Altus Metrum systems can do voice announcing of the telemetry if you particularly want that.

I have a couple of TeleMega units. They are worth the money just for the "free" software. V.Happy.

mpitfield

Moderator
Staff member
Global Mod
I have two Altus Metrum TeleGPS units which I use with my TeleBT to Android over AltosDroid and the TeleDongle to my MacBook Air using either the TeleGPS app or AltosUI app. Everything works great, except that you cannot download and cache the maps which that feature really needs to be added. Overall great value for the money and the owners have been very helpful and responsive. I would highly recommend

Having said that I am purchasing the full KATE setup at the end of the year, which I plan on using for my L3 and have already set-up one of my rockets to use it in the nosecone, simply by sliding out my TeleGPS and sliding in KATE. KATE is relatively pricey compared to the Altus Metrum products, however I plan on pushing the altitude for my L3 and I have some lofty goals once I get my L3, so I see KATE as the next step up. In my opinion this is not an either or decision but more the right solution depending on what you are planning on attempting, and just another tool in the toolbox.

plugger

Well-Known Member
I have two Altus Metrum TeleGPS units which I use with my TeleBT to Android over AltosDroid and the TeleDongle to my MacBook Air using either the TeleGPS app or AltosUI app. Everything works great, except that you cannot download and cache the maps which that feature really needs to be added. Overall great value for the money and the owners have been very helpful and responsive. I would highly recommend.
Hi Michael,

FYI the pre-caching of maps is a feature that's already available in both the AltosUI and AltosDriod. In AltosDriod it's somewhat convoluted but is definitely doable. It's available in the Setup -> Preload Maps feature of the app.

I find KATE/LISA much more impressive than the Altus line personally but I don't own a LISA and instead own a number of Altus Metrum products. The price point is what primarily keeps me away. The size of the unit is also a little larger than what I'd like as well. And while Vern is working on some staging and deployment hardware to integrate with LISA from what I've seen the staging board talks to the LISA transmitter via a wireless link. Given I normally fly staging attempts with CF airframes I don't think I'm really keen on an RF based staging board. That's the main reason why I've already picked up an EasyMega.

We've got a club LISA and I'm not really comfortable with using it for fear of having something go pear shaped and being up for an out of pocket replacement.

VernK

Member/Vendor
TRF Supporter
... And while Vern is working on some staging and deployment hardware to integrate with LISA from what I've seen the staging board talks to the LISA transmitter via a wireless link. Given I normally fly staging attempts with CF airframes I don't think I'm really keen on an RF based staging board.
The Kate/Lisa RF link to the new staging and deployment modules works fine even in CF airframes. This is because the distance is so short between the transmitter in the nosecone and the staging/deployment module elsewhere in the CF airframe. The transmitter is sending out a high power signal in order to have a long range to the ground. CF attenuates the signal but does not block it completely. There is plenty of signal for the staging/deployment module to "listen to" even inside a CF airframe.

MGL

mpitfield

Moderator
Staff member
Global Mod
Hi Michael,

FYI the pre-caching of maps is a feature that's already available in both the AltosUI and AltosDriod. In AltosDriod it's somewhat convoluted but is definitely doable. It's available in the Setup -> Preload Maps feature of the app.
Ahh yes so you are correct, however in order for it to work on my Mac running v 1.7 I have to manually input the lat/long in order to the load the map as the drop down "site list" does not populate when off-line.

Bobfly

By the way, MAC Performance makes a wonderful nosecone installation kit for the KATE unit. Mike Crupe will even install his kit into a Wildman filament wound fiberglass Von Karman nosecone for you. It is so quick and easy to swap out the KATE unit to install it into another rocket.

Vern you should tell the Forum members about your repair service for a damaged rocket unit. After talking to flyers at the field and reading this thread, you may be loosing sales to people that are worrying about destroying the unit on one flight. Clubs could collect a per flight fee for use of the air frame unit. This could serve as an insurance policy for repair or replacement of a damaged unit.

Vern doesn't your unit put out a full watt of power? I know that the Missile Works RTx/GPS doesn't put out this much transmission power. I don't know how much power the Altus Metrum TeleGPG Systems put out.

The Multitronix KATE System is expensive. The quality and functionality of the system justify the expense. I agree with Michael. The KATE System is a high quality system that is a great tool in the box. When you are working on a Level 3 size project the KATE System is the best tool in the box.

All the best,
Bob

VernK

Member/Vendor
TRF Supporter
Vern doesn't your unit put out a full watt of power? I know that the Missile Works RTx/GPS doesn't put out this much transmission power. I don't know how much power the Altus Metrum TeleGPG Systems put out.
Yes, the Kate transmitter will output one full watt of RF power. Actually, it manages the power level depending the altitude and distance back to the launch pad. 0.1W prior to launch, 0.5W at liftoff and 1.0W at greater than 75,000 feet. The system was designed for high reliability and extremely long range. It has been range tested on the ground to 320,000 feet (60 miles) and still had good signal margins and a solid RF link.

So far to date, there have been no known flights with this system that have failed to track. I have analyzed the data from over 100 flights provided by users and from my own demo flights. In every single case, the GPS had lock well before apogee and throughout the rest of the flight. In every single case, the downlink was solid throughout the flight. This includes the flight in the video that Jim posted above where things went bad at about Mach 3.7.

plugger

Well-Known Member
The Kate/Lisa RF link to the new staging and deployment modules works fine even in CF airframes. This is because the distance is so short between the transmitter in the nosecone and the staging/deployment module elsewhere in the CF airframe. The transmitter is sending out a high power signal in order to have a long range to the ground. CF attenuates the signal but does not block it completely. There is plenty of signal for the staging/deployment module to "listen to" even inside a CF airframe.
That's great information Vern, thanks for sharing. I suspect once I progress to staging a 4" to 3" rocket I'll most likely attempt it with one of your units. We've got a club unit but I'm too afraid to use it given the cost and form factor combined with the fact that I personally own 5 different GPS tracking/telemetry boards.

plugger

Well-Known Member
Ahh yes so you are correct, however in order for it to work on my Mac running v 1.7 I have to manually input the lat/long in order to the load the map as the drop down "site list" does not populate when off-line.
Correct. Hence my "it's somewhat convoluted" comment. I reckon I tried to do it 4-5 times in AltusDroid before I was successful. Every misstep required me to restart from the beginning.