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Wanted Info on the new Der Big Red Max (9721)

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K'Tesh

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I'm going to try to sim it guys... So, if someone could get the the essentials, I'd appreciate it.

John Boren told me it's a true upscale, but I still need some info.

Body Tube lengths, ODs/IDs, The dimensions of the parts, a good scan of the fins w/ruler for scale. Scans of the instructions. Photos of the nosecone w/ruler, measurements of the NC (OD, shoulder length and diameter etc.), and the tethering point for the shock cord would be appreciated.

I know the thickness of the fins (1/8"), I suspect the CRs are .050" thick.

Thanks!
 

K'Tesh

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Ok... got a photo from FB of the tethering point... Reminds me of the Big Daddy's ramp, but it seems to have a longer intact section.
1611358159673.png
Photo: Paul Wolaver
 

K'Tesh

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I've seen a photo of the sticker sheets (yes, stickers, not waterslide decals)...
🙁
No white MITT GRABBEN, NICHT STOMPIN, or nosecone decals visible...
WHAT???!!! No TOP SECRET decal?!!!
 

Arsenal78

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I've seen a picture of all the pieces. The fins are made out of 3 pieces of 1/8" balsa per fin and the centering rings are the flimsy cardstock ones. It doesn't deserve the Pro Series name.
 

kyle

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I've got one on order, once it gets here I'll let you know and measure whatever you want. Unless someone else does it first.
 

Scott_650

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I've seen a picture of all the pieces. The fins are made out of 3 pieces of 1/8" balsa per fin and the centering rings are the flimsy cardstock ones. It doesn't deserve the Pro Series name.
Same kind of components are used in the Star Orbiter, Super Big Bertha and Doorknob. The current PSII kits are designed to fly safely on adapted 24mm BP D and E motors as well as BP 29mm motors - the older style PSII kits were designed for the Aerotech APC motors Estes bought and relabeled. As much as we in the enthusiast world hold those rockets like Leviathan, MDRM, Partizon, etc in high regard they weren’t big sellers for Estes during the Hobbico years. Unless Estes plans on developing higher powered motors than the 29mm BP Es and Fs the PSII line will follow the same dual powered pattern as the current versions. With all the great 2-4” kits available from other vendors I can’t get all nostalgic about those 2010s PSII kits. Besides Toby Vanderbeek will be happy to sell clones of those kits to anyone who wants them.
 

nelie61

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I've seen a picture of all the pieces. The fins are made out of 3 pieces of 1/8" balsa per fin and the centering rings are the flimsy cardstock ones. It doesn't deserve the Pro Series name.
Does it have the ply center with the balsa covering for the fins? Do you know?(that would be the 3 pcs.) And through the wall I would think? I don't mind card stock cr's as they can be beefed up easily
 

Eljay

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Besides Toby Vanderbeek will be happy to sell clones of those kits to anyone who wants them.
Toby also has plywood upgrades for the current lineup at very reasonable prices. I imagine he'll do it for the 3" as well.
 

Scott_650

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Does it have the ply center with the balsa covering for the fins? Do you know?(that would be the 3 pcs.) And through the wall I would think? I don't mind card stock cr's as they can be beefed up easily
Nope - solid 1/8” thick balsa (or tung wood, balsa is at a premium right now) fins.
 

Scott_650

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It’s been interesting watching the reactions to this kit - from total disdain bordering on contempt to mild enthusiasm to folks constantly refreshing the Estes website until they can place their order. People are sure funny critters.
 

Scott_650

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Oh, I thought the new DBRM was a 4" diameter. A bit lame for a 3" kit then Compared to the OG
As has already been much discussed, the current PSII rockets have a much different focus than the 2010s rockets - as I said earlier unless Estes comes up with a motor with more power than the BP 29mm motors they now sell they aren’t going to design anything that has a reasonable finished weight much over 14-15 oz. Plywood fins, centering rings and thicker wall tubes add too much weight for a safe, stable flight over an engine putting out a total impulse of 49.6ish N/sec and max thrust of 29ish Newtons.
 

K'Tesh

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Does it have the ply center with the balsa covering for the fins? Do you know?(that would be the 3 pcs.) And through the wall I would think? I don't mind card stock cr's as they can be beefed up easily
If you securely glue your fin's tabs to the motor tube, you only need the forward CR to prevent the escape of gasses from the ejection charge. I'll be modifying mine to allow me to apply internal fillets (I'll add holes to the middle CR to allow epoxy to flow into the forward section), and leave the rear CR off, until the internal fillets are done.
 

nelie61

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It’s been interesting watching the reactions to this kit - from total disdain bordering on contempt to mild enthusiasm to folks constantly refreshing the Estes website until they can place their order. People are sure funny critters.
I'll pick one up when AC Supply gets them in they say in late JAN. I can surely wait. I just looked at the Estes website and you can add one to the cart they are in stock. I think with the $49.99 price they offer the free ship on them or add a pack of wadding or something to get it to $50 for the free ship
 

Scott_650

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I'll pick one up when AC Supply gets them in they say in late JAN. I can surely wait. I just looked at the Estes website and you can add one to the cart they are in stock. I think with the $49.99 price they offer the free ship on them or add a pack of wadding or something to get it to $50 for the free ship
You don’t need to add anything - they round up to the nearest buck and include the shipping.
 

K'Tesh

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Update on the ramp... I've seen photos on FB that compare the BD and the DBRM nosecones and they are (from the shoulder back) identical as far as I can tell (w/o having a sample or measurements). Again, this is the part that is inside the body tube, and not the external section.
 

Philip Tiberius D.

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I've seen a photo of the sticker sheets (yes, stickers, not waterslide decals)...
🙁
No white MITT GRABBEN, NICHT STOMPIN, or nosecone decals visible...
WHAT???!!! No TOP SECRET decal?!!!
Stickershock23 here I come.
 

Philip Tiberius D.

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Same kind of components are used in the Star Orbiter, Super Big Bertha and Doorknob. The current PSII kits are designed to fly safely on adapted 24mm BP D and E motors as well as BP 29mm motors - the older style PSII kits were designed for the Aerotech APC motors Estes bought and relabeled. As much as we in the enthusiast world hold those rockets like Leviathan, MDRM, Partizon, etc in high regard they weren’t big sellers for Estes during the Hobbico years. Unless Estes plans on developing higher powered motors than the 29mm BP Es and Fs the PSII line will follow the same dual powered pattern as the current versions. With all the great 2-4” kits available from other vendors I can’t get all nostalgic about those 2010s PSII kits. Besides Toby Vanderbeek will be happy to sell clones of those kits to anyone who wants them.
And I’m sure he’s planning on improvements for centering rings and fins as well
 

Arsenal78

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Stickershock23 here I come.
Wonder if Estes is joining the Political Correctness movement by not adding any German decalings? They'll lose a lot of DRM fans for that, though I feel like they already have with the crappy fin job
 

Philip Tiberius D.

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Wonder if Estes is joining the Political Correctness movement by not adding any German decalings? They'll lose a lot of DRM fans for that, though I feel like they already have with the crappy fin job
I just watched the video from James Duffy he posted on here... Estes has the WWI Iron Cross and Skull on the decals. I hadn’t opened mine yet to check.
 

Scott_650

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O
I've seen a photo of the sticker sheets (yes, stickers, not waterslide decals)...
🙁
No white MITT GRABBEN, NICHT STOMPIN, or nosecone decals visible...
WHAT???!!! No TOP SECRET decal?!!!
Both those decals are on the sheet per James Duffy’s unboxing video.
 

K'Tesh

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Thanks for the link :)

Still, I dIdn't see *WHITE* MITT GRABBEN, NICHT STOMPIN, or the nosecone decals, nor the TOP SECRET decal in the video.

1611760482662.png
In the image (above) I've outlined the decals that appeared in the original decal sheet in red.
 
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Arsenal78

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Definitely missing a few decals. Guess they did become PC..... and did the guy in the video really say decAl?
 
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