Hybrids 2021

[ContrailRockets]

In the 98mm motor the NOS reduced from 5300cc to 4100cc in a 36 inch motor. As a reference the 75mm M-1491 has 3200cc of NOS. Goal of the 36 inch 98mm M is $100 reloads for L3 flights in hybrids. The existing certified 98mm M-1575 has 113 inches of surface area that motor with a 42 star grain jumps to over 600 inches of surface area. Drop in vortex injectors are being tested. The smaller 36 inch 98mm has 200 inches of surface area in just a six inch grain. Great fuel regression and star pattern still visible in burnt grain.

 

[DRAGON64]

I am down for one of these motor systems, and I would like to know as soon as one can be purchased.

 

[DRAGON64]

Looks like you have fired at least one... please post videos!!

 

[tfish]

I was given a PML Cygnus rocket kit that was designed for hybrid motors. https://m.publicmissiles.com/hybrid_ready_kits.aspx

Has anyone in here been Jonesing for one of these?

Proceeds to go to local high school rocket STEM program.

photos tomorrow if anyone wants some.

Tony

 

[Chad]

I've been fascinated with hybrids since day 1 of getting into the HPR hobby. Once my L3 cert flight is over and done with (hopefully September) count me in for a motor

 

[drewnickel]

I've been fascinated with hybrids since day 1 of getting into the HPR hobby. Once my L3 cert flight is over and done with (hopefully September) count me in for a motor

Tom with Contrail Rockets would be the go-to guy. There is a large learning curve with hybrids, but his motors are simple and reliable. Definitely recommend a certified motor before getting into research hybrids.

 

[ericm541]

I'm interested, send some pics, and how much are you looking to get?

 

[ContrailRockets]

Hybrid rocket motor do not need to be long and hybrid motors will fit in standard kits plus no need to drill a vent hole for a vent line in your rocket.
Contrail Rockets continued to supply flyers thru COVID and in fact continued development of newer products. The latest innovation is the internal vented hybrid motors in both 54 mm and 38 mm.
Assembly and firing of the 20 inch J-300 Black Smoke can be seen on my YouTube channel.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqEfRF3D07y21UTmivI546g
This pre TMT certified motor is producing an amazing 2.12 Newtons per cc of NOS.
Features include;
CNVA injector the 1200 rpm hollow cone of NOS improves burning and moves the flame front to the top of the grain. This is enhanced with the Ring of Fire ignition cup inserted in the CNVA baffle. This baffle is drilled and designed for an Internal Vent so vent gas adds to combustion process and is not wasted and as a bonus no need to drill holes for vent lines in your rocket. With a the unique 4 inch long pleated 13 star Black Smoke grain it has 72 inches of surface area.
The Internal Vented 54 mm 20 inch hybrid motor is one of many innovations coming out of Contrail Rockets. You can download a copy of the 54 mm Internally Vented Hybrid Motor Manual on my new website under construction. www.contrailrockets.net
Once the new website is completely merged with all the existing certified Contrail Rockets existing motors and reloads from the older website the webdesigner will begin adding exciting new products and features never seen in the hobby hybrid motors market.

 

[crossfire]

Hybrid rocket motor do not need to be long and hybrid motors will fit in standard kits plus no need to drill a vent hole for a vent line in your rocket.
Contrail Rockets continued to supply flyers thru COVID and in fact continued development of newer products. The latest innovation is the internal vented hybrid motors in both 54 mm and 38 mm.
Assembly and firing of the 20 inch J-300 Black Smoke can be seen on my YouTube channel.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqEfRF3D07y21UTmivI546g
This pre TMT certified motor is producing an amazing 2.12 Newtons per cc of NOS.
Features include;
CNVA injector the 1200 rpm hollow cone of NOS improves burning and moves the flame front to the top of the grain. This is enhanced with the Ring of Fire ignition cup inserted in the CNVA baffle. This baffle is drilled and designed for an Internal Vent so vent gas adds to combustion process and is not wasted and as a bonus no need to drill holes for vent lines in your rocket. With a the unique 4 inch long pleated 13 star Black Smoke grain it has 72 inches of surface area.
The Internal Vented 54 mm 20 inch hybrid motor is one of many innovations coming out of Contrail Rockets. You can download a copy of the 54 mm Internally Vented Hybrid Motor Manual on my new website under construction. www.contrailrockets.net
Once the new website is completely merged with all the existing certified Contrail Rockets existing motors and reloads from the older website the webdesigner will begin adding exciting new products and features never seen in the hobby hybrid motors market.

I watched the video of motor assembly. Only question I have the vent tube is connected to forward closure, so how does nox get into vent tube?
Thanks

 

[ContrailRockets]

I watched the video of motor assembly. Only question I have the vent tube is connected to forward closure, so how does nox get into vent tube?
Thanks
Hole in silver fittings which is attached to brass plug. Allows existing top bulkhead to have vent removed and plug and internal vent installed. Still requires replacement of injector baffle with new internal vent baffle

 

[crossfire]

View attachment 470520

Got it

 

[ContrailRockets]

Internal vented baffle with custom machines compression fitting that allows 1/8 inch vent line to pass from the NOS tank and into the combustion chamber to ultimately exit the motor nozzle. The injector baffle is weight reduced by machining excess aluminum between o-ring grooves.

 

[DRAGON64]

Do you have a timeline on when or if these will go to cert? Or are these going to be more oriented for research?

 

[Dan Griffing]

Do you have a timeline on when or if these will go to cert? Or are these going to be more oriented for research?

I called Tom earlier today and he said that the whole cert package is nearly ready to send off.

I’ll join others in celebrating these new hybrid certifications because it will make these great new motors available for many people to use in rockets that can use either hybrid or AP motors.

 

[Dan Griffing]

Tom with Contrail Rockets would be the go-to guy. There is a large learning curve with hybrids, but his motors are simple and reliable. Definitely recommend a certified motor before getting into research hybrids.

I’m hoping that I can use a 75mm x 36” certified Contrail hybrid M motor for my L3 certification sometime next year. Among other things, it will cost much less than an equivalent AP motor if you already have access to ground support equipment and NOS.

But it will probably help to have hybrid motor experience with other smaller rockets. That’s why I’m looking forward to using the new hybrid J300 motor. Its thrust curve data is quite close to the Loki J300-LR but its a pound heavier.

 

[OzHybrid]

I like your Manuel section. Very Spanish.

Any new hybrid is great day.

A hybrid doesn't have to be long......29mm 48 inch long...... If you are burning a standard lump of machined polypropylene, lets say, it's going to be long-ish if the tank and the combustion chamber are the same dia. If you took a fatter tank and attached it to a smaller long combustion chamber you could produce a lighter fatter overall motor then a standard full length 29mm motor. As the dia gets larger you can start to play with shaped propellant. Really not practical at the 29mm dia and a lump of plastic. I did a mock up using some RattWorks bits a few years ago. 29mm combustion section attached to 64mm tank came out lighter than 36inch full 29mm. Sort of like a machined version of a Hypertek.
Good luck with the new motor and feel free to use any of my ideas..... open source.

 

[ContrailRockets]

Yes our first motor after a long hiatus is in route to TMT motor testing committee.
As manufactured we are seeing that long hybrid kits are limited. The goal at Contrail Rockets is to reduce motor length while improving performance. We will continue to support our existing customers as we expand our motor line using innovations like the internal vent and the CNVA to allow for shorter motors lighter in weight higher in performance while eliminating the top or side vent we and other manufacturers provided.
While a 48 inch 29 mm hybrid motor is possible few customers want to build around that long a motor. The yet to be shipped to TMT 11.25 long 54 mm internally vented hybrid is more flyer friendly than a 48 inch 29 mm.

 

[ericm541]

Yes our first motor after a long hiatus is in route to TMT motor testing committee.
As manufactured we are seeing that long hybrid kits are limited. The goal at Contrail Rockets is to reduce motor length while improving performance. We will continue to support our existing customers as we expand our motor line using innovations like the internal vent and the CNVA to allow for shorter motors lighter in weight higher in performance while eliminating the top or side vent we and other manufacturers provided.
While a 48 inch 29 mm hybrid motor is possible few customers want to build around that long a motor. The yet to be shipped to TMT 11.25 long 54 mm internally vented hybrid is more flyer friendly than a 48 inch 29 mm.

So if your goal is to reduce motor length plus improve performance, will this change what your currently selling for hardware?

 

[ContrailRockets]

as an example in the 54 mm line Contrail ROcke ts had the 28, 36, 48 and 60 inch cases. Those motors and reloads are still certified and still being sold. In the new Internally vented Motors that have the CNVA, CNVA Baffle and the Ring of Fire ignition Certification around new motors is starting with the 20 inch 54 mm motor. That will be expanded to include an 11.25 54 mm hybrid with 250 cc of NOS and the existing 28 mm motor with new internals. I have yet to see a demand in the longer cases to justify certifying them with the new features. The same will hold true in the 38 mm motor line only the shorter motors will be sent in internally vented. The 16, 20 and 28 inch motors are being tested for submission to the TMT Motor Testing Committee. As we are packing more performance in the shorter motors it will reduce the demand for the longer cases. I have yet to evaluate a shorter case in 38 mm since the G-100 with the upgrades becomes an H-100.

 

[DRAGON64]

I have the original 98mm system, so I would be down for the new 98mm; 76mm and 54mm systems as they become available... cash is burning the proverbial hole-in-the-pocket so to speak.

 

[wbeggs]

Contrail Fast Fill NOS Solenoid Valve

Contrail Rockets is proud to announce that is the exclusive dealer for the new "Contrail Fast Fill" solenoid valve. This monster 12 volt solenoid valve has 1/2 NPT. This NOS valve is designed for continuous duty. The existing NOS valves from Pratt Hobbies have a manufacture recommended on time of only 5 minutes. The Contrail Fast Fill valve uses only 11 watts of power less than 1/3 of the power consumption of the BFV.

This valve has a massive 375 orifice with an area of .1104 that is almost 10 times larger than a BFV.

You want faster fills?

You want a valve to fill monster hybrid motors? View attachment 459525View attachment 459526View attachment 459529

How much do these solenoids run and how do you purchase them? I was on the Contrail website and didn't see anything specific to the solenoids. Thank you

 

[ContrailRockets]

Search on www.contrailrockets.net
CFF. Or solenoid
That is valve only. Have yet to work out manifold prices. 1/2 NPT .375 orfice continuous duty. My personal valves in case

 

[Neutronium95]

Hybrid rocket motor do not need to be long and hybrid motors will fit in standard kits plus no need to drill a vent hole for a vent line in your rocket.
Contrail Rockets continued to supply flyers thru COVID and in fact continued development of newer products. The latest innovation is the internal vented hybrid motors in both 54 mm and 38 mm.
Assembly and firing of the 20 inch J-300 Black Smoke can be seen on my YouTube channel.
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCqEfRF3D07y21UTmivI546g
This pre TMT certified motor is producing an amazing 2.12 Newtons per cc of NOS.
Features include;
CNVA injector the 1200 rpm hollow cone of NOS improves burning and moves the flame front to the top of the grain. This is enhanced with the Ring of Fire ignition cup inserted in the CNVA baffle. This baffle is drilled and designed for an Internal Vent so vent gas adds to combustion process and is not wasted and as a bonus no need to drill holes for vent lines in your rocket. With a the unique 4 inch long pleated 13 star Black Smoke grain it has 72 inches of surface area.
The Internal Vented 54 mm 20 inch hybrid motor is one of many innovations coming out of Contrail Rockets. You can download a copy of the 54 mm Internally Vented Hybrid Motor Manual on my new website under construction. www.contrailrockets.net
Once the new website is completely merged with all the existing certified Contrail Rockets existing motors and reloads from the older website the webdesigner will begin adding exciting new products and features never seen in the hobby hybrid motors market.

I've been kind of curious about hybrids, ever since seeing them at launches when I was a kid. Now that I have my own money, I'm starting to investigate getting into them, and the new internally vented motors seem like an ideal starting point.

The video about the motor assembly was very clear and informative. I would love to see a video on how you have your GSE set up, and walk through the steps on hooking everything up, filling, and firing.

I'm also looking at costs quite closely, as I'm quite keen on saving money. Do you have an estimated cost per flight for the new 54mm motors yet? The $105 M flights are quite the incentive to go for my L3, now that I could actually use it more often.

 

[OzHybrid]

It’s not a good idea to consider hybrids as cheaper. They can be. But. One leak and your savings go away. I’ve made the nitrous oxide version of dry ice from a leak. It’s very expensive and not useful.

 

[drewnickel]

Most of the expense with hybrids involve GSE and hardware, the per-flight cost for something like an H motor can be $15 or less and for an M motor around $100-$200. If you plan on flying a lot with the same or similar hardware hybrids can be far more cost effective than solids. Regarding GSE, in most cases you'll have to buy or make your own (Tom's GSE would be a great starting point if you're fine with a wired setup, if you're going to an event like BALLS it may be beneficial to get a wireless unit rather than drag a half mile of extension cords out). A lot of clubs used to carry hybrid GSE, but largely abandoned them in favor of AP. That being said Music City Missile Club in Hopkinsville Kentucky hosts the UT Knoxville spaceport team, which usually brings hybrid GSE to launches. They also frequently go to Tripoli Mid-Ohio.

 

[Joe Scuti]

They call it a liquid engine but it's a copied rattworks tribrid.

 

[Neutronium95]

They call it a liquid engine but it's a copied rattworks tribrid.

They've done a few more static fires since that flight attempt, and are going to try again later this month. They've also been working on some different size liquids using the same design concepts and principles. I've been astounded at how cheaply they were able to make a working liquid engine.

 

[Dan Griffing]

I was at the July 29 - August 1 LDRS-39 were over 250 registered rocketeers had 950 launches over the four day event.

It was a most glorious event on the Bonneville Salt Flats but disappointingly, I did not see a single hybrid motor launch.

I saw several remarkable performances by rockets with experimental KNO3/sorbitol motors and was surprised to know that they were permitted, but no hybrids whatsoever.

 

[kramer714]

November Lucerne - Hybrids

I'm gonna bring my Hybrid stuff to the November 13 ROC launch at lucerne if anyone wants to join me. Let me know if you are planning or even thinking about it... so I can plan to have enough gas. See my RATT 29 post too,

Mike Kramer

 

[kramer714]

RATT 29"

It seems I have ended up collecting a number of RATT 29 motors and have flown them a bunch. The collection includes H70 I80 I90 and J160 29mm Rattworks.

I designed a 3d printed 'ratt accessory pack' consisting of a 3d printed fincan, mid motor rail guide, 'top o' the ratt' adapter to 38mm tube, and a tiny av bay for an eggtimer apogee altimeter that fits inside a 38mm coupler. The only thing you need to add is the 38mm tube for the chute, a nosecone, and short coupler. So, here is the deal, if you have a 29mm ratt and a reload, let me know in advance that you will be going to November ROC launch and I will give you the 3d printed parts, free, yup free for the ratt accessory pack. You add the nosecone, coupler, altimeter and bulkhead.

But you have to show up and launch.

I will mail you the 'head end pieces' (or send the STL file) so you can have the altimeter ready. I will bring the fincan and rail guide up to the launch.