How Low Can You Go?

[gpoehlein]

Well, I got the Micromax bug again (50 engines in the starter set just begging to be lit off!), so I decided to see if I could shrink the FlisKits Midnight Express down to micromax scale. The answer is yes, but it wasn't easy. If I was going to do it again, I'd probably use 24# paper instead of 110# cardstock (it rolls and folds a lot easier). And a couple of pieces (the nosecone shoulder, engine block and launch lug) had to be modified a bit to make them work, but here is the result. On the left is my full sized Midnight Goblin (a Goblin "repaint" of the ME), and to the right is one of Quest's RTF Micromax rockets, the Vector I. In the center is the Micro ME, in all it's glory!

BTW, if anyone wants to try this, print the pdf file at 37% scale. And be sure to form the body tube around a couple of micromax engines.

Greg

 

[brianc]

That's pretty cool! <img src="https://rocketryforum.com/images/icons/icon14.gif">

They passed out a couple of RTF's and a pack of MM motors in the NARAM goodie
bag, so I might just have to try the ME too!

 

[jflis]

OH man, that's beautiful! Those fins must have been a real BEAR though!

 

[gpoehlein]

Originally posted by jflis
OH man, that's beautiful! Those fins must have been a real BEAR though!

OH YEAH!

Yup, the fins were tough - You gotta score the cardstock with the xacto knife, then use very fine forceps to fold the tabs. If I had to do it all over, I think I'd just cut off the tabs and glue the two layers together!

It was worth it, though!

Greg

 

[powderburner]

Originally posted by gpoehlein
Yup, the fins were tough

Maybe -that- is the place where you should have used the 110-lb cardstock, and just cut them out single thickness like you would from a sheet of balsa.

Then again, why chop up an entire sheet of cardstock, you could have used some scrap notecard?

 

[gpoehlein]

What I would do (if I were to do it over) is to print the whole rocket on cardstock and cut the folded parts off the fins, thus just leaving the left and right sides of the fins connected. Then I would score between the two sides, fold them together and glue them with a very thin layer of white glue. I've discovered if you spread the glue with a cotton swab, it usually won't warp the fin. By leaving them connected and folding them over, you put the fold on the leading edge of the fin.The nose cone is also a bit tricky when printed on card stock, but it is doable.

Greg

 

[lalligood]

SCHWEEEET!

Both the ME micromaxx downscale & Goblin wrap scheme are way cool...

Is there any chance (& with Jim's approval) can you post the Goblin-ized ME wrap?

Thanks for sharing

 

[jflis]

Another suggestion for those fins is what you said (cut away all the folding tabs leaving just the left/right sides of the fins) then use a perminant glue stick. I have had great success with those on the CRLIP (Caution rocket). Holds fast and no warpage.

Oh, by the way, it seems that if you print this out on a full sheet of card stock, you should have enough room for a whole fleet of these beasties

 

[slim_t]

oh man, I can't believe someone beat me to this.
I suck.
I've got a MMX scale ME and CRLIP that I built weeks ago, but haven't been able to get my pics from my camera to the pc (need a new card reader).
That's it, I'm going to the PC store today.

Yours looks great BTW.
I've actually built 2 of the Micro ME's. I flew one and it disappeared. When it took off I looked straight at the sun and was blinded for a moment. I heard the pop of the ejection, but never saw anything come down. So I built another.
I'll try to post pics later today.

I also have 13mm versions of both. So now it's time to go the other direction, UPscales.

Tim

 

[BobH48]

Hey guys,

This is where you want to use COVERSTOCK which is 65 lb. paper instead of the 110 lb. cardstock. I got mine at Staples but I've seen it at Wallyworld.

It rolls so much easier when you're making small diameter tubes and is still pretty sturdy.

Try it and I think you'll find it's great for the small stuff.

And for MMX, I'm sure it's slightly lighter.

 

[slim_t]

Ok. Here's mine.
I used 110# cardstock for mine and just used some wood dowels to roll it around. That 65# sounds like it would be better, but all our Wal-Mart has is plain copy paper and the 110#.
Here's the pics.
Rocket Boy included for scale.

Tim

 

[slim_t]

oops. Here's a pic this time.

 

[slim_t]

Here's another with Rocket Boy doing his blastoff motion.
The largest ones are 18mm, then 13mm, and MMX(6mm).

Tim

 

[slim_t]

Hey Greg; Now it's time for the upscales, right?
If you do an ME, I'll do a CRLIP.
What do you say? Somewhere around 3-4X?

Tim

 

[gpoehlein]

I've already got a 2x ME ready to be printed and built - it is 1.44" diameter. Did it a while back, but never got around to building it. It takes two pages just for the body tube even at that scale. Will have to do it though (heck, if I can build a 4" diameter Red Max out of cardstock, a 1.44" ME should be easy! )

Greg

 

[Bill]

Originally posted by gpoehlein
Well, I got the Micromax bug again (50 engines in the starter set just begging to be lit off!)

Check out this downsized cluster...unfortunately, only one motor lit, but it was still a good flight.

https://www.aarg.org/nsl/gee-sun/pages/page_97.html


Bill

 

[jflis]

Yea, that's my MMX Deuce's Wild! (Diminutive Deuce). I've flown it 6 times, 3 times with good ignition on both motors (it took Bill Spadafora to show me how to do that...), but she's stable on just one (3 for 3)

jim

 

[slim_t]

Originally posted by gpoehlein
(heck, if I can build a 4" diameter Red Max out of cardstock, a 1.44" ME should be easy! )
Greg

A 4" out of card stock!?
Really? Wow! How did it turn out?
I might have to try that sometime.

Tim

 

[sandman]

OK you guys...I feel the need...the need for MICRO!!

This thread is a challange!!

More coming tonight!! hehehe

sandman

 

[slim_t]

Hey Jim;

I was planning to build a Micro Deuce, but haven't tried yet since I thought I had read that you didn't have much luck with yours.
Obviously you've had better luck than I thought .
So what's the trick to getting it to work?

Tim

 

[jflis]

Some *hot* igniters that Bill created

I am excited about the new igniter that Quest is coming out with. I talked with Bill (Stine) at NARAM about clustering MMX and he felt that these could do the job, but didn't have any experience.

I will let you know soon as I hope to try them out next week.

 

[sandman]

I am an EVIL GENIUS I tell you!!!

I did my paper wraps drawings for my Saturn 1B in CAD and one of the features is the ability to resize any drawing by as little as 1/10th of one per cent...sooo.

This uses the T-4 tube from Totally tubular .448" in diameter for the old Apogee Micro motors.

This seemed like a good size to me.

sandman

 

[sandman]

This is a sheet of completed patterns for a MicroMaxx Saturn 1B.

I haven't glued the fins on yet...my eyes were getting a little tired even with a magnifier!

You have to be pretty good with a pair of scissors for this one!

I can get six on an 8.5" X 11" sheet of 34# glossy stock.

sandman

 

[Elapid]

jumping jeebus!

 

[powderburner]

Originally posted by sandman
I can get six on an 8.5" X 11" sheet of 34# glossy stock.

Will you make a set available for sale? (It would ship quite nicely in a plain envelope for 37 cents!)

Or can you post a file?

Even better, can you post a few photos of the build process?

 

[sandman]

Let me figure things out first... I only came up with this idea an hour ago!

sandman

 

[jflis]

an HOUR ago?? And it ain't in production YET??!!!!?

Sheesh!

(sand, you and I need to cry over a beer or coffee sometime... LOL )

 

[sandman]

Well, I cheated a little bit!

I have the Paper Saturn 1B kit patterns finished and printed,
https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=9851
The plans were drawn in CAD so all I had to do was multiply the diameter of the new tube by Pi.

.448 x 3.1416 to get the width of the new pattern.

Measured the existing pattern that fits a BT-60 (1.637 x 3.1416).

Divide the new width I needed by the existing width.

That gives me the multiplier that I have to use to reduce the existing patterns. Hit enter and print!

The nose/cone/transition was turned on the lathe in about a minute...yea...really!

Glued the wrap on the body, glued the wrap on the transition and Service Module.

Made an escape motor out of a toothpick (seemed the right size to me!)

Now all I have to do is cut out and glue the fins on and install a Micro Maxx motor mout.

About an hour.

It's like anything else...it's easy if ya know how!

sandman

 

[gpoehlein]

Originally posted by slim_t
A 4" out of card stock!?
Really? Wow! How did it turn out?
I might have to try that sometime.

Tim

I haven't had a chance to launch it yet. I just got a 6 foot rod to try it - I bought two 3 foot lengths of 3/16" tubing and two 3 foot lengths of 5/32" rod - I plan to cut one rod in half and alternate lengths to make a 6' rod - I just hope my Bigfoot Launcher is strong enough to hold it!

The thread with pictures is over in the Scratchbuilt section; the link is here:

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10116

Greg

 

[slim_t]

Hey Sandman; what type of CAD program do you use?

BTW, that Saturn is awesome, just as cool as the bigger one your working on.

That's what awesome about drawing your own; once you get it drawn once, it's easy to make it any size.
I use AutoCAD and just draw everything 1:1 scale and when I'm finished I'll scale it to the size I want.
Also where do you get the data to draw these Saturns? I'd like to draw some of my own just for the fun of it, but haven't done any research yet.

Tim