How lose should nose cone fit

[modeler]

As the title, need your comments, should nose be loose enough but not fall by itself.
And second question, is wadding really has to be fire proof special, type of paper or it is just tp

 

[BDB]

Nose cone shouldn't fall by itself, but should if you give it a good shake.

Wadding is fireproof. You can make your own with Borax and TP (google it) or you can use cellulose insulation.

 

[rharshberger]

Many test if a nose cone is tight/loose enough by holding the rocket vertical by the nosecone, if the airframe separates from the NC its too loose.

As BDB said about wadding it is fireproof, and for about $10 at your local Home Depot/Lowes/Menards, you can get a lifetime supply, make sure its cellulose not fiberglass insulation. I still use the Estes wadding on my model rockets but only one sheet, I set the sheet in my palm and put however much cellulose insulation in the center and create a small pouch/ball that is inserted into the airframe. FYI cellulose insulation here on TRF and in rocketry in general is referred to as DOG BARF (because get it wet and see what it looks like.....)


here is a link to an example
[url]https://www.homedepot.com/p/Low-Dust-Cellulose-Blow-in-Insulation-19-lbs-Bag-INS541LD/100318635

[/URL]

 

[lcorinth]

I feel you should be able to pick up a model rocket by the nose cone, but if you wiggle it, it should start to come loose. If that doesn't happen, I put the rocket up to my mouth and blow a small puff of air into the motor tube. If I can pop the cone without too much effort, I figure it's probably OK for flight.

 

[Incongruent]

I feel you should be able to pick up a model rocket by the nose cone, but if you wiggle it, it should start to come loose. If that doesn't happen, I put the rocket up to my mouth and blow a small puff of air into the motor tube. If I can pop the cone without too much effort, I figure it's probably OK for flight.

For LPR, I test tightness by seeing if I can pull the nose cone out with my pinkie and ring finger. That being said I don't have particularly strong pinkie or ring fingers.

 

[OverTheTop]

For wadding I use party streamers (crepe paper) purchased from a reputable party supplier. They are cheap and work well.

Careful getting them from "discount" shops that have the cheap and cheerful Chinese stuff. Often it does not have flame retardant in it. You don't want flaming wads of paper wafting around after deployment. Could be embarrassing.

As for NC, +1 for being able to pick the rocket up by the NC without the airframe dropping off.

 

[Bat-mite]

If your wadding if flammable, then it will catch fire when the burning gasses of the ejection charge come into contact with it. Then you get a nice fire inside your rocket, which, while it may look really cool, would turn your rocket into a single-use device, and probably get you kicked out of your club.

As we move up in size, wadding and dog barf star to become impractical, and we use Kevlar or Nomex hankies.

 

[Incongruent]

Then you get a nice fire inside your rocket

Or worse, outside your rocket and on the flying field.

 

[Zeus-cat]

As others have said you want the nose cone to be a little snug. If it is to loose it can pop off after the motor burns out from what we call drag separation. The rocket will slow down faster than the nose cone due to aerodynamic drag. If the nose is to loose it can literally come off the rocket just after the motor burns out. It happened to me once and it is is not pretty.

As others have said, no flammable wadding please.

 

[Kirk G]

As the title, need your comments, should nose be loose enough but not fall by itself.
And second question, is wadding really has to be fire proof special, type of paper or it is just tp

Lots of responses already, and all good ones. Here's my two cents....
Instead of holding the rocket by the nosecone to see if the airframe drops off, I hold the air frame and turn the rocket over.
If the nose cone drops off, there's not enough friction. By my technique, it tolerates a lot less friction, cause you're dangling a much lighter mass to fall away.

As for the dog barf, most Estes Rockets blister packs now come with several sheets of recovery wadding already folded in the back of the package (along with motors and starters).
This is very convenient for the first time rocketeer, as everything comes together.

Most clubs have someone who brings the cube of blown celulose insulation and shares among everyone. Some charge a buck for rights to grab a handful.
The idea is just to cover your costs and have it available for everyone, and not have everyone sitting on a cube of the stuff in their basement forever.

Some will "sell" a large gallon zip lock baggie at club launches for a buck, and that can last you a good long while too.

If you're not affiliated with a rocket club yet, these are some of the benefits of finding a regular club launch or befriending some older rocketeers to advise you.

 

[Bat-mite]

Hmm, I think at a dollar a handful, you would not only cover your costs, but probably net about 2000%! :wink:

 

[Sabrina]

As the title, need your comments, should nose be loose enough but not fall by itself.
And second question, is wadding really has to be fire proof special, type of paper or it is just tp

NO TP - really - NEVER!!!

Use inexpensive Dog Barf instead.

It's not really dog barf, they just call it that. It's cellulose attic insulation. It looks like ground up newspapers, and its fire resistant!!! Get it from Home Depot - more than you can ever use, for about 10 bucks.

Put the motor in the rocket. Put in the parachute and the wadding or dog barf. Put on the nose cone.

NOW pick-up the rocket by the nose cone (fins down - nose up) holding just the nose cone, can you pick up the rocket? If you give it a shake does it come apart?

When you can answer YES to both questions - its ready to fly.

 

[Incongruent]

Hmm, I think at a dollar a handful, you would not only cover your costs, but probably net about 2000%! :wink:

I think that instead of shipping rocket stuff with paper or other traditional packaging cushioning, they should shovel in some cellulose insulation instead. Yes, shipping costs go up, but you're basically buying another product...

Do you kind of see my point?

Would it work?

 

[modeler]

OK, I think I got all answer I need, thx everyone for your input

 

[Bat-mite]

I think that instead of shipping rocket stuff with paper or other traditional packaging cushioning, they should shovel in some cellulose insulation instead. Yes, shipping costs go up, but you're basically buying another product...

Do you kind of see my point?

Would it work?

Works for me, but vendors are in business to make money....

 

[Incongruent]

Works for me, but vendors are in business to make money....

Fair point, but if the price they charge for the shipping material is the same or less than what the home improvement store does plus the cost of the normal packaging, it works out.
The seller can buy the insulation in bulk so they make money and you don't get ripped off.
It would probably be better if they had it as a shipping option, since eventually you'll have too much.

I'm not an economist for a reason.

 

[Micromeister]

Yes most of the other posters have answered the nosecone question.

Just to impress the need for flameproof wadding: Estes and Quest FP wadding is expensive. as one of the earlier posters mentions if you purchase crepe paper streamer rolls or sheets from a reliable Party Goods store, they are indeed Flameproof already. 3" wide crepe paper streamers are wonderful alternatives to the standard plastic chutes especially on smallish fields. one can use the crepe paper just like you'd use Estes wadding but remember it doesn't seal as well as the thinner TP type FP wadding. Extra care is needed to create a good ejection gas seal using small wadded crepe paper.

 

[duggyhow]

Hi y’all, I’d like to ask about my custom built 4lb. nose. It behing so heavy, I’m not sure I can measure the snugness by turning the rocket upside down. I’ve made it more snug by adding more tape but I’m concerned I will make it too tight if I keep adding tape. Someone said use shear pins. Any thoughts are appreciated, thanks.

 

[tsmith1315]

Hi y’all, I’d like to ask about my custom built 4lb. nose.

The question should be asked in the HPR forum. You'll get more results there.