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Neutron95

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TNX rknnut! And you're sure right about that! NOTHING is inexpensive about this hobby! But, I think when you see our motors and their prices, you're going to be pleasantly surprised. That is if you buy from a current motor manufacturer. I don't know where you buy your motors and I don't care. Maybe you make your own. But I can tell you this. If you're buying from a motor manufacturer, I can tell you we're going to knock the socks off their prices. THAT'S a promise!
Are you able to release even a general price range for some motors? You have made some very bold claims, and until you show some proof, people are going to question them.

I would suggest taking a step back and getting everything ready before coming back with details, instead of vague promises.
 

Dustin Lobner

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Glad you noted that the NFPA has NO enforcement capability. Seems like you may be the ONLY one around here who knows that...

Oh I forgot. There's me. lol!
There are laws, and then there is common f***ing sense. We live in a world where more and more rules are coming down from the government every day (just look at what just happened to drones). We as the rocketry community have decided that we're going to follow NFPA, and that's worked great! We've been good at keeping things fun and safe. There are a lot of us in the hobby that, after the ATF lawsuit, are just happy to have a flippin hobby any more. You go around flaunting things like that and I for one, will never buy from you. And I suspect I'm not the only one. Do you really want to be the one who messes this up for everyone?

Further more, I've seen how arrogant and sarcastic you are at dealing with others, when you're trying to build something (a business) that relies on THEIR goodwill to buy from YOU, not the other way around. People don't owe you a dime, you have to earn it. And based off of how you've treated people here, you've permanently un-earned my money.
 
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CPUTommy

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Again.. I ask..

why are we not welcoming a new motor vendor with open arms?

The people batching about the ignightor and NFPA are the same people who will never buy any motor more powerful than a C. These are the same people that complain that Estes doesn't have a replacement nose cone for a 35 year old rocket and if Estes DID have the nose cone for 5 dollars they would complain about the price. A huge majority of the people whom are in rocketry are cheap to the point of pathetic baby whining. Dont even respond to them, tell them to purchase a motor FIRST before they cry about the "ignightor installation before the rocket is on the rail.. oooops.. the baby's are the one who don't use the rails.. ask them if they use the 1010 rail..

I EAGERLY await the power plant options. Ive spent my fair share of money on motors, and yes I use rails...

Keep up the great work !!

Tom
 

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Dustin Lobner

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Again.. I ask..

why are we not welcoming a new motor vendor with open arms?

The people batching about the ignightor and NFPA are the same people who will never buy any motor more powerful than a C. These are the same people that complain that Estes doesn't have a replacement nose cone for a 35 year old rocket and if Estes DID have the nose cone for 5 dollars they would complain about the price. A huge majority of the people whom are in rocketry are cheap to the point of pathetic baby whining. Dont even respond to them, tell them to purchase a motor FIRST before they cry about the "ignightor installation before the rocket is on the rail.. oooops.. the baby's are the one who don't use the rails.. ask them if they use the 1010 rail..

I EAGERLY await the power plant options. Ive spent my fair share of money on motors, and yes I use rails...

Keep up the great work !!

Tom
I agree completely! Let's welcome someone with open arms who's going to move this hobby forward. But, moving forward by flaunting the agreed upon rules that the hobby's organizations have accepted? (and for the record, I may not fly a lot but the last 4 launches I've been to I've flown HP exclusively, your premise is wrong as I'm the one here complaining about flaunting NFPA). And someone who feels it necessary to be sarcastic and belittle potential customers? Just saying, he's not getting my money.

And if he gets in full compliance with the rules (don't care if it's the law or our insurance underwriters or whatever) with his head end ignitor, then than is AWESOME and a good step forward for the hobby.

...I'm still not buying from him based on personality, but it would be a step forward for sure.
 

CPUTommy

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The ignightor issue and his motor certification is acually NONE OF ANYONES BUSINESS BUT HIS.

why are people trying to play nfpa and nar cops?

Its sad at the amount of people complaining and trying to rain on your parade.. take note of names and put them on a do not sell list.. let them give there money to Estes.

Tom
 

Dustin Lobner

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The ignightor issue and his motor certification is acually NONE OF ANYONES BUSINESS BUT HIS.

why are people trying to play nfpa and nar cops?

Its sad at the amount of people complaining and trying to rain on your parade.. take note of near and put them on a do not sell list.. let them give there money to Estes.

Tom
If he gets it certified, awesome. I doubt it though, and people rightfully pointed out it's been tried and failed?

Not playing cops, defending a hobby I love.

Lol - Don't care if I'm on a do not sell list. I don't owe him anything.

Somewhat ironically, I'm literally in the middle of typing an email to my motor vendor with a list of HP stuff I'm buying.

And besides that, what the heck is wrong with Estes? It's the "gateway drug" that literally gets everyone into this hobby? You realize that this hobby wouldn't exist without Estes and the low cost entry point? Seriously, stop raining on *THEIR* parade.



....now would be a good time for the mods to step in.
 

hobie1dog

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. take note of names and put them on a do not sell list..
Tom
I do know two guys who have a "do not sell " list on their bulletin boards behind their desks. All of them are people who have thrashed them personally on internet forms.
 

Dustin Lobner

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The ignightor issue and his motor certification is acually NONE OF ANYONES BUSINESS BUT HIS.
If it's only his business, he shouldn't advertise how awesome it is...if you're gonna make claims, they're gonna get checked before purchase. Just sayin'.
 

3stoogesrocketry

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You go around flaunting things like that and I for one, will never buy from you. And I suspect I'm not the only one. Do you really want to be the one who messes this up for everyone?


Please explain Dustin . I have been flying with Tripoli since 1995 . What is Don flaunting that will get us in trouble with the ATF and end our hobby?

Remember when Tripoli launches had no research codes .
Remember when Tripoli would not allow steel nozzles in motors .
Remember when there was no class three committee.
Remember when there was only a confirmation flight and no cert levels .


Pepperidge Farms remembers.

Tripoli by-bylaws are written by board members. If they are presented with a safe and reliable HEI device that meets all criteria , and it passes TMT , the board members can change the by-laws , they just choose not too.
 

CPUTommy

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If he gets it certified, awesome. I doubt it though, and people rightfully pointed out it's been tried and failed?
*AND WHY IS HIS ATTEMPT, HIS TIME AND MONEY ANY LESS IMPORTANT? WHAT IF THIS ATTEMPT ACTUALLY LETS NFPA TAKE A REAL LOOK AT ROCKETRY (AS A WHOLE) AND SEE THEY BOTH ARE MANAGED JUST AS SAFE AS POSSIBLE AND EVEN TAKING THINGS FURTHER THAN THEY NEED TO BE DUE TO ERRING ON THE SIDE OF CAUTION. (HIGH POWER PADS FARTHER AWAY THAN THEY NEEDED TO BE.. JUST TO BE SAFE.

Not playing cops, defending a hobby I love.
*AGAIN, YOU LOVE THIS SPORT MORE THAN ME? OR MORE THAN YOU? OR THE NEXT GUY?? DEFENDING IS ONE THING, NOT GIVING HIM A CHANCE FROM THE GET GO UNDER THE GUISE OF PROTECTING THE SPORT "JUST YOU LOVE" UMMM.. YEAH OK BUD.. YOU BE THAT MALL COP..👍

Lol - Don't care if I'm on a do not sell list. I don't owe him anything.

Somewhat ironically, I'm literally in the middle of typing an email to my motor vendor with a list of HP stuff I'm buying.

WHAT ROCKET ARE YOU FLYING AND WHAT MOTORS? PICTURES OR IT DIDNT HAPPEN, IM PLAYING HIGH POWER COP.. JUST SAYING.

And besides that, what the heck is wrong with Estes?
1-THEY NEED TO FIND A WAY TO GET A BASIC KIT INTO THE SCHOOL SYSTEMS FOR FREE
2-THEY DONT HAVE 30 YEAR OLD INVENTORY OF NOSE CONES
3-NOTHING OTHER THAN THAT.


It's the "gateway drug" that literally gets everyone into this hobby? You realize that this hobby wouldn't exist without Estes and the low cost entry point? Seriously, stop raining on *THEIR* parade.



....now would be a good time for the mods to step in.

YOUR OPINION OBVIOUSLY. AGAIN..RAINING ON THE PARADE AND STOPING THIS THREAD, THAT INVOLVES A POSSIBLE NEW MOTOR VENDOR INTO OUR SPORT ?
POSSIBLE GAME CHANGING WAYS OF IGNIGHTING EVEN A SECOND STAGE MOTOR..THATS SOMETHING YOUVE SOLVED? PLEASE HELP ME WITH HIGH ALTITUDE AIR STARTING DIFFRENT MOTORS.. LOW COST HIGH POWER MOTORS ARE A BAD THING? SO BAD YOU WANT THE MODS TO STEP IN? UMMM.. HEY GUY..WHY WOULD YOU SPEND $250 DOLLARS PLUS HAZMAT WHEN YOU COULD POSSIBLY SPEND THE SAME FOR 2 ? GUESS YOU HAVEN'T BOUGHT 54MM OR 75 MM OR EVEN 98 MM MOTORS...

IM DONE WITH THIS.. GOOD LUCK AND BEST WISHES. 🤲👐🙌👐🤲
 
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CalebJ

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The people batching about the ignightor and NFPA are the same people who will never buy any motor more powerful than a C. These are the same people that complain that Estes doesn't have a replacement nose cone for a 35 year old rocket and if Estes DID have the nose cone for 5 dollars they would complain about the price. A huge majority of the people whom are in rocketry are cheap to the point of pathetic baby whining. Dont even respond to them, tell them to purchase a motor FIRST before they cry about the "ignightor installation before the rocket is on the rail.. oooops.. the baby's are the one who don't use the rails.. ask them if they use the 1010 rail..
That's a fascinating determination you've made about the people with serious questions about the product.

And it's not based on any evidence whatsoever. A few seconds of going through the thread would lead to all sorts of people posting that have higher level certifications and plenty of history of purchasing large motors.

But you weren't trying to use facts.

Maybe stay out of the discussion if the best you can do is make things up and try to drown out those with real things to talk about?
 

Dustin Lobner

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Please explain Dustin .
So - background on me, I worry about things. Start there.

I partake in other hobbies that have pretty extensive rule sets (USPSA pistol shooting comes to mind). Those hobbies continue because the rules are adhered to. Look up USPSA...you're literally running around with live ammo in handguns, shooting at targets, all under the clock. And yet no one has ever been hurt past a twisted knee. Why? Because if you break a single rule, you're done for the day. That's just how it is.

Look at what happened with drones. A federal agency got it in their mind that what was happening was dangerous, and in a couple of years now you're not going to be able to fly anything over 250g or whatever without licensing and data transmission and stuff.

Think about HP rocketry now. What happens if one of these ignitors goes off when someone is waiting in line? It only takes one screw up on that level for things to be changed dramatically.

If the boards of Tripoli and NAR agree that these are workable, then that's awesome and I'm glad that we have a new technology and capability in the hobby. I've often thought of what it would take to do head end ignition for 2 stage rockets. I love the idea. I just don't like "How do you get around NFPA?" answered with "They aren't a government agency, they don't matter" because they matter a heck of a lot to our insurance underwriters if noone else.
 

heada

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Again.. I ask..

why are we not welcoming a new motor vendor with open arms?

The people batching about the ignightor and NFPA are the same people who will never buy any motor more powerful than a C. These are the same people that complain that Estes doesn't have a replacement nose cone for a 35 year old rocket and if Estes DID have the nose cone for 5 dollars they would complain about the price. A huge majority of the people whom are in rocketry are cheap to the point of pathetic baby whining. Dont even respond to them, tell them to purchase a motor FIRST before they cry about the "ignightor installation before the rocket is on the rail.. oooops.. the baby's are the one who don't use the rails.. ask them if they use the 1010 rail..

I EAGERLY await the power plant options. Ive spent my fair share of money on motors, and yes I use rails...

Keep up the great work !!

Tom
I'm sitting with a little over $10k worth of motors and cases from many different vendors ( my personal supply, I'm not a reseller) I fly flights that could match Don's offerings. Are you saying I shouldn't ask questions to find out if his motors could match my needs?
 

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Steve Shannon

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This thread has kind of bounced off the guard rails a few times. Here’s what everyone has to keep in mind:
1. Manufacturers can contact the certification agencies with their ideas anytime.
2. All certification agencies (CAR MCC, NAR S&T, and my favorite Tripoli TMT) have published their certification requirements.
3. Neither NFPA nor Tripoli Safety Codes prohibit head end ignition. The challenge has always been how to follow NFPA requirements not to install the ignition device until the right time and at the right place. The certification agencies are not going to allow something to slip through that will endanger rocketry.
4. We’ve all been going through a stressful past year. Let’s not allow ourselves to overreact based on assumptions.
 

Dustin Lobner

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This thread has kind of bounced off the guard rails a few times. Here’s what everyone has to keep in mind:
1. Manufacturers can contact the certification agencies with their ideas anytime.
2. All certification agencies (CAR MCC, NAR S&T, and my favorite Tripoli TMT) have published their certification requirements.
3. Neither NFPA nor Tripoli Safety Codes prohibit head end ignition. The challenge has always been how to follow NFPA requirements not to install the ignition device until the right time and at the right place. The certification agencies are not going to allow something to slip through that will endanger rocketry.
4. We’ve all been going through a stressful past year. Let’s not allow ourselves to overreact based on assumptions.
I was just typing up something here saying basically "at the end of the day, I trust Tripoli cert folks so it's all going to work out anyways". So, let this message serve as that, and I'm going to go walk away now.

Thanks Steve for the well thought out reminder.
 

CalebJ

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This thread has kind of bounced off the guard rails a few times. Here’s what everyone has to keep in mind:
1. Manufacturers can contact the certification agencies with their ideas anytime.
2. All certification agencies (CAR MCC, NAR S&T, and my favorite Tripoli TMT) have published their certification requirements.
3. Neither NFPA nor Tripoli Safety Codes prohibit head end ignition. The challenge has always been how to follow NFPA requirements not to install the ignition device until the right time and at the right place. The certification agencies are not going to allow something to slip through that will endanger rocketry.
4. We’ve all been going through a stressful past year. Let’s not allow ourselves to overreact based on assumptions.
Has Carber Energetics begun the process of having their motors certified?
 
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