GUNS & ROCKETS

The Rocketry Forum

Help Support The Rocketry Forum:

dave carver

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
4,965
Reaction score
4
While I have an antique Stevens bolt .22 with a tiny scope. In the closet my pride and joy is a Crossman Custom Shop 2400KT .22 CO2 pistol that I have made mods to. 6-24x60 Léopold scope. Mellon Aire muzzle brake and stainless steel hollow bolt. Custom aluminum stock off eBay that has a power valve adjuster. Front stock replaced with a Picatinny rail with a bipod front handgrip attached.

I don't really have all that much invested in it, there are many way more expensive air rifles than mine :p
 

TopRamen

SA-5
Joined
Aug 9, 2013
Messages
9,922
Reaction score
25
9 yearold with an uzi? i know of one incident a few years back, it was a micro uzi and it was at an expo.... there was a big fallout and the guy responsible was also LE, and got put in jail I think.
while i dont own an uzi, nor the want, one of the common overlooked problems with semi-automatic firearms, is that they can fail and become fully automatic, if the firing pin is dirty or damaged. this can kill a person if they cannot control the recoil.(unexpectedly even.)

It's hard to comprehend that one day i could kill my child by giving him a car. but, one day he will be of age and it will happen. It's my job to get him to the level to be responsible for those actions. People say children shouldn't do High-power rockets, I think they are wrong. As you say, the highest level and quality of supervision is imperative, and directly impacts the level of safety.

I can't go to Vegas, as it is against my personal moral compass... :)
Semi-Automatic Firearms don't do what you are suggesting. It is not a "Commonly overlooked Problem". You're just making $&%$ up and talking out your @$$.
 

Alethins

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
363
Reaction score
1
Like rockets you start out small then work your way up... Ramen I've had bad luck with PSA
 

ThirstyBarbarian

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 11, 2013
Messages
8,156
Reaction score
648
9 yearold with an uzi? i know of one incident a few years back, it was a micro uzi and it was at an expo.... there was a big fallout and the guy responsible was also LE, and got put in jail I think.
while i dont own an uzi, nor the want, one of the common overlooked problems with semi-automatic firearms, is that they can fail and become fully automatic, if the firing pin is dirty or damaged. this can kill a person if they cannot control the recoil.(unexpectedly even.)

It's hard to comprehend that one day i could kill my child by giving him a car. but, one day he will be of age and it will happen. It's my job to get him to the level to be responsible for those actions. People say children shouldn't do High-power rockets, I think they are wrong. As you say, the highest level and quality of supervision is imperative, and directly impacts the level of safety.

I can't go to Vegas, as it is against my personal moral compass... :)
I was referring to an incident I had read in the news literally just about 2 minutes before reading your post, so when you mentioned kids shooting, this accident immediately popped into my head. I sort of wish I hadn't mentioned it, because it almost looks like I'm trying to bring controversy into the conversation, which I am definitely NOT trying to do.

Here's a link to an article about it, if you are interested: http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/26/us/arizona-girl-fatal-shooting-accident/index.html?hpt=hp_t4
 

TopRamen

SA-5
Joined
Aug 9, 2013
Messages
9,922
Reaction score
25
That "Instructor" should not have let the Child who was Physically Incapable of managing the Recoil of the Uzi, anywhere near the Uzi.
I owned a IMI Model A Uzi, Semi Auto, and it has virtually no Recoil so to speak, being that it is chambered in 9mm, a Pistol Cartridge.
There was a similar incident with a Micro-Uzi with a Kid shooting their Instructor awhile back.
Kids should not handle and fire Submachineguns because History has proven that they inevitably can't handle it.
 

ClayD

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2010
Messages
2,427
Reaction score
2
I was referring to an incident I had read in the news literally just about 2 minutes before reading your post, so when you mentioned kids shooting, this accident immediately popped into my head. I sort of wish I hadn't mentioned it, because it almost looks like I'm trying to bring controversy into the conversation, which I am definitely NOT trying to do.

Here's a link to an article about it, if you are interested: http://www.cnn.com/2014/08/26/us/arizona-girl-fatal-shooting-accident/index.html?hpt=hp_t4
It's very sad. It will always be controversial . Like a 14 year old girl sailing around the world.. I can't wait to take my son hunting, and I know lots of people think that's horrible.
This is the one you reminded me of.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/2008/10/27/boy-8-shoots-self-with-uzi-at-gun-show/.
 

TopRamen

SA-5
Joined
Aug 9, 2013
Messages
9,922
Reaction score
25
As someone who was a professional Gunsmith for 6 Years, I know what a Slamfire is. It is extremely RARE, and does not happen in modern Firearms that are properly maintained.
SKS Rifles were the most common culprit of "slamfiring", and this is because a lot of them were imported with a heavy Grease known as Cosmoline coating them. A lot of folks would take them out to shoot them before cleaning them properly, and they would slamfire.
This caused the Myth to become widespread that this was a "Common Problem" with Seemi-Automatic Firearms, when in reality, it was caused by poor Practices, Human Error.
When you first take a new SKS out to shoot it, you should start by only loading 2 Rounds into the Magazine, so that if it slamfires, it results in only a double fire, not a whole Magazine Dump.
There was a Person at the Barre Fish and Game Club sometime in the 90s' that this happened to, resulting in Injury, causing most Club Members to look unfavorably on SKS Rifles, when in reality, it was not the Guns fault. It was simply caked in Cosmoline which siezed the Firing Pin.

http://www.murraysguns.com/sksown.htm
 
Last edited:

Alethins

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
363
Reaction score
1
Well this thread took a quick turn... I hope it doesn't get locked... Honestly I bought my supressor and it was in ATF prison for 8 months after I bought it and they milked me for $200 tax stamp... I don't want to do it every again... What do you guys think of magpul pulling the colored mags?
 

TopRamen

SA-5
Joined
Aug 9, 2013
Messages
9,922
Reaction score
25
Well this thread took a quick turn... I hope it doesn't get locked... Honestly I bought my supressor and it was in ATF prison for 8 months after I bought it and they milked me for $200 tax stamp... I don't want to do it every again... What do you guys think of magpul pulling the colored mags?
Did'nt know they stopped making the colored Magazines, but I always preferred Lancer Magazines when it comes to Polymer Mags anyhow. I am currently running BCM Mags with the Magpul Anti-Tilt Followers.
 

Alethins

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
363
Reaction score
1
Yeah they discontinued Foliage green completely I got in on some deals and after December 2014 no more will be shipped by magpul all mags Gen2 at least will be black now... I like CAA
 

KennB

I-95 Envoy
Joined
Mar 6, 2010
Messages
2,339
Reaction score
142
Location
Amesbury, MA
Some of the posters on this thread must also post on gun forums. How about starting a "ROCKETS & GUNS" thread there and see what type of traction it gets?
If someone does this, please post a link here so we can peek in on it to see how it runs.
Thanks.
 

Alethins

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 8, 2014
Messages
363
Reaction score
1
Some of the posters on this thread must also post on gun forums. How about starting a "ROCKETS & GUNS" thread there and see what type of traction it gets?
If someone does this, please post a link here so we can peek in on it to see how it runs.
Thanks.
On an introduction thread on one I mentioned rocketry quite a few members posted their HPR pics....
 

ClayD

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2010
Messages
2,427
Reaction score
2
Semi-Automatic Firearms don't do what you are suggesting.
TopRamen said:
SKS Rifles were the most common culprit of "slamfiring"
because you seek to to be a mean person, and be berate others for whatever reason, you fail....

TopRamen said:
As someone who was a professional Gunsmith for 6 Years
Because you can earn a paycheck does not mean you know what your doing, or that what you do actually know, that your any good at it. This may not even be you... but that's why professional liability insurance exists.

This is just cover to show that you have excuse for your hateful comments? Is this supposed to prove something?

The real answer is.... Semi-automatic guns CAN and DO slam fire, in-fact the last assault training I did we covered it extensively along with other things like squibs and other safety factors that need to be "not overlooked" as an operator.

Additionally, I would like to advise the professional gunsmith to get an education of 6 years, so you can understand English vernacular to the point that... a commonly overlooked problem, is not misconstrued as... a common problem as you have done.

My statement was made out of people who own and shoot guns, and may allow others to do so with a weapon that is unfamiliar. IE. a child with an AR-15... (they slam-fire.... BTW) they load up the magazine, and hand it over... never thinking an bent firing pin may malfunction causing a full auto unload of the magazine, and the death and injury resulting from it. Because of holly-er-than-thou people like you , who don't consider that it CAN HAPPEN, on even a rare case. So, it is commonly not considered and overlooked...
 

TopRamen

SA-5
Joined
Aug 9, 2013
Messages
9,922
Reaction score
25
And this is why Rocketry Forum is not the Place for Gun Threads.;)
 

TopRamen

SA-5
Joined
Aug 9, 2013
Messages
9,922
Reaction score
25
If "Slamfiring" was really such a common Problem, I wonder why in all the Qualification Ranges/Training we did in the Army, I never once saw/heard of someones M4 or M16 go Full Auto due to Slamfiring???
 

ClayD

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 11, 2010
Messages
2,427
Reaction score
2
If "Slamfiring" was really such a common Problem, I wonder why in all the Qualification Ranges/Training we did in the Army, I never once saw/heard of someones M4 or M16 go Full Auto due to Slamfiring???
who said it was a common occurrence?

here is a good place to say it never happens, they will believe you......http://forums.1911forum.com/showthread.php?p=1872698

(a man with experience, is not at the mercy of a man with an opinion.)
 

tmacklin

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 1, 2012
Messages
2,217
Reaction score
3
There is a common denominator between guns and rockets. The BATFE would like congress to outlaw them both.
 

MWC

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2012
Messages
596
Reaction score
26
I think guys like fast, loud, dirty, stinky things... both guns and rockets qualify.

Rockets are vertical projectiles, guns launch horizontal (normally) projectiles.
I often mix my fun time at a rocket launch between vertical and horizontal pastimes.

I have (2) other side biz pursuits besides Missile Works, and yes they are both "gun" related:

www.innovativeordnance.com
www.goapeonline.com

How about that for Guns and Rockets?:eek:
 

Squawsach

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 28, 2013
Messages
106
Reaction score
0
Rocketry is for people who like to build things and then enjoy the fruits of their creativity. You build a rocket, you launch that rocket, and watch it have a great flight. There is satisfaction in that. You can enjoy firearms in the same way. I have never met a firearm that was good enough as is.

How about this old pawn shop find. An end of life over and under given a new mission as a brush gun for hog hunting.






This one started as a $99 Wal-Mart gun. I made a few mods to it.



Firearms can be a creative hobby for people who like to hunt and plink. I really don't see why a firearms thread needs to cause problems. Firearms don't ruin threads, people ruin threads.
 

dave carver

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
4,965
Reaction score
4
I often mix my fun time at a rocket launch between vertical and horizontal pastimes.
We had some people who tried that at one of our launches. When they opened fire in the general area of our flight operations I heard a bullet go zinging past. I turned and saw that the were shooting maybe 30* off a direct shot. I yelled, "SAY!!!" and there was no more shooting.

I, too, have taken my guns to shoot when heading out to fly but I go elsewhere after the launch to fire my guns. I have been shooting guns for nearly 50 years, ain't stopping now :)
 

MWC

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2012
Messages
596
Reaction score
26
I often mix my fun time at a rocket launch between vertical and horizontal pastimes.
I, too, have taken my guns to shoot when heading out to fly but I go elsewhere after the launch to fire my guns. I have been shooting guns for nearly 50 years, ain't stopping now :)
I want to clarify I don't shoot at or anywhere near the launch field... I drive over to the ATV area (closed to traffic during our flying season) and get easy 200 yard target placements.
 

DizWolf

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 17, 2011
Messages
4,626
Reaction score
15
My statement was made out of people who own and shoot guns, and may allow others to do so with a weapon that is unfamiliar. IE. a child with an AR-15... (they slam-fire.... BTW) they load up the magazine, and hand it over... never thinking an bent firing pin may malfunction causing a full auto unload of the magazine, and the death and injury resulting from it. Because of holly-er-than-thou people like you , who don't consider that it CAN HAPPEN, on even a rare case. So, it is commonly not considered and overlooked...
The infrequency of slamfiring aside.... If I take someone shooting, and they're using a firearm that's unfamiliar to them, they get one round at a time. I'm more concerned with them double tapping during recoil, dropping the gun, setting it down loaded with the safety off, not knowing how to clear it (which they should have been taught), etc etc. Hell, I'd be more worried about a shaved sear than a bent pin. But, nothing can ever be ignored.
 

valley

Member
Joined
Mar 2, 2012
Messages
17
Reaction score
0
How can you possibly compare the actions of a young person with the courage and independent spirit to sail around the world with teaching a child to handle a device whose ONLY purpose is to kill?? Baffling.

On a more general note, am I the only one to be alarmed that people who lack the intelligence to make a coherent argument are allowed to own / build / sell firearms?!!
 

dave carver

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
4,965
Reaction score
4
I want to clarify I don't shoot at or anywhere near the launch field... I drive over to the ATV area (closed to traffic during our flying season) and get easy 200 yard target placements.

Yeah, that's what I figured :) We launch in the desert outside of town. In the spring there's tons of ground squirrels to shoot and that's what they were doing. There's also lots of rocks for bullets to ricochet off and I'm sure that's what happened.

Living in Idaho I grew up with guns, I could tear down and clean and reassemble all the guns in the house by the time I was 12. Except for cutting holes in paper I've pretty much stopped shooting which is why the CO2 gun, soooo cheap to shoot and air or spring powered pellet guns are even cheaper to shoot. I'm looking at a spring powered air gun...when I can scrape together $500 for the one I want :p ....and that's cheap!?!
 

o1d_dude

'I battle gravity'
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
7,727
Reaction score
582
Location
Urff
Yeah, that's what I figured :) We launch in the desert outside of town. In the spring there's tons of ground squirrels to shoot and that's what they were doing. There's also lots of rocks for bullets to ricochet off and I'm sure that's what happened.

Living in Idaho I grew up with guns, I could tear down and clean and reassemble all the guns in the house by the time I was 12. Except for cutting holes in paper I've pretty much stopped shooting which is why the CO2 gun, soooo cheap to shoot and air or spring powered pellet guns are even cheaper to shoot. I'm looking at a spring powered air gun...when I can scrape together $500 for the one I want :p ....and that's cheap!?!
Dunno if they're available in your area, Dave, but the English are mad about airguns of all types and I recently picked up a couple of issues of British air rifle magazine (Airgun World) and have been poring over them. They contain a wealth of serious information.

European air rifles are quality pieces and as you note, they're also pricey.
 

dave carver

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
4,965
Reaction score
4
Dunno if they're available in your area, Dave, but the English are mad about airguns of all types and I recently picked up a couple of issues of British air rifle magazine (Airgun World) and have been poring over them. They contain a wealth of serious information.

European air rifles are quality pieces and as you note, they're also pricey.

Yeah, I've noticed that :p On youtube I subscribe to two English shooters channels, huntersvermin and verminhunters :D They seem to gravitate to $1000 and up airguns. Those prices are kinda painful, especially when they are using them to shoot rats...
 

matthew

Optimistic Pessimist
Joined
Jan 22, 2009
Messages
857
Reaction score
17
How can you possibly compare the actions of a young person with the courage and independent spirit to sail around the world with teaching a child to handle a device whose ONLY purpose is to kill?? Baffling.

On a more general note, am I the only one to be alarmed that people who lack the intelligence to make a coherent argument are allowed to own / build / sell firearms?!!
What I find alarming is how it always seems to be the anti-gun folks that stir up trouble whenever other folks would like to calmly discuss their own involvement with the hobby of shooting. I don't read threads about people's sick cat or whatever because they don't interest me. This thread is sufficiently titled to allow you to move on if you have no interest. As far as I can tell, your only interest is to troll others who are enjoying sharing their experiences of a popular pastime with like minded members of a community they are heavily involved in.
 

dave carver

Nam Myoho Renge Kyo
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
4,965
Reaction score
4
What I find alarming is how it always seems to be the anti-gun folks that stir up trouble whenever other folks would like to calmly discuss their own involvement with the hobby of shooting. I don't read threads about people's sick cat or whatever because they don't interest me. This thread is sufficiently titled to allow you to move on if you have no interest. As far as I can tell, your only interest is to troll others who are enjoying sharing their experiences of a popular pastime with like minded members of a community they are heavily involved in.

Thank you, thank you, thank you. Could not have said it better myself. There are so many threads I never read for lack of any interest at all for the reasons you outlined.

I've shot thousands of round and have never, to my knowledge, killed anyone. Now, anything is a different matter ;)
 
2
Top