Feedback Needed on a possible New Roachwerks Kit

sandman

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For those of you that think it's easy to design and come out with a new kit especially =scale= well...you are very wrong!

I don't want to commit myself to anything just yet so I want some feedback on an "idea":rolleyes: .

This would be a "dual" kit. You will be able to make two (2) different =scale= models from this kit.

One model will have a 24mm motor mount.

The other kit will have a cluster motor mount. I haven't worked that out just yet.

Start with an Estes Mercury Redstone kit. Either supplied by me...maybe...or supplied by the builder.

The kit will have parts to make a 24mm motor and the bottom of the Mercury Redstone kit with a new upper stage, decals and nose cone to make a Jupiter C. The rocket that launched our first satelite Exploer I

The second kit will use the Mercury Capsule to make a cluster powered Mercury Little Joe. I'm not sure what round to document yet or if I am even going to provide any documentation.

I am currently leaning toward round LJ5A or LJ5B.

I have a ton of research to do yet so that I get =scale= accuracy but I need to know if there is any interest in this type of project before I do a lot of work.

A lot of what I am doing is seeing about getting a bunch of the Estes Mercury Redstone kits.

BTW I have a bunch of LTV Scout kits made and ready! They will need to be sold to finance this project.
 

wilsotr

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I suspect just about anything you create is going to generate tons of interest, so press on. I'm having trouble evening imagining a "failed " Sandman kit.
 

CTimm

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Why bother with Estes Merc-Redstone kits?
The fins are way off scale.
Better to draw up and laser your own accurate patterns similar to the earlier non-plastic Redstone kits.
BMS had balsa Mercury cones.
Stick build the tower (craftsman kit).
One page of pre-colored wraps for whatever rounds you're doing is simple enough.

Don't forget the Redstone ballistic missile version!

So many possibilities.
 

sandman

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Why bother with Estes Merc-Redstone kits?

I'm trying to avoid reinventing the wheel.

I could do a complete re-design of all the parts. I know how to do that. But... that is NOT what I want to do.

This will be a "kitbash" kit with as few new parts as possible.

I want someone to look at this kit and say, "I could do that!"
 

Stymye

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the lasnsbergen site has an excellent wrap made just for the redstone..
it also includes templates for getting the fins more accurate

it would be very hard to better that wrap as far as scale and detail.

https://www.lansbergen.net/

click on "modelboau"
 

sandman

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the lasnsbergen site has an excellent wrap made just for the redstone..

Perhaps I could refer to that site in the instructions to make that part simpler...or just get the decals from Phred at Excelcior since he already has them drawn up...I think.

Keep the ideas coming.
 

billeblurzz

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It was well worth the wait for the SCOUT....thanks for making that possible! What ever happened to the TALOS!!! I would buy one of those too!:)
 

sandman

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I was too worried about stability issues on the talos.

The nose cone would have needed about 3 oz of BB's to keep it stable and then it would up needing a 29mm motor and ...well, I have had better ideas.

Maybe I could just send you the plans make some nose cones and you can scratch build your own Talos.

Besides you there were maybe 2 other people interested in it.
 

metalwizard

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sandman, id buy a little joe, and im allready in the process of building on on my own! see here

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=27753

as for the estes fins, keep them, trying to make a redstone stable with true scale fins is really tough, besides everyone proboly already has an estes redstone kit that the escape tower has been fixed too many tmes and needs to be replaced, might as well replace the whole capsule!!
 

Gus

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Originally posted by stymye
the lasnsbergen site has an excellent wrap made just for the redstone..
Those wraps are incredible but they are for the Mercury Redstone, not the Jupiter C.

As for upgrading the Redstone/JupiterC to 24mm, if you use the current kit that's hard to do since the motor mount doubles as an all-plastic-inside-the-tube fin can. I agree that the C6 is a little anemic but a D12 would probably be overkill. I say leave the fin can as is.

As for the clustered Little Joe I think we're talking a rocket roughly the size of a Baby Bertha. Are you thinking four 13mm?
 

powderburner

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I'm not sure if you were asking or announcing, but my feedback would be: Why not just make two kits?

Instead of having to increase the price (to cover the extra parts) and then just end up with unused parts, why not just offer two different kits? At least the "common" parts will make it a little easier for you?
 

sandman

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Instead of having to increase the price (to cover the extra parts) and then just end up with unused parts,

I think you may have missed something.

The only unused parts from the original Mercury Redstone kit will be the "stickers".

And maybe the launch lugs (don't like those plastic thingys).
 

BRS Hobbies

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I think the Estes Mercury Redstone is out of production. You might want to check on what kind of supply you can get before moving forward with the kit.

Best regards,
Brian
 

sandman

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I thought I explained it clearly enough but OK I'll try again.

You get my kit with a nose cone, decals, etc. for the Jupiter C, motor mount, fins, decals and other parts for the Little Joe.

You also get (or you provide) a Mercury Redstone kit.

Using the parts from both kits you can build...

A Jupiter C

AND!

A Mercury Little Joe.

Two =scale= models!

When the kits (both of them) are finished you will have left over, some pieces of body tube (not much)

And the original Estes Mercury Redstone stickers. (which you may want to throw away anyway.:rolleyes:
 

prowlerguy

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powderburner:
I think what Sandman is describing is as follows:

Buy one Estes Merc Redstone kit.
Buy one sandman special.
Take booster from Estes kit, replace markings, put sandman nose on - viola, Jupiter C.
Take capsule from Estes kit, build booster from sandman kit - viola, Little Joe.

No wasted parts. Or, you could just buy sandman's kit and make a Little Explorer. Or not.

Sandman:
My only question is whether this can resonably be done to an existing build, or would you need to do this with a pristine kit?
 

sandman

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prowler! You got it!

My only question is whether this can resonably be done to an existing build, or would you need to do this with a pristine kit?

I don't see why not. The only problem is if you have the Estes "stickers" on your existing Mercury Redstone model getting them off may be messy, but yes you could do that.

I may offer it two ways...still just thinking...with and without the Mercury Redstone kit.

That may be a viable option if I can't get ahold of very many of the Estes kits.

Lots of people have the Estes kit already.
 

JRThro

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Originally posted by sandman
I may offer it two ways...still just thinking...with and without the Mercury Redstone kit.

That may be a viable option if I can't get ahold of very many of the Estes kits.

Lots of people have the Estes kit already.
sandman, I think it would be simpler and cheaper for you if you had your customers provide their own Mercury Redstone kits. I don't have one (unless my kids gave me one for Christmas and it's gotten lost somewhere in the pile...), but I'm sure I could find one either locally or from an online vendor.

If you wanted to include scale documentation, decals, etc., with your "conversion" kit, that would be cool, but I don't think you should have to provide the MR kits.
 

sandman

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I can get "some" MR kits but not that many.

How about I just offer the conversion kits and I offer the MR kits seperately.
 

BobH48

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Originally posted by sandman
I can get "some" MR kits but not that many.

How about I just offer the conversion kits and I offer the MR kits seperately.
Sounds like a plan.

I bought a MR kit to use the Lansbergen wraps but I couldn't get them to print full size so I just put it aside for later. Hmmmm.
 

sandman

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I bought a MR kit to use the Lansbergen wraps but I couldn't get them to print full size so I just put it aside for later.

Keep trying to print the wrap 'cause it'll be a few months before I can have this ready.
 

Stymye

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Originally posted by BobH48
Sounds like a plan.

I bought a MR kit to use the Lansbergen wraps but I couldn't get them to print full size so I just put it aside for later. Hmmmm.

Bob, I have files that will print to the correct size, just drop me an email.
 

astronboy

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Whatever you decide Sandman, I am in.

I was thinking along similar lines when the Merc Redstone kit was cancelled. I have decals for a Redstone Missile I built myself, as well as the Wresat, but nothing yet for the Jupiter C, but that is easily fixed!! Same for the LJ, one of my favs.

Phred
 

grog

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I'm interested. Sounds like a neat deal, with or without you supplying the MR kits. (I still have a Yitah Wu Little Joe kit, that also uses the Estes plastic MR capsule, in my basement somewhere. I need to dig it out and take a look.)
 

DeWain

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Gordon,

You must have been reading my mind. A member of our club has a spare Explorer 1 nose cone, and I was planning on... well you guessed it... buying another Estes MR kit and making both a Little Joe 1 and the Juno/ Explorer 1.

BTW, I was realling cranking on building the Soyuz kit until the recent string of days with 99.999% humidity cancelled my plans for painting. Oh well. I will will finish it.

DeWain
 

sandman

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BTW, I was realling cranking on building the Soyuz kit until the recent string of days with 99.999% humidity cancelled my plans for painting.

Tell me about it!

I can't even get Elmer's to dry!
 

doug_man_sams

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Originally posted by Gus
As for upgrading the Redstone/JupiterC to 24mm, if you use the current kit that's hard to do since the motor mount doubles as an all-plastic-inside-the-tube fin can.
Gus,

It's not too bad with some templates. Here's an unfinished web page I made showing how I converted my MR mmt to 24mm.

https://home.flash.net/~samily/merc-red-mmt/index.html

HTH.

Doug
 
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