# Estes Web Site!!!

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#### JStarStar

##### Well-Known Member
TRF Supporter
You know, this is something that really hacks me off and I'm glad somebody brought it up!! I almost wanted to create my own thread on this topic.

Most people who are involved with model rocketry are fairly competent with computers. ** I ** am fairly competent with computers. I use them at work to design things, I am the assistant website geek at work etc etc yadda yadda...

and I can hardly make head or tails out of the Estes site!!

I go on there and I can't find where a certain kit is or other information or any other stuff and I CAN' T GET THERE!!!!!!

And then once you actually manage to find something you want, you can't find your way back.

I don't know who sold Estes the bill of goods that the average visitor to their website is a marginally retarded 7-year old with an attention span of three seconds, but I don't know if I've ever seen a website that is LESS effective and actually more of an obstacle to potential customers getting information and maybe buying your product.

Whatever huge sum of money Estes is paying for this Buck Rogers production, they ought to just junk it and use some 29.95 EZ-Page Designer program or something and just create a simple page that people can actually USE. #### DynaSoar ##### Well-Known Member Originally posted by JStarStar and I can hardly make head or tails out of the Estes site!! I go on there and I can't find where a certain kit is or other information or any other stuff and I CAN' T GET THERE!!!!!! And then once you actually manage to find something you want, you can't find your way back. I'm with you 110%. The Estes site is a study in poor user-centered design. If you want a copy of their catalog, you find instructions that say to go to a different page, and when you get there, click on a logo (a completely non-intuitive thing). Why was there not a link from where those instructions were, directly to the catalog download? Why do I have to follow some silly directions and waste time to get the thing I want? All that flashy junk is designed to appeal to what they obviously perceive their major market to be, those "kids" who buy the disposable, gaudy, pre-built stuff. And perhaps the marketoids who told them to take their business that direction are right, and it is their cash cow. But the site isn't even friendly to them. I get the feeling I'm not welcome. Maybe I should just believe them. #### Justin Horne ##### Well-Known Member I agree... I think one of the ways to get a little more coherent a website is to use the low speed version, even if you have broadband. that stops alot of the animation and stuff... something that annoys me about it too is I can' even get to it using Safari (Macintosh web browser), but have to switch to the mac version of IE. Estes' site is the only one on the internet i have found that does not work with safari! #### cydermaster ##### Well-Known Member Originally posted by JStarStar and I can hardly make head or tails out of the Estes site!! With you on this one. The Estes site is one of the most user-unfriendly sites out there. If you want to find out about Estes products, you're better off looking at an on-line retailer's site. #### Pippen ##### Well-Known Member Arghhh...this was a truly timely complaint. I was just there last night trying to find a template for fin alignment someone mentioned could be downloaded and came up empty. Even when my son was younger he shunned it and much preferred the paper catalogue. Their site is useless. #### flying_silverad ##### Well-Known Member Yep...I'm in agreement with this. Of all the sites I've seen over the years, this one is terrible. The navigation is the worst I've seen in a while. I can't believe people don't tell them. #### dr wogz ##### Fly caster having been there myself, I can agreee with teh fustration. I guess we could 'send them a link to this thread' and see what happens.. But this is only one site. There are a bunch out there. They look slick, they ask you to register, they have the 'flash' intros (To which some, have you to wait for the 'show' to be over.. and that can take w-a-a-y too long!!) and it takes you forever to find what you are looking for. Flash is over-rated. Some sites are designed by first timers (fashion over function), and don't really understand the concept. Some sites focus on themselves, not their products... Some large 'corporate sites', you're just looking for info on Product 'ABC' and all you get is investor stuff, news, company policies, job opportunities, but triign to find an 'online catalogue or product data sheets is very hard to find (one link at teh bottom of teh page) and whe you do find it, you're on a new site.. #### flying_silverad ##### Well-Known Member Flash is over-rated. Some sites are designed by first timers (fashion over function), and don't really understand the concept. Some sites focus on themselves, not their products... Yea, I know what that's like. When I had someone desing my site, that's exactly what happened. Great flash intro but took way too long. I finally had some of it cleaned out. Sometimes Less IS more! #### rabidsheeep ##### Well-Known Member i need about 6 mice to use this sight with all the rollover buttons #### SwingWing ##### Well-Known Member Ya, it sux. Don't ever click on the "high speed connection" even if you are on a supercomputer. Using the "low speed connection" cuts out *some* of the garbage. #### Stewart32 ##### Well-Known Member Yeah, I agree, complexity beyond necessity. Can't go wrong with KISS. #### JRThro ##### Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter TRF Supporter Originally posted by flying_silverad Yea, I know what that's like. When I had someone desing my site, that's exactly what happened. Great flash intro but took way too long. I finally had some of it cleaned out. Sometimes Less IS more! If I might make a suggestion or observation about your site, the design/layout is just fine, but I find it kind of hard to read the blue text on the black/galaxies background, and just reading text on top of the galaxies is distracting. The content is great and I have no difficulty with navigation or anything else, btw. #### ravenx99 ##### Member Originally posted by Justin Horne something that annoys me about it too is I can' even get to it using Safari (Macintosh web browser), but have to switch to the mac version of IE. Estes' site is the only one on the internet i have found that does not work with safari! Don't feel too bad... it refuses to work with Mozilla Firefox, too. #### rabidsheeep ##### Well-Known Member it works with my mozilla. not well. #### atticus ##### Old and in the way The Estes site is a mess. I decided to check some things on it before posting and after 12 minutes (2 cigarettes and a beer) it still had not fully loaded at the local servers 19200bps. Aside from the unnecessary 'flash', a couple of other things bother me about it. First the dearth of parts and components. I realize they like to sell RTF's and kits, but some people want to design and build something original. When I was a kid, they sold 'neat' decals (I remember checkerboard patterns in a variety of color combos and sizes) and many colors and sizes of parachutes as well as glues, paints and other construction supplies. A one stop rocket shop. Then it was all mail order (from an ad in "Boy's Life" or "Popular Mechanics" - next to the cosmolined49.95 Jeep). You sent your money and had your stuff and were flying in a week or so.
I understand they want to sell through retail outlets, which is fine, but the few hobby shops left carry only the simplest, flashiest selection of rockets and engines -no parts.
Second, the lack of description of the components they do sell - dimensions and illustrations (NCs in particular).
I will say that they make good engines (for black powder), I can't remember my last problem with one.
BUT, if you have any Damon stock, place a sell order as soon as Fliskits starts making/selling engines.

The cat came back, but he's gone again.

#### rabidsheeep

##### Well-Known Member
is there any way of contacting estes?

#### JStarStar

##### Well-Known Member
TRF Supporter
Somebody could e-mail them, but you'd think if they have any interest in what should be their most committed core constituency, they'd take a look on this forum once in a while.

ATTICUS, I don't smoke, so I think instead of 2 cigs and a beer, I'd have made it 3 beers.

#### JRThro

TRF Supporter
If you found a contact e-mail address on the Estes site, you did better than I could. All I could find was phone and fax numbers.

#### shrox

##### Well-Known Member
If they had hired me that is one of the first things I would fix! It looks more southwest abode than it does spacey!

##### Well-Known Member
Originally posted by shrox
If they had hired me that is one of the first things I would fix! It looks more southwest abode than it does spacey!
I was thinking that it looked more RIVEN-ish

#### sveinbjorn

##### Member
I really liked the Fliskits site! Everything you need is right in the the first visible part of the screen. No insufferable Flash intro., no frames (although the faux frames look is nice for organization),
and it loads FAST even on my dial-up connection. Kudos to the designer of this site!

Ed

#### JStarStar

##### Well-Known Member
TRF Supporter
A big thumbs up to that.

The FlisKits site is exactly what the Estes site ought to be. It's simple, easy to follow, and you can find the stuff you're looking for. Estes ought to hire whoever FlisKits has doing their site to redesign the Estes site.

If they still want to keep their goofy Cartoon Network animated flash site for their attention-deficit challenged audience, fine. But they ought to have a link on their main page:

"If you are actually interested in information on rocketry supplies, kits and equipment, CLICK HERE." and connect to the simplified site.

Then let the kiddies go play on the bells-and-whistles Star Wars Romper Room flash site.

##### Well-Known Member
Originally posted by JRThro
If I might make a suggestion or observation about your site, the design/layout is just fine, but I find it kind of hard to read the blue text on the black/galaxies background, and just reading text on top of the galaxies is distracting. The content is great and I have no difficulty with navigation or anything else, btw.
Hey, thanks for the heads up. You should have seen it 5 months ago. Cool, but annoying flash at the beginning was driving me crrrazy!

#### sveinbjorn

##### Member
Hey, thanks for the heads up. You should have seen it 5 months ago. Cool, but annoying flash at the beginning was driving me crrrazy!
I'm new around here, and I don't know who's who yet. What website are you talking about?

Ed

#### JRThro

TRF Supporter
Originally posted by sveinbjorn
I'm new around here, and I don't know who's who yet. What website are you talking about?

Ed
I was talking about flying_silverad's site. Go backwards in this thread until you see my original comment about his site. I think if you find his profile, it shows the URL of his site, which I don't remember at the moment.

#### JRThro

TRF Supporter
Originally posted by sveinbjorn
I really liked the Fliskits site! Everything you need is right in the the first visible part of the screen. No insufferable Flash intro., no frames (although the faux frames look is nice for organization),
and it loads FAST even on my dial-up connection. Kudos to the designer of this site!

Ed
Actually, those *are* frames, but they work just fine, don't they?

#### Gus

##### Well-Known Member
Regarding Estes website, all I can say is, Quest's is better.

The amount of useful information is the same on each, but at least Quest's doesn't waste my time or crash my computer.

As for the Fliskits site, I wish Jim would include a quick-access page where all the kits were listed in alphabetical order. The organization of the site is very good for first-timers, very helpful walkthroughs by skill level or rocket type, but if I just have a quick question about one of the kits it's a bit tedious to have to try to recall what skill level or type it is and then go searching. Maybe in the menu bar on the left "Rocket Kits, Alphabetical" could be a choice?

Similar thought for Discount Rocketry's site. Very tedious to find a specific kit, but otherwise very well laid out.

I actually find the site I use the most when I need to find a specific kit is Commonwealth's. No "eye-candy" but very quick to use.

#### ravenx99

##### Member
Originally posted by Gus
As for the Fliskits site, I wish Jim would include a quick-access page where all the kits were listed in alphabetical order. The organization of the site is very good for first-timers, very helpful walkthroughs by skill level or rocket type
I agree. When I want to find a specific kit at Fliskits, I use Google...

search: rhino site:www.fliskits.com

An alphabetical list would really be great.

##### Well-Known Member
Originally posted by sveinbjorn
I'm new around here, and I don't know who's who yet. What website are you talking about?

Ed
My site isThrustline but it's slightly out of date. I'll have almost of my models on it by late Sept. But if you want to see the latest stuff online at the Ebay store, just click hereThrustline Aerospace (EBAY)