Estes Saturn V #1969 Build - Let's share ideas and experiences...

Discussion in 'Mid Power Rocketry (MPR)' started by EeebeeE, Feb 8, 2019.

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  1. May 21, 2019 #121

    Videolester

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    Yup. Comes down in 2 parts. IMO ... The LES is too fragile to withstand any thing other than a PERFECT landing in soft grass. So ... My plan is to do lots of photography on the launcher WITH the "fake" engines & LES mounted, then remove them for actual flight.
     
  2. May 21, 2019 #122

    Videolester

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    Has anyone broken any of the vacuum molded plastic fins upon landing? Seems like they are AWFULLY fragile for the weight of the model ..............
     
  3. May 21, 2019 #123

    AfterBurners

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    You really didn't need to go the whole length of the body tube. Probably just 1" pieces would have worked fine against the center rings.
     
  4. May 21, 2019 #124

    OverTheTop

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    Here is where mine have finished up on the 001969 kit
    FinishedCowlingresize.jpg

    FYI, my build thread is here: https://forum.ausrocketry.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=6278


    Question: How far up from the base are we supposed to notch out the airframe between the cowlings?
     
  5. May 21, 2019 #125

    SecondRow

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    To the edge of the lower wrap. See my post #22 for pictures.
     
  6. May 21, 2019 #126

    les

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    You must be building a different version (2157?) The 1969 wraps are different on the bottom.

    I cut a bit below where the stringers stop, even though it cut into the detail that is mid-way between the fairings
     
  7. May 21, 2019 #127

    SecondRow

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    The pictures are of the 2157. I have a 1969 that I haven’t started yet, but looked over the instructions. I thought it was the same for that part.
     
  8. May 21, 2019 #128

    David Schwantz

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    I have the 1969 version and the fairings are glued in place flush with the bottom of the tube, but then you cut out the tube between the fairings so they now appear below the tube. I replaced my plastic fins with ply, have not broken one yet with 4 flights on her. But the fairings are very frail, I have since filled them with expandable foam. Helped lots.
     
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  9. May 22, 2019 #129

    Fritzk

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    Hello folks.

    I was doing a test fit for the second and third stage transition prior to glue up, and it seems that cutting to the supplied shape on the card is not quite long enough. Anyone else have this issue? I can certainly use cad to work up a proper size one. However before I do, It would be good to know the accurate dimensions for the transition so that the Wrap will fit. I know upper and lower diameters, but does anyone (off the top of their head) know what the exact cone height should be for best fit? 20190522_091950.jpg
     
  10. May 23, 2019 #130

    mjennings

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    I had some issue on the transition foundation wrap too but not nearly s bad as that. Are you on top of the shoulder tube segment or over it? I believe it is supposed to be more of a but joint with the tube than an overlap.
     
  11. May 23, 2019 #131

    Fritzk

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    Hi Micheal,

    Yep, it's butted and not overlapped. Even still, the upper edge is short by a good 1/8" for the BT80. I discovered Chris Michielssen's blog last night, and he mentions that this wrap is short compared to the old 2157 kit.

    I've gotten the tube dimensions, and from inspecting the vacu-formed wrap last night, it looks like the conic edge for the foundation should be 2-11/32". This would allow for the vacu-formed part to have a little overlap at the bottom edge at 2-3/8". Hard to tell as they don't show how much excess beyond the flutes one is supposed leave when cutting.

    A little time on cad, and I have a new pattern printed on 65# cardstock. I'll give it a test fit tomorrow morning before work, and if it fits, I'll post a .pdf here for others who may be having the same issue.

    -Fritz
     
  12. May 23, 2019 #132

    OverTheTop

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    Yes, I had the same problem. I recommend cutting the transition, and also wraps, longer at first and trimming down to the required size. I might have even read that in the instructions somwhere.
    Transitionresize.jpg
     
  13. May 23, 2019 #133

    David Schwantz

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    I just made a new wrap by placing the original on card stock, tracing it out, and adding 1/2". Then I just wrapped it in place, marked my cut lines, and glued a backer on one side of the cut. Now I have a piece that is hand fit and an overlap to glue to. Took like 3 minutes :)
     
  14. May 23, 2019 #134

    VFA-22-Bonefish

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    Yes. I had the very same problem a few months ago. Being that I was going to be flying my rocket on a larger engine than the D engine or cluster C engines that we're proposed, I was cutting the shrouds out of a heavier stock than supplied and when I noticed that the shroud was going to come up short, I cut a longer shroud and overlapped it.

    Best of luck with your kit!
     

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  15. May 23, 2019 #135

    VFA-22-Bonefish

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    Using the expandable foam sounds like a great idea. Thanks!
     
  16. May 23, 2019 #136

    David Schwantz

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    Just be careful of the foam, it will want to come out of any gap that there is. But it did make them stronger. If I do another I think I will fill with foam before they are glued in place, then just carve out the slot for the fin.

    Looks like yours is 29mm also. I fly mine with a AT F-67 4W. See the whole flight and pops the chutes right at the top.
     
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  17. May 23, 2019 #137

    VFA-22-Bonefish

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    Do you recall the product that you used for the foam? I over built every section of my original K36 kit with the intention of flying her on an Aerotech J motor, but might go with what you used instead for the first flight. We have a regional launch next month down here in South Florida and they were asking for folks to launch Apollo rockets in honor of the 50th anniversary.
     
  18. May 23, 2019 #138

    David Schwantz

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    They are right there by you. Shipping might be very quick.
     

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  19. May 24, 2019 #139

    David Schwantz

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    Yours looks great by the way !!
     
  20. May 24, 2019 #140

    VFA-22-Bonefish

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    Thank you very much.
     
  21. May 24, 2019 #141

    Fritzk

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    Thanks David, Bonefish, and Over the Top. Had a feeling it was that simple, but when the transition came up short, I wasn't initially sure if it was because the new pattern simply ended short, or if it was because it was mistakenly scaled. If the second was the case, then the upper and lower radius would be wrong on the Estes card.

    At any rate, since the new pattern I made was already done, I simply used it to check. Sure enough..But, in the off chance that any one wants to use it to know the minimum they have to lengthen the Estes pattern to fit, I've attached the pdf anyhow.
    20190524_082212.jpg
     

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  22. May 24, 2019 #142

    Funkworks

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    Will anyone be cutting away spill holes in the parachutes?
     
  23. May 24, 2019 #143

    VFA-22-Bonefish

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    Hi Fritz,

    When I decided to build my original kit from the 60's it was my first time coming back to the hobby since I took a hiatus 40+years ago. With that said, I was taking things extremely slow, sometimes with a day or so between steps. I really didn't want to rush and mistakingly glue things to the wrong tube or have a messy result because I rushed things. When it came time to cut the shrouds, I bought heavier card stock from my local hobby shop and intentionally cut it a little longer. When it came up short I thought I measured things incorrectly. However sure enough, it was shorter on the one that came with the kit. All I did was cut a longer one, and made sure to fill the gap later with some epoxy. Thanks again for sharing.

    All the best,
    Norman
     
  24. May 29, 2019 #144

    les

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    ARGH!!!!

    WHAT DID I DO???

    Finished building the 1969 kit. Have the base coat down and starting to mask. I was trying to go by the dimensions in the directions but things seem wrong.

    Somehow I have the Inter tank wrap wrong vertically. And not just by a bit, Basically, I placed it with the bottom on the line instead of the top. What to do? I doubt I can get it off without damaging either the wrap or the body tube. Suggestions?

    Very disappointed in myself. And I am supposed to put on a display June 8 that I wanted the Saturn V for the 50th year anniversary.
    Time to buy the 1:200 RTF version so I at least have something
     
  25. May 29, 2019 #145

    OverTheTop

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    That's not good. Hope you figure out a way out of it.


    Question: What color is everyone painting the CM on this? White, like the Skylab version, or shiny metallic like the majority of the Apollo missions? I am adding some more detail to the SM as I think it is a little lacking in details IMHO. Thoughts on this please?
     
  26. May 29, 2019 #146

    kuririn

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    Is this enough detail? Apollo 15 CSM.
    Apollo_CSM_lunar_orbit.jpg
     
  27. May 29, 2019 #147

    VFA-22-Bonefish

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    Can you post a photo? Someone might be able to help.
     
  28. May 29, 2019 #148

    OverTheTop

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    Thanks. Have seen that pic in many locations and will be instrumental in my detailing the radiator panels. My question was as to whether people are painting the CM white, like on the Skylab mission, or the metallised shiny tape, like the image you posted.
     
  29. May 29, 2019 #149

    kuririn

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    For those of you that might not have heard, Chris Michielssen (hcmbanjo) has started a #1969 build a couple of weeks ago on his blog:
    http://modelrocketbuilding.blogspot.com/2019/05/estes-saturn-v-1969-build-part-1-parts.html
    Chris is a master modeler who has been hired by Estes to do some of their showcase model builds.
    He is currently up to part #15, installing the wraps.
    LOTS of tips, tricks, and gotcha heads ups to look out for.
    Highly recommended.
     
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  30. May 29, 2019 #150

    SecondRow

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    Post pictures, please. If I understand, the wrap is positioned too far forward by an amount equal to its length? And you’ve installed the stuffer tube and glued the wood dowels already? What did you use to glue the wrap on?
     

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