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Estes Nike Smoke Pro Series

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KnifeEdge01

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Hello everyone,
I am new to the forum but have been building lower power rockets for a long time. Largest Motor I currently use is a Estes E9. I am looking to build the Nike Smoke pro series from Estes but would like to power it with something that may not put me in the 1500 ft range. I have read that a Aerotech F20-7W will power this rocket but how can I estimate altitude? any other suggestions on power for this? Im thinking to keep it under 1000ft altitude.

Thanks for the help in advance
 

samb

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Welcome to the forum ! I think the PSII Smoke is a great rocket and great intro to midpower and composite propellant motors. Simulation software is the way to go, altitude estimate wise. My suggestion for ease of entry would be Thrustcurve.org

Entering some data in the Motor Guide page will get you a list of motors w/altitude guesstimates that you can work with.

motor guide.jpg

You can save this data for posterity. Here is the results for a Estes Nike Smoke saved by a helpful rocketeer.

nike smoke motors that work.jpg


And you can get some motor selection tips from one of the guys behind Thrustcurve, John Coker: http://www.jcrocket.com/choosing-motors.shtml

Hope this helps.
 

KenRico

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mine flew great on a 29/180 G75J-M !

Get some acme rail guides for a real rail launch .

Kenny
 

smugglervt

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Put my Nike Smoke up a couple of weeks ago on an AT G33FJ to 831 feet. Very nice flight.

FlightGraph.jpg

Then on an AT G64W to 1,528'

FlightGraph.jpg
 
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KnifeEdge01

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Thanks for the input so far! My main goal is to fly this at a smaller field. that is the main reason for trying to keep the altitude lower. Can I launch this with the Estes E launch pad? That is what I launch my Estes V2 with as well as some of my larger models now.
 

Flyfalcons

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For my normal small field club launches, I am thinking of flying my Smoke on an Aerotech F44W-4, with a 29-24mm motor adapter. That should provide enough kick for a safe speed off the pad, while keeping the altitude around 500'.
 

KnifeEdge01

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Awesome, I may have to try that with mine. I am going to pickup the kit tomorrow
 

samb

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Thanks for the input so far! My main goal is to fly this at a smaller field. that is the main reason for trying to keep the altitude lower. Can I launch this with the Estes E launch pad? That is what I launch my Estes V2 with as well as some of my larger models now.
The Estes E pad with the 1/4 inch rod and wide blast deflector will work. I would stake or weight the legs of the tripod as it's a small footprint for a 1 pound+ rocket. Do you have the Estes E controller as well ? You'll find that the 4 AA's don't have enough juice to consistently light composite motors so you should start looking at some of the higher capacity controllers. If you're electrically inclined, you could also build one.

http://www.estesrockets.com/002240-pro-series-iitm-launch-controller

http://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/aro/aro89381.htm

http://www.rocketryforum.com/showth...V-Electron-Beam&highlight=12+volt+controllers
 
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dhbarr

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The Estes E pad with the 1/4 inch rod and wide blast deflector will work. I would stake or weight the legs of the tripod as it's a small footprint for a 1 pound+ rocket. Do you have the Estes E controller as well ? You'll find that the 4 AA's don't have enough juice to consistently light composite motors so you should start looking at some of the higher capacity controllers. If you're electrically inclined, you could also build one.

http://www.estesrockets.com/002240-pro-series-iitm-launch-controller

http://www.hobbylinc.com/htm/aro/aro89381.htm

http://www.rocketryforum.com/showth...V-Electron-Beam&highlight=12+volt+controllers
If you do already have the E controller, some gator clips to a car or SLA battery; or 2x 6v lamp batteries in series works quite nicely.

If you must stick w/ 4*AA, skip rechargeables and go for Energizer Ultimate ( not Advanced ).

HTH,
-dh.
 

KnifeEdge01

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I do not currently have the E controller. I was thinking of either buying one or building a controller as stated above.
 

dhbarr

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I do not currently have the E controller. I was thinking of either buying one or building a controller as stated above.
I should have said: what launch controller do you have currently that you're using with your E pad? :)
 

KnifeEdge01

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I should have said: what launch controller do you have currently that you're using with your E pad? :)

I just use a standard controller with the AA batts. Seems to work good for the Estes motors. But once again I have never launched a larger motor like this.
 

KnifeEdge01

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Do you guys know if the Estes 29mm to 24mm motor adapter will work with the Aerotech motors? Or is there another option I should be looking at ?
 

samb

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Do you guys know if the Estes 29mm to 24mm motor adapter will work with the Aerotech motors? Or is there another option I should be looking at ?
Spent Estes 29mm casings make a good DIY solution. Cut the nozzle end off and clean up the insides with sandpaper. Almost always an alternative ! :)
 

cjgamer

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I use the Estes E Pad with my PS 2 rockets. (and my larger LPR) It works fine. However- what I use are some of those Metal Tent stakes to give it extra stability.
I also use the PS 2 Controller with the C cell batteries I think it has, and had no problem. However I've only done 3 launches so far of MPR.
 

KnifeEdge01

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For launching these rockets I am building a controller for use with 12V. What are you guys using for batteries? I am thinking of usings a 3 cell Lipo that I have. Fully charged this will be at about 12.6 volts. Do you think this will work?
 

KnifeEdge01

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So i picked up the Nike Smoke kit yesterday! Hoping to start the Build tonight. I also ordered some aerotech F44w-4 with 24mm Adapters for the first flight, as well as some F20-4W for second flight to go a bit higher.

I stopped at Radio shack and picked up a Project box for a launch controller. I have a Safety Toggle switch and push Button at home. Going to use 16 or 18 GA wire on the inside wiring and 16 or 18Ga speaker wire to the Motor. To power it will be a 3S Lipo 1100Mah mounted on the inside. I do need to find some sort of removable switch or key from what I understand?
 

Charles_McG

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I'm working my way through a PS Nike Smoke build, and I'll toss in a couple observations about the fins.

To me, the fins seem engineered for quick, light build. The tolerances are really close, and my standard motor mount assembly method ended up requiring a goodly amount of filing to make the fins fit right. After the suggested tack in place, I put down a respectable fillet. It happened to be 5 min epoxy, so it didn't shrink much. I ended having to file flat spots in the epoxy and file wider gaps in the fin notch to get a good fit. I think a little wood glue fillet, dry-shrunk, would not have had the same issue.

I also found I had to adjust the centering notches. A couple of my fins ended up with -just- a little gap at the base, making them a tiny fraction of an inch too thick.

I tried filling the top and bottom internal fin space with white gorilla glue (it expands) - cutting a relief hole in the root. But I can still crack the fins open with a thumbnail. Looks like I'll be adding clear packing tape to go over a G80 motor.
 

Andy Greene

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Well it sounds like at this point your pretty well committed, but for future reference - dry fit the fins before gluing in place to ensure a proper fit. Mine required quite a bit a fiddling with before I got the desired fit I wanted.
As far as gluing the fins together themselves, there was a ton of useful information here - http://www.rocketryforum.com/showth...moke-PSII-Build-(Possible-L1-HPR-Cert-Rocket)
But you may have already seen this.
Weather pending , Im going to get the first flight on mine this weekend. If winds are light a G407W if not an A/T F motor.
20160728_185958.jpg
 
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ThirstyBarbarian

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Other single-use motors that would work great for that rocket on small fields are the rest of the motors in the EconoJet line. You ordered an F20 EconoJet, which is a white propellant with white smoke and white flame, the F23 Econojet makes black smoke, the F27 makes red flame, and the F42 is mostly not visible flame or smoke but is very fast.

The F44 Econmax that you have ordered is also a white propellant, but it is a very fast one compared to the F20. The G74 Economax is very similar to that F44, just bigger, but it may put the rocket higher than you want. Also, pretty much any G motor you order online will require a hazmat charge to be added to the order for shipping. But if you do get into G motors and have bigger field where you can go higher, Aerotech makes a bunch of single-use motors with all those same propellants I mentioned for the Econojets, plus a few more! Oh, yeah!
 

Charles_McG

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I had followed that thread - and test fit everything. My set of fins dry fit great - it just turned out to be harder than anticipated to glue it with CA so nice and tight.

I did two nosecones.
ImageUploadedByRocketry Forum1473818113.051798.jpg
ImageUploadedByRocketry Forum1473818180.099890.jpg
 

KnifeEdge01

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Yea I am definitely committed.... started motor mount tonight. I am using epoxy on all the joints here.

20160913_213919.jpg
 
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KnifeEdge01

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WHhat do you guys think of using Testors plastic cement on the fins? This gives a good amount of working time and I could clamp all sides and center... let me know your thoughts.
 

Andy Greene

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never tried it myself , so I will reserve comment, I used gorilla glue ca and it seemed to work fine- let ya know after Sat :wink:
 

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