Estes Der Red Max (KM-2/0651/1403 Variants) X882 Decal Question

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K'Tesh

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On many of the Estes Citation Red Max/Der Red Max models (as well as variants such as the Big Der Red Max (1403), and the Mega Der Red Max (9705)) I've seen (even in the catalogs (such as the 1973, 1979, and 2015 Estes Catalogs)), I see a white, vertically aligned decal on the nosecone that reads:
X
8
8
2
What I don't understand is where this decal comes from. I've yet to see one on a decal sheet for any of the kits that I've purchased, or seen that have been scanned. Did it appear at one time as part of the Estes kit? Does the numbers mean anything, or is it just something that "Just looks cool"?

If it is official (as in actually been provided with a kit, and not like the Estes Cineroc/Omega decal occasionally seen on the body tube in some photos but never shipped with any kits), can someone give me the info I need to document this variant, and scan the decal sheet with a good ruler to allow me sim it?

Thanks.

 
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It used to be on the decal sheet, but the last Red Max I bought it was no longer there... Which I think is a bummer, as I like having it on the nosecone. It used to be surrounded by a black dotted line so you knew it was there, as a white decal on white paper was very hard to see.
 
My understanding is there was a several year period where the "tail' number and der-mitten-und-footen were left out.
 
my quicky catalog search reveals that from introduction through 1987 the nose number was there, after the kit made a come back the number was awol.
Rex
 
Thanks for the info guys...

I found conclusive evidence that the decal was part of the decal sheet for the Der Big Red Max (1977) over on YORF. This photo by Scigs30 clearly shows it in the top right corner of the decal sheet (PN 37202). Also visible is a white "NICHT STOMPIN" and "MITT GRABBEN" decals flanking the top of large skull and crossbones decal.

DSC_0081.jpg


A check on JimZ's site shows that the "decals" archived there are not an actual scan, but an image that someone derived from one, and the nosecone number, and Estes logo have been ommitted.

God, I wish Scigs30 would scan his decals once in a while!
 
I managed to get an older DRM decal sheet from Estes a couple of years ago when I thought the X882 decal was missing, and the Customer service guy, said that the X882 was on the older kits but not the newer ones. They happened to have one at that time, he said I got lucky! When I find it I will post the excerpt from the email.
 
Contacted Estes, and made a suggestion on how to bring back the missing decals... Sell them separately for those of us who want them, and add them back for future runs of the kits.
 
Here is the email from Mike Fritz at Estes about the X882 decal:

"Mr. Harshberger. I checked with the product manager and there was a revision done to the decal sheet in 2012 adding the number back onto the decal sheet, but there were some mixed decal sheets in the product packed at that time...which is what appears you have. There was also a change to the panel artwork and the last revision date of that panel is from 2015 and the number on the nose cone was removed for some reason. Bottom line is that we have not had a dedicated parts department in over ten years now so any and all pieces/parts I have for customer replacement come from damaged or defective kits, of which I currently have no DRM parts remaining.

However, I also have a box of miscellaneous decals for various rockets from over the years that I checked and about half way through that box I found a single DRM decal sheet with the missing number included. I will package this decal up and send it to you at the address you’ve provided, but that is the last one I have.

Regards,

Mike Fritz

Estes-Cox Corp"
 
Mike needs to fix his email signature....it's not "Estes-Cox Corp" any more.... :D

added: oops - I see that was a couple of years ago when it was Estes-Cox Corp.

That said, Mike will dig in and help out any way he can in my experience.

And perhaps there will be a parts department again someday under the new ownership. Many other good things seem to be happening so one can certainly hope.
 
Mike needs to fix his email signature....it's not "Estes-Cox Corp" any more.... :D

added: oops - I see that was a couple of years ago when it was Estes-Cox Corp.

That said, Mike will dig in and help out any way he can in my experience.

And perhaps there will be a parts department again someday under the new ownership. Many other good things seem to be happening so one can certainly hope.
Well....they did just start offering the MDRM nosecone and body tube in the parts area.
 
Well, I got a couple of updates to this:

I just bought another DRM, and asked Randy to open the kit and look at the decals for me. The copyright date was 2007-2011, but the decals were embossed with a kit date of 12/07/2018. Mine was lacking the nosecone decal. Unfortunately the scans he sent me don't show the embossing. I contacted Estes, and they had a set of decals, and they were copyright 2008-2012, and John Boren was able to show Sandra (the Customer Service representative) that it does have the nosecone decal.

The decal should appear on the same sheet as the "Kills" decal, and if you were to look at the sheet, they'd be located where the "Killed" trucks would be about to run them over. I wasn't able to establish if the white "Mit Grabben" handprint and "Nicht Stompen" footprint are included. John has told me that future DRMs will have a black outline to help people find the hidden white decal(s).

Estes Der Red Max Nosecone decal location.png
 
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I looked at a DRM kit I have in the stash this morning I forgot to see when the kit was packaged, but it did not have a QR code graphic on the face card. The decal sheets are embossed 2017 and did not have the NC decal, nor the white grab and stomp decals.
 
The old Big Red Max (came in a starter set with the Big Foot pad) had the nosecone decal. I know that because I had that rocket as a kid, and I was (and still am) hamfisted with decals. The X882 decal on my rocket was one of the few that actually stuck, so I remember it well. Sadly, that rocket floated into a large group of trees in the neighborhood and apparently took up residence there - much searching in the area where it appeared to enter the trees revealed no trace.
 
The old Big Red Max (came in a starter set with the Big Foot pad) had the nosecone decal. I know that because I had that rocket as a kid, and I was (and still am) hamfisted with decals. The X882 decal on my rocket was one of the few that actually stuck, so I remember it well. Sadly, that rocket floated into a large group of trees in the neighborhood and apparently took up residence there - much searching in the area where it appeared to enter the trees revealed no trace.
Thanks for sharing that... Sorry to hear about your lost rocket.
 
This issue popped up again on FB, bringing me back into researching on this kit.

Since the DRM (652) was re-released, there's been some confusion about the white decals especially the X882 Nosecone Decal that I've not been able to wrap my head around. I understand that there might have been versions of the kit released without the decal, with the decal included (but hidden by the backing paper's color) and finally, the decal included with a black dashedline box drawn around it. Similarly, I have questions about the presence or absence of the white "Mit Grabben" and "Nicht Stompen" decals, included, hidden by the backing paper, or dashlined boxed.

All versions of the Red Max I've seen, prior to it's reissue, had the NC decal and a single set of the white "Grabben" and "Stompen" decals. All the decal sheets I've seen were white(ish). Though there's always a possiblity of blue background sheets in the later runs of the original issue. An image of my Citaton Red Max's decals shared with JimZ is below:

1718531366181.png

So, what I'm looking for is info on the various production runs (thanks to Estes embossing the date of production) and the decals included.

The 04/15/22 production run has two sheets of decals on a pale blue backing paper. The NC decal is on the smaller sheet, and enclosed in a dashedlined box. On the larger sheet, there are single copies of the white "Mitt Grabben" and "Nicht Stompen" decals in the dashlined boxes. Something to note is that the engine mount tube is 3.5" long (making it inconvenient to push the engine block into place for larger folks (like myself) with larger diameter fingers). Surprisingly the centering rings were die cut.


20240615_202048.jpg


Edit: Fearing I messed up on my sims, I went back and double checked on the RM's engine mount tube, and found that they all used BT-20G (3.5 inch) engine mount tubes. Whew! I got them right in the sims.
 
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