Estes 1969 Saturn V Status

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GuyNoir

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I can share from experience that the AT E15-4 is an ideal motor for the Estes Saturn V, and is a highly reliable, economical, readily-available option.
James, I flew my 2157 at NARAM on an E30-4. Also built it to retain the F1's. Still think the E15 would work on that sort of Saturn V?
 

Tobor

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Well.....
I can say with a far amount of certainty that USPS has lost my Saturn V :mad::mad::mad:

January 24, 2019, 5:53 am
Arrived at USPS Regional Destination Facility
CHICAGO IL DISTRIBUTION CENTER
Your item arrived at our CHICAGO IL DISTRIBUTION CENTER destination facility on January 24, 2019 at 5:53 am. The item is currently in transit to the destination.
USPS tracking has not been updated since....
 

DeltaVee

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Well.....
I can say with a far amount of certainty that USPS has lost my Saturn V :mad::mad::mad:



USPS tracking has not been updated since....
Mine still says "accepted"... and it's been two days now... I expect the reliability of the tracking may have become questionable.
 

DeltaVee

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Bellville has them in stock for $53.09. Or when mine show up today I can sell one for ONE MILLION DOLLARS!!1!!111!1!
Considering that AC supply charged me half as much for USPS shipping... (of course I paid full-fare from Estes but at least I got free shipping).

On the front page it said "flat rate shipping at 14.99... however when I looked at what the shipping line in an order for one Saturn V would be, it was $23.99. I know one would not weigh in at over 50 lbs.
 
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DaveinMI

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Bellville has them in stock for $53.09. Or when mine show up today I can sell one for ONE MILLION DOLLARS!!1!!111!1!
Sounds like fair offer, I'd probably do the same. But, since you don't have it in stock, maybe I'll go to Bellville. I hope their kit has the "bonus" kit it isn't in the description........... THANKS ! For the note, I forgot about them !
 

James Harechmak

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Sounds like fair offer, I'd probably do the same. But, since you don't have it in stock, maybe I'll go to Bellville. I hope their kit has the "bonus" kit it isn't in the description........... THANKS ! For the note, I forgot about them !
Just arrived
IMG_20190125_104313239.jpeg
 
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afadeev

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Checked further at Bellville, $23.99 for shipping...........to MI. Seems a little steep.
Bellville had always had over-the-top shipping and handling surcharges. For everything. Sneaky.

I've avoided them all these years for that reason.

a
 

georgegassaway

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AC Supply (40% off) has free shipping on orders of $100 or more. When I ordered three 1/45 Little Joe-II's a few years ago, I added some engines to reach $100. Always order at least $100 worth.

As for USPS tracking, sometimes it's a bit odd. I doubt that Saturn-V kit is truly "lost", most likely delayed for whatever reason.

I will also say that one time, a shipment from AC Supply made it nearly here, then USPS tracking showed it was sent BACK to Missouri for some reason. I really needed the engines in that shipment soon. I contacted AC Supply. They sent a DUPLICATE shipment, and asked if the original shipment showed up here, to send it back. So I got the replacement order in time for the launch. And two days later the original shipment showed up. I sent it back using a prepaid shopping label AC Supply e-mailed to me. THIS is why I recommend AC Supply so much.
 

shreadvector

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James, I flew my 2157 at NARAM on an E30-4. Also built it to retain the F1's. Still think the E15 would work on that sort of Saturn V?
The AT E15 is actually identical to the AT E20. Check the actual test data on NAR S&T. Only difference is labeling and the way they are packaged.
 

BA_Incognito

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Same thing happened with my order. Sent an email and Doug responded indicating that the Explorer Aquarius deliveries from Estes along with a bunch of Saturn Vs had been delayed by weather. My order is supposed to be shipping today. Got the feeling even they were surprised by the response to the Saturn V offer and that the weather hasn't helped.

This was my first time ordering from AC Supply, but based on the email from Doug I am feeling a lot better (and hope those folks at AC Supply are doing better as well in all of this craziness!)
 
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georgegassaway

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I think the Saturn-V would fly best on an F10, with a gimbaled engine. Or a 32mm G12, or the new Aerotech G8 (17 second burn. SEVENTEEN!)

It's not that hard to do these days, with an Eagle Tree Guardian (R/C plane autopilot) or best yet Joe Barnard's (BPS Space) guidance system. Imagine the Estes Saturn-V flying as shown in this animated GIF link (the actual animated GIF will not display on TRF):

https://static1.squarespace.com/sta...ab562fa757bc0f5688/1531375597913/?format=500w

https://bps.space/signal/

I'd like to do a Gimbaled Saturn-V myself, but I have a different special project I want to get done this year. It's not that hard to do.
 
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DeltaVee

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I think the Saturn-V would fly best on an F10, with a gimbaled engine. Or a 32mm G12, or the new Aerotech G8 (17 second burn. SEVENTEEN!)

It's not that hard to do these days, with an Eagle Tree Guardian (R/C plane autopilot) or best yet Joe Barnard's (BPS Space) guidance system. Imagine the Estes Saturn-V flying as shown in this animated GIF link (the actual animated GIF will not display on TRF):

https://static1.squarespace.com/sta...ab562fa757bc0f5688/1531375597913/?format=500w

https://bps.space/signal/

I'd like to do a Gimbaled Saturn-V myself, but I have a different special project I want to get done this year. It's not that hard to do.
I build 'em too slowly as it is... but you're right... BPS Saturn V would be be "absolutely mahvelous!!!"
 

James Duffy

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James, I flew my 2157 at NARAM on an E30-4. Also built it to retain the F1's. Still think the E15 would work on that sort of Saturn V?
Yep. The total impulse is much the same, but the longer burn on the E15 would yield a more realistic flight, while still getting the model off of the pad safely.

James
 

hutch

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Got my shipping notification today. We'll see how long it takes to get through customs and into my mailbox.

Great communication from Doug.
 

ThirstyBarbarian

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Yep. The total impulse is much the same, but the longer burn on the E15 would yield a more realistic flight, while still getting the model off of the pad safely.

James
Also, to me, the E30 is sort of boring, with a barely-visible flame and almost no smoke. Its main purpose is as a high-thrust motor for speed, and that’s not what you need for a Saturn V launch. For a Saturn V, it needs to be slower and with some flame and drama.
 

Tobor

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...As for USPS tracking, sometimes it's a bit odd. I doubt that Saturn-V kit is truly "lost", most likely delayed for whatever reason.
Luckily for me, you were correct. Package arrived about two hours after my previous post. Please note that in my area, USPS has lost quite a few of my packages over the years. Most recent event was 4 weeks ago. It was a small Amazon order, 20 #7 ball bearing swivels to be exact. Items were never found.

Anyhoot I digress....
Sat-V and Friends-Small.jpg
 

DeltaVee

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Also, to me, the E30 is sort of boring, with a barely-visible flame and almost no smoke. Its main purpose is as a high-thrust motor for speed, and that’s not what you need for a Saturn V launch. For a Saturn V, it needs to be slower and with some flame and drama.
The AT 24/40 E18 with white lightning propellant should fit the bill as well.
 
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dpower

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James, I flew my 2157 at NARAM on an E30-4. Also built it to retain the F1's. Still think the E15 would work on that sort of Saturn V?
More detail please! Did you keep the center F1 as well, just cutting a 24mm hole through it?
 

Saluki

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Saturn V #2157 E-M copy.jpg
Saturn V engine mod0002.jpg
Saturn V engine mod aa .jpg
More detail please! Did you keep the center F1 as well, just cutting a 24mm hole through it?
This is not my modification. This is an article years ago.
 
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DeltaVee

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View attachment 372832 View attachment 372835 View attachment 372836 This is not my modification. This is an article years ago.
Interesting how this suggests filling the vacuform fins with foam prior to gluing on, even going so far as to suggest Home Depot's "Good Stuff" canned foam. I had thought about using "Good Stuff" on the fairings as well, possibly injecting foam after gluing them on...

But having been warned:
Don't use the spray can foam....
I decided against it...

But now I'm wondering if this warning has to do with injecting the foam after gluing the fairings on (which on curing could put too much pressure on the fairings) as opposed to filling the fairings with the foam, letting it cure then cutting the excess away and slicing out slots for the fins... this stuff is incredibly light... of course I suppose the canned stuff could attack the plastic...

Also, how far from the tip of the nose should the CG for this thing be? Anyone?
 

James Harechmak

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Interesting how this suggests filling the vacuform fins with foam prior to gluing on, even going so far as to suggest Home Depot's "Good Stuff" canned foam. I had thought about using "Good Stuff" on the fairings as well, possibly injecting foam after gluing them on...

But having been warned:


I decided against it...

But now I'm wondering if this warning has to do with injecting the foam after gluing the fairings on (which on curing could put too much pressure on the fairings) as opposed to filling the fairings with the foam, letting it cure then cutting the excess away and slicing out slots for the fins... this stuff is incredibly light... of course I suppose the canned stuff could attack the plastic...

Also, how far from the tip of the nose should the CG for this thing be? Anyone?
Injecting after the fairings are on is bad news, always fill then cut and sand to fit. The real problem with all canned foams I've used is that they continue to grow after their supposedly cured. I've never had the growing problem with AB foams though.
 

DeltaVee

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Injecting after the fairings are on is bad news, always fill then cut and sand to fit. The real problem with all canned foams I've used is that they continue to grow after their supposedly cured. I've never had the growing problem with AB foams though.
Yeah I see what you mean... I wouldn't want one flying off and taking out someone's eye!
 

afadeev

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Interesting how this suggests filling the vacuform fins with foam prior to gluing on, even going so far as to suggest Home Depot's "Good Stuff" canned foam. I had thought about using "Good Stuff" on the fairings as well, possibly injecting foam after gluing them on...
Why would you want to do that?
Plastic wraps are primarily decorative, and secondarily add a bit of structural reinforcement. The best thing about them is how light they are, and adding any additional weight would only make the aft end of the (already porky) rocket that much heavier, requiring more ballast in the nose (making it heavier yet).

I would advise against that.
Keep it light, keep it simple.


But having been warned:
But now I'm wondering if this warning has to do with injecting the foam after gluing the fairings on (which on curing could put too much pressure on the fairings) as opposed to filling the fairings with the foam, letting it cure then cutting the excess away and slicing out slots for the fins... this stuff is incredibly light... of course I suppose the canned stuff could attack the plastic...
Yes, but why?
If you are worried about braking the plastic fins - they will break either at the point of attachment to the body tube, or chip off the exposed upper ends. Either way, you want to be in position to replace them as easily as possible (replacement fins are readily available from Estes), and filling the fairing would only make the replacement job harder.

Once you glue the fairing to the airframe and the edges of protruding fins, they become fairly firm. The only reinforcement I added to mine is gluing the semi-circular card-stocks to the aft end of the fairings, and that was mostly to hide the imperfect fit, similar to this:
http://modelrocketbuilding.blogspot.com/2011/05/estes-saturn-v-build-part-33-glue.html

Also, how far from the tip of the nose should the CG for this thing be? Anyone?
Please see my OR model below - 20.3" from nose tip, as pictured below.
Note that my tail is heavier than normal, due to 29mm motor mount upgrade, and 5mm plywood centering rings.

That is without motors, but with stock 29g ballast in the nose.
I would need 58g to get 1 caliber of stability with E30 motor. More for longer/heavier motors.
You really want to maintain and adjust your own .rkt file to model stability for your build weight and chosen motors.

SatV.jpg

HTH,
a
 

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DeltaVee

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Why would you want to do that?

Yes, but why?
If you are worried about braking the plastic fins - they will break either at the point of attachment to the body tube, or chip off the exposed upper ends. Either way, you want to be in position to replace them as easily as possible (replacement fins are readily available from Estes), and filling the fairing would only make the replacement job harder.
It's not the fins I'm concerned about... I'd rather not have the fairings crush on landing. A light rigid foam filling could help prevent tears, dents....
 
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