Estes 1/200 Scale RTF Saturn V

Discussion in 'Low Power Rocketry (LPR)' started by JumpJet, Jan 10, 2019.

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  1. May 3, 2019 #121

    gtg738w

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    I’ve made some progress on a 24mm conversion. I’ll get some data on a C11 & D12 if the weather improves out here.

    C25C00F4-B541-40BF-A89A-E2A1DFA69E00.jpeg
     
  2. May 3, 2019 #122

    BABAR

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    Will it need some nose weight?
     
  3. May 3, 2019 #123

    gtg738w

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    The mount itself is pretty close in weight, but the motor is a good bit heavier. My plan is to balance back to where the original CG was with the C6-3. Not sure what it will take yet.
     
  4. May 5, 2019 #124

    dpower

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    I flew one on a C6-3, C12-4, and D16-4, on a dead calm day. The C6 was sufficient, but did arc over quite a bit, and was past apogee when it deployed. The Q-Jets were both nice straight flights.
     
  5. May 5, 2019 #125

    SecondRow

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    Do you have an estimate for the altitudes? I’m especially interested in the C12.
     
  6. May 5, 2019 #126

    BEC

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    I'm taking one of mine up to Sixty Acres shortly and intend to fly it with an altimeter aboard on those three motors. I'm still skeptical of the big delta between an Estes C6 and a Q-Jet C12 reported earlier in this thread, but should have data later today. Look on the FlightSketch logs to see.

    It's a little breezy so I may forgo the Estes C6-3. I'll figure that out when I get up there.
     
  7. May 6, 2019 #127

    BEC

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    All I got was the C6-3 flight - to 199 feet per the FS Mini. I was expecting it to arc over more based on the comments above, but the boost was pretty straight, really.

    However, the motor I used was rather old (1996) and the delay was WAY short. The upshot of that was that it ejected going up, the 'chute stripped three shroud lines and so it broke off two fins (and cracked the LES) on the bounced landing - even though it was on a grass field (the same one that's in the background in my avatar). One of the two broken fins resisted my attempts to reattach it with medium CA on the field, so I didn't attempt to repair or replace the 'chute while there.

    Next chance will be this coming Saturday at my own club launch (which I run)....but since we have two Cub Scout groups coming I don't know how much of a chance I'll get to fly myself. I will post the data when I have them.
     
  8. May 6, 2019 #128

    gtg738w

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    Ouch! I saw the flight you posted, looks like it ejected at ~85ft/s. That will do it for sure. Does the fin can look repairable? That seems like the weak link to me. I’m still trying to figure how to strengthen it and keep the clear fins.

    We had a brief break in the rain here on Saturday but I was helping with an elementary school launch and didn’t get a chance to fly mine. Hopefully soon, this week is looking better.
     
  9. May 6, 2019 #129

    BEC

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    The one balky fin will require epoxy fillets around the break I think. I need to make a small batch of epoxy to do fillets on a couple of contest models I'm building so I'll get do the S-V at the same time.

    The stock fins would probably be fine under the fully-open canopy of that 'chute, at least landing on most surfaces. But they do seem a bit thin - which of course helps performance.

    By the way (and this is probably more for the FS Mini thread) I didn't put any static ports of any kind in the Saturn V as I couldn't think of any place i wanted to put holes in the main body. So...I'm just depending on leakage around the separation joint for now.
     
  10. May 6, 2019 #130

    RocketT.Coyote

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    Ordered two from AC Supply about a month ago.
     
  11. May 8, 2019 #131

    shreadvector

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    I ordered 6 on Monday and they shipped and should arrive this coming Monday. Will launch with C6-3 at our club launch on 18-May. Then, assuming it survives, I will try one of the 25 C12-4 and D16-4 motors I ordered (along with 25 C12-6 and D16-6) which will also arrive next week. I ordered extras for other club members who never order online and want to buy in person with cash. No stores = no sales.
     
  12. May 19, 2019 #132

    gtg738w

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    I finally got to fly my Saturn Vs today. The stock 18mm with the C6-3 was a little disappointing. We had medium winds, ~10mph, and as soon as it left the rod, it took a hard turn upwind and only made it to 100ft. It ejected just before it hit the ground with surprisingly no damage except for a small tear in the 'chute.

    9FF3E9BE-AA7B-4F75-B090-25E5B2BDB93E.jpeg

    Next up was the 24mm mod with a C11-3. Much better flight, straight up to ~200 ft. Flew it again on a D12-5 and another great flight. Definitely the best of the bunch so far. Slight turn upwind to 400ft and easy recovery. Beautiful liftoff as well.

    3C21C35A-72C6-411A-B6A9-1745DEB31AD3.jpeg



    Flight log for the D12:
    https://flightsketch.com/flights/263/

    Will be flying this one again for sure!
     
    Last edited: May 19, 2019
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  13. May 21, 2019 #133

    gtg738w

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  14. May 21, 2019 #134

    BABAR

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    Again seems unfortunate that Estes puts out a(nother ) rocket that if built stock (18mm motor mount) doesn’t fly optimally with an Estes engine. From what I have seen so far, if I had one I’d either get a QJet D or upscale the mount to 24mm.

    I guess we will have more data July 20, as lots of posts have suggested many people plan to launch this commemorative rocket on the anniversary. Should be an interesting day. I wonder if at club launches RSOs may step in if the first few C6-3 flights are sub-nominal.
     
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  15. May 23, 2019 #135

    terryg

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    Is there a rocksim file available for this rocket? If I get this kit, I would want use the D13W reloads that I already have. A white flame fits a Saturn V better then the black smoke of the QJets.
     
  16. May 23, 2019 #136

    GuyNoir

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    Bob Kaplow flew his on a C6-3 at our last club launch and it worked fine. Plenty of altitude for chute deployment.
     
  17. May 23, 2019 #137

    beeblebrox

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    There should not be a problem with that at all, clear fins plenty big enough. Not much difference in weight to a C6-3...There is plenty of room around the paper tube inside where it separates for a little clay...
     
  18. May 24, 2019 #138

    Eljay

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    The C6-3 flights are a bit underwhelming but OK if it's not too windy. I've flown it with a D16, probably a D10 is next up but I wouldn't hesitate to use a D13.

    With the D16 it really moves off the pad, I don't think you'll be real focused on the smoke color so much as keeping an eye on it, and that black smoke is really only dark right near the pad.
     
  19. May 24, 2019 #139

    Scott_650

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    I launched mine this morning trying out a new flying field (small park next town over that didn’t really work out) on a C6-3 and had a lot of arcing over. Barely a 5 mph breeze but not near the vertical flight I’d anticipated. As soon as my regular field is available I’ll try a QJet - do the QJet C motors have a power advantage over an Estes C6? I’m also wondering if Estes has higher powered 18mm motors in the works - certainly possible and would be welcomed if they do.
     
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  20. May 24, 2019 #140

    BEC

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    A Q-Jet C has about one more N-s of total impulse (per certification data) but in this model takes it to nearly twice the altitude (as measured by an onboard altitmeter - a Flight Sketch Mini beta unit in my case).

    The big Q-Jet advantage is the almost instantaneous thrust at ignition rather than the ramp-up over a quarter of a second or so on the Estes C6. The Q-Jet thrust then increases until burnout. Quite a different approach which this model seems to really “appreciate”.
     
  21. May 24, 2019 #141

    Scott_650

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    Perfect! I’d guesstimate mine went 175ish feet, considering the arced flight path, on the Estes C6-3 (delay worked ok) so 300-350 feet on a QJet C would make for a great demo rocket. I’ll try both a QJ D and C next time. And maybe the Flight Sketch adapter is an option too - BP C motors seem like a natural fit for this rocket.
     
  22. May 25, 2019 #142

    PhlAsh

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    Flew mine for the first time today on a Quest D16-6. Perfect flight.
     
  23. May 26, 2019 #143

    FreeFlighter

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    For gosh sakes!
    I received a notice from a local hobby shop that the Estes Saturn V kit, and the RTF version had been received. I inquired about prices- and nearly launched myself into orbit ! $70 and $90 ? Wowza! I think I will rebuild the original version that I have from the 1980s. It didn't fly well, from being under-powered, and was launched only once. E- power, here I come !
     
  24. May 26, 2019 #144

    Eljay

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    So this is why local hobby shops are dying. At AC supply they're $54 and $42.
     
  25. May 27, 2019 #145

    shreadvector

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    PLUS SHIPPING - unless you buy enough to get free shipping.....I suggest buying a case of 6. You can't afford NOT to buy a case of 6!
     
  26. May 27, 2019 #146

    Eljay

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    $100 is free shipping. I usually top off with motors - they have those educator pack of A-C motors which are an awesome deal.
     
  27. May 27, 2019 #147

    MikeT

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    You have to remember that the LHS has overhead. Bitch about them all you want but you'll miss them when they are gone.

    Mike
     
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  28. May 27, 2019 #148

    James Harechmak

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    Growing up in the 70's and 80's we had 6 or 7 hobby shops within an hours drive. One I could get to inside of 5 minutes on my bike. Now I have a 90 minute drive to the closest Hobby Town which is woefully understocked on anything other than RPG and card games.
     
  29. May 27, 2019 #149

    MikeT

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    Really a shame. I also have fond memories as a kid going the LHS to get my rocket supplies. I even remember stuffing cash including change in a envelope to Estes for rockets. Can't do that today. I spend 3 days a week at the LHS supporting the Air stuff. I've increased the rocketry section and I'm happy to report the stuff still sells great. So many guys wanting to share the fun with their kids.

    Mike
     
  30. May 27, 2019 #150

    Scott_650

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    Ok, second flight of my Saturn - first one was a couple days ago, less than 5mph breeze on an Estes C6-3, rather marginal flight, arced over at less than 200 feet but did recover ok. Today on a Quest QJet C12-4 - nearly a disaster. Sky writing and then a tangential flight, recovery was ok with the chute having enough time to open so no damage. Post flight inspection showed me something I’d missed during prep - the QJet is SLIGHTLY longer than an Estes 18mm motor so the engine retainer didn’t hold the clear fin unit tight against the base plate allowing a fair amount of movement. That most likely explains the erratic flight. I considered making a spacer on the field out of some fiberboard and trying another flight but decided against an expedient fix- I’ll do it right on the work bench and make sure everything fits properly.
     

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