Does the Renegade Booster Glide????

[MetMan]

Hello All,

I've finished my Renegade but have yet to fly her. As I looked at the booster and tried to figure out the best landing configuration for it, it occurred to me that it might glide. My son built a CC Express and because its fins were a little off, the booster actually glides! It's steep but definitely a glide.

Since it's looking like a GREAT weekend weather-wise, I hope to be able to report on a Renegade flight...

MetMan

 

[cydermaster]

Originally posted by MetMan
Since it's looking like a GREAT weekend weather-wise, I hope to be able to report on a Renegade flight...

Fingers crossed for good weather.

Looks like you could be the first to post a flight report for the Renegade.

My Renegade has been looking at me (along with 7 other finished, but unflown, rockets), waiting for some suitable launching weather. Shouldn't be long - it gets better from mid-March onwards, over here.

 

[Austin]

Good luck Cider...we want pics and a report, of course!

Carl

 

[cls]

my Renegade's booster tumbles.

the fins line up exactly right. sorry, won't do it again.

(2x flights on C6-0/C6-5 and 1x on B6-0/B6-6.)

 

[powderburner]

If you build it according to plans, the booster stage does not look anything at all like a 'flyable' configuration. I would be quite surprised if it did anything but tumble.

Mine is still in mid-build. I am a little worried about those tip pods getting snapped off when the booster lands. I'd like to hear the flight reports from the rest of you guys when you get started.

 

[flying_silverad]

Something doesn't sound right if it's gliding. If it decends with any speed speed I'm sure the booster would be short lived. The booster is supposed to be unstable so that it tumbles instead of gliding. It does raise the cool thought of a self configuring gliding booster though....hmmmm....

 

[cls]

no worries about the tip pods falling off. I followed the directions and used plastic cement for contact and fillets and it is fine.

 

[powderburner]

Just wait until it lands on a hard patch of ground, or in a parking lot.

 

[MetMan]

That wasn't what I thought. Hold it up in a "pods up" configuration. You've got a rudder up top and four "wing surfaces". It would be really quite a bit more durable if it did glide like this--the side pod nosecones would absorb most of the impact.

Is there a glider expert in the house? How could the booster be trimmed or redesigned to glide?

MetMan

 

[cls]

powderburner - true, the landings so far have been on grass. it's flexible but I don't think it will break. anyways if it does, so what, just glue it back together.

 

[graylensman]

Originally posted by flying_silverad
Something doesn't sound right if it's gliding. If it decends with any speed speed I'm sure the booster would be short lived. The booster is supposed to be unstable so that it tumbles instead of gliding. It does raise the cool thought of a self configuring gliding booster though....hmmmm....

I recalled seeing this on JimZ's site some time ago:

https://www.dars.org/jimz/eirp_22.htm

it is a DOM called the Tiger Shark and the booster is indeed supposed to glide. I haven't built it; i have enough trouble finding a place to fly the ones that just go up and come down.

 

[powderburner]

graylensman, I think I remember seeing that plan. I have built/flown a gliding booster (many yrs ago) but don't remember which design it was. The gliding-thing is not really a problem, you just trim it to turn, and it flies in circles as it descends. Kind of fun, actually, but I don't think the Renegade is anywhere close to being ready to glide, or being trimmable.

 

[stevem]

Not sure if this is pertinent to this thread but I can tell you that MY Renegade booster did not glide.

Just finished my Renegade last Saturday. I built the booster as a 3 engine cluster. I added MMTs to the large pods on the booster.
I also lengthened the upper stage BT by 6 inces and added a baffle system.

Flew it Sunday for the first time with B6-0s in the Booster Pods and a C6-0 in the main MMT. Upper stage had a b6-4 in it.

This thing just SCREAMED off the pad! When the upper stage lit we lost site of the rocket momentarily. We could see the booster separate and the Pod engines ejected from the booster. The booster tumbled for a little way but then it started coming in with all the pointy things pointing down!

We chased the upper stage about a 1/4 mile - it was un-damaged.

here are pics of the booster landing...

 

[stevem]

another angle...

 

[stevem]

the launch pic...

 

[Fore Check]

Tough break on the booster - but a really neat idea none-the-less. Nice launch pic!

 

[powderburner]

stevem,
Those photos look horrible. Please tell us that the damage was somehow not too bad. No rocket should have to land nose-first in rocks, no matter how bad it has been behaving.

 

[MetMan]

stevem,

Did you consider adding recovery to the side boosters? I've thought about adding motors to the side boosters but I thought I would add either small chutes or streamers and use short delay engines in the side pods.

Great take off pic, though!

MetMan

 

[Donaldsrockets]

I have a Renegade and I have flown it twice. Both times the booster came straight down after seperation but for some reason it hasn't suffered any damage. I must have built it tougher than I thought.

Also, I only reccommend the C6-0 for the booster. Try the C6-0/C6-7 combo. I think you'll like it.

 

[Steve]

Finished construction on mine, but being my first 2-stager - therefore not knowing what to expect - I decided to fly her nekkid in case there was an unexpected and devastating malfunction. I didn't want to lose a rocket and all the time and effort involved in painting her. (Plus I just couldn't wait that long )

Here's what she looked like before her maiden flight:

S..

 

[Steve]

and another:

 

[Steve]

The first flight was very successful, and very cool. The family and I really got a kick out of seeing (and hearing) the second stage light off. I used a C6 for the booster and – because I had no idea what to expect – I used an A6-4 (I think) for the sustainer. Like I said, it worked great… but that little A didn’t give me the height I wanted. Both pieces were recovered fully intact, but it was getting too dark to try again with a bigger motor. (Not to mention we were all out tramping in the alfalfa field with flashlights looking for my Laser-X – but that’s another story). I decided to go with a B6-4 the next time, and I was happier with that motor. But both the booster and the sustainer broke a fin on landing this time. Easily repaired (with epoxy), and ready to go again. I also took the advice of others here and used little standoffs to increase the distance between the pods and the bt. I still haven’t painted her yet, so I don’t know how that little mod will work out. One last thing – the two pieces of the rocket are a really snug fit. The thin red paper layer on the coupler is really getting raggedy, and I’m tempted to carefully peel it off, but then I’m afraid I’ll be left with a fuzzy coupler. Any ideas?

S..

 

[PunkRocketScience]

I have two flights on my Renegade as well. It boosted great on a B6-0/B6-4 combo, but really moved on a B6-0/C6-5!

I filleted the living snot out of the fin pods with CA, fearing the worst for the silly things sticking way the heck out there. They held together great, but I popped a fin on the booster instead...

Here is a pic of the Renegade on the pad before launch...sorry, no launch pics as I'm still trying to get the timing on the new digital camera down...

 

[PunkRocketScience]

...and another!

 

[powderburner]

Originally posted by Bushrat
One last thing – the two pieces of the rocket are a really snug fit. The thin red paper layer on the coupler is really getting raggedy, and I’m tempted to carefully peel it off, but then I’m afraid I’ll be left with a fuzzy coupler. Any ideas?

Did you soak these parts with CA?

Before assembly, I usually soak the aft end of the upper stage BT, the matching front end of the booster BT, and the stage coupler with thin CA. Wait for it to cure, sand with fine sandpaper (200 grit?). If the CA causes any of the cardboard parts to swell then you may get a tight fit instead of a slip-fit, but usually a little more sanding will fix it.

You can still do this after assembly, but it is a little more awkward to sand the parts.

Once treated in this way, I seldom have problems with stage couplers during the life of the rocket.

 

[Steve]

RocketmanTM -

I saw your Renegade in another thread, and thought the same thing then - that is one of the coolest paintjobs I've seen on a model rocket . (And it's not because I haven't seen that many, either ). It even looks better sitting on the pad! Now you've got to get some (plural) launch pics!

Sweet.

S..

 

[PunkRocketScience]

Thanks Bushrat!

Next launch, I'll shoot with my film camera...at 4.5 frames per second, I don't miss many launches.

My friend like the paint job so much, he says he's going to do a similar one, but in red.

Kinda like the variety possible, like B5 Star Furies...

 

[Steve]

Originally posted by powderburner
Did you soak these parts with CA?

Nope - I know that's a popular method for this sort of thing, I just never had a reason before, so I didn't think of it. That CA ain't cheap - does it take much to do the job?

Thanks!

S..

 

[graylensman]

Originally posted by RocketmanTM
Kinda like the variety possible, like B5 Star Furies...

OOOOOooooooo..... now there's an idea...

 

[shreadvector]

All of the new Renegades flown at our club launches hace been built stock and all have had the boosters spiral dive into the ground. The tubes were bent when the nose cones hit the hard "dirt" (actually rock infested dirt). Strangely, I've seen one CC Express do this and one tumble fine. Both retained the motors, so that would not explain it.