Covid Vaccines

[JLP1]

Got my first shot of Pfizer yesterday results: sore arm and a headache last night today feel fine.

On a side note the governor of Texas announced last night "poof normal is back" starting next Wednesday no more mask mandate and everything can be 100% open. Still some fed restrictions for mask and stuff but for the most part come on Wild Wild West spring break is just around the corner.

 

[boatgeek]

Also states are not notified on the quantity of doses they will receive for a week until the Thursday before. Makes it difficult for the PODs to plan ahead.

I saw a couple of weeks ago that the states were going to start getting 3-week notice of dose delivery plans, which would alleviate some of that problem. I don't know if that happened or not since the bad weather in TX/upper South messed up a lot of distribution. 1-week notice in normal times is pretty ridiculous.

 

[afadeev]

Good news for those of us with kids.

J&J plans to test its COVID-19 vaccine in ages 12-18 soon:

J&J plans to test its COVID-19 vaccine in ages 12-18 soon

Johnson & Johnson plans to start testing its experimental COVID-19 vaccine in youths aged 12 to 18 as soon as possible, and the company's previous experience with the same technology in a vaccine successfully used in children could give it a leg up with regulators.

www.reuters.com

Pfizer says its Covid vaccine trial for kids ages 12 to 15 is fully enrolled:

Pfizer says its Covid vaccine trial for kids ages 12 to 15 is fully enrolled

Pfizer's Covid-19 vaccine is authorized for people age 16 and older. The company's trial in kids 12-15 is now fully enrolled, a key step for use in kids.

www.cnbc.com

More here:

Fauci: Vaccines for Kids as Young as First Graders Could Be Authorized by September

For this to happen by the start of the next school year, trials need to prove the vaccine is safe and effective in children. Experts say manufacturers aren’t moving quickly enough, and that this is important for achieving herd immunity and stopping the spread of variants.

www.propublica.org

 

[NateB]

States decide who gets prioritized, not the Feds.

Yesterday, the President started to push governors to move teachers to the front of the line of vaccine eligibility.

Biden Says U.S. Will Have Vaccine Supply For All Adults By May, Prioritizes Teachers

President Biden moves his timeline up by two months while directing all 50 states and the District of Columbia to move school workers up in line for vaccinations, beginning next week.

www.npr.org

Cases are steadily declining in NE Indiana, but a big reason schools had so many closures were because teachers were ill and there was not enough substitutes. To me, prioritizing teachers as "essential" employees makes sense if the goal is to keep students in classrooms. The argument that kids don't get as sick with Covid does not make any sense when schools have to close because the teachers are too sick to teach.

 

[Nytrunner]

On a side note the governor of Texas announced last night "poof normal is back" starting next Wednesday

Wonder what the hospitalization rates will be in 3-4 weeks

 

[Jmhepworth]

I read that the reasons the Texas Governor gave for opening things up wide is that vaccines are now available to reduce infections, and new therapies are now available to treat the infected. The 275 people who died from the virus in Texas yesterday were not available for comment.

 

[Flyfalcons]

Wonder what the hospitalization rates will be in 3-4 weeks

No major change, as other states have proven. Or even less, as the state vaccinates more and more of the vulnerable population.

 

[tab28682]

Received my first dose of Moderna yesterday in Fort Worth via the Tarrant county health system. Appeared to be very well organized and was getting lots of people through the process fairly quickly and efficiently. Spent 45 min on site, including the 15 min post shot observation period. 24 hours later, no side effects except for a very slight injection site soreness.

 

[Marc_G]

Indiana just opened vaccines up to 50+, so that includes me. The scheduling system is bizarre in that here you have to pick a site then look for appointments, rather than being able to say "find me the soonest appointment within 10 miles" for example.

Anyway, I picked a hospital near me as the site, and have an appointment in two weeks. Not that bad really.

 

[Exactimator]

My in-laws got their second Moderna shots yesterday. They got delayed a week and a half when the supersite they went to ran out of vaccines twice. I believe it was the weather in the midwest that disrupted shipments.

The teachers and admins at my kid's school all got their first shots yesterday.

San Diego County has been pretty efficient at getting vaccines into arms once the shipments arrive. We have several supervax sites. Los Angeles County hasn't been as efficient and also had to deal with shortages. My parents live in LA county and still haven't been able to get appointments for their first shots yet. They're frustrated.

 

[OverTheTop]

3 or 4 but with a much longer loop time. All the motion is a distraction and won't result in more sales from me. Possibly less if it annoys too much.

Good luck with the opening.

 

[Dustin Lobner]

Got my second Pfizer shot yesterday. Sore arm and a general feeling of "bleh" all day, otherwise good. Took a vacation day expecting it to be worse but it wasn't, so I had a randomly productive day at home.

 

[Cl(VII)]

I got my first BioNtech/Pfizer shot today...I think I got a spot because they had a lot of shots at the relatively new-ish FEMA site in Dallas, and needed arms on short notice. I got a text and email at 7pm yesterday. That is the only thing I can figure because I was honest with my registry questionnaire, I.e. 42 with no underlying conditions. I did submit it first day I could, so maybe the “oh crap, we need x-more people tomorrow” fill ins are just by signup order. Maybe too they want folks they are confident haven’t gotten a vaccine elsewhere for those last moment calls.

The process was phenomenal. 18 lanes going into a long tent where 3 cars per lane were served simultaneously, each by a two person team from the 1st Infantry Division. Took about 3 minutes to cycle the three cars, then 15 min in a holding area with medics walking up and down between cars to make sure everyone was ok. Probably 300+ volunteers in addition to the soldiers making the whole thing run as smooth as can be, I.e. scanning appt QR codes, marking windshields, directing traffic, running supplies, releasing cars after their 15 minutes (the team giving vaccine wrote time on windshield before you left tent). There was even a tow truck there that looked like it was standing by in case a car broke down in the works. I was on site a total of 30 minutes, just amazing coordination. The tent was constantly full while I was there, but the lines never got more than about 10 cars deep.

Count me as impressed and encouraged. For all the criticism of the role out (some of it surely warranted) at least a formula for doing mega sites appears to be getting worked out very well.

As for side effects, 9 hours in my shoulder is more sore than with the flu or tetanus shots. I feel like someone punched me pretty good with some soreness down almost to the elbow...I’ll gladly take it.

 

[OverTheTop]

Our state is rolling out the vaccine at a rate that will see everyone done within the next five years. Yes, I am serious .

 

[cwbullet]

Yesterday, the President started to push governors to move teachers to the front of the line of vaccine eligibility.

Biden Says U.S. Will Have Vaccine Supply For All Adults By May, Prioritizes Teachers

President Biden moves his timeline up by two months while directing all 50 states and the District of Columbia to move school workers up in line for vaccinations, beginning next week.

www.npr.org

Cases are steadily declining in NE Indiana, but a big reason schools had so many closures were because teachers were ill and there was not enough substitutes. To me, prioritizing teachers as "essential" employees makes sense if the goal is to keep students in classrooms. The argument that kids don't get as sick with Covid does not make any sense when schools have to close because the teachers are too sick to teach.

Being a teacher is not a high risk position and vaccination should be based on risk. This priority is based on a perceived risk and not a real risk.

 

[Dustin Lobner]

Being a teacher is not a high risk position and vaccination should be based on risk. This priority is based on a perceived risk and not a real risk.

One of the things I read about back in December maybe was that there will be times that the rollout prioritization of people doesn't feel right. Not because it is right and just don't know it, but just they expected the rollout to not be perfect. This is a good example I think.

I'm personally OK with it, because my high risk teacher and pregnant wife (who hasn't been in a classroom since March 13th on doctor's orders) gets her first shot today. Purely selfishly, for her sake and my unborn son's sake...I'm good with that.

 

[kuririn]

One of the things I read about back in December maybe was that there will be times that the rollout prioritization of people doesn't feel right. Not because it is right and just don't know it, but just they expected the rollout to not be perfect. This is a good example I think.

I'm personally OK with it, because my high risk teacher and pregnant wife (who hasn't been in a classroom since March 13th on doctor's orders) gets her first shot today. Purely selfishly, for her sake and my unborn son's sake...I'm good with that.

We didn't do a good job of learning from the Italian experience a year ago.
Let's hope we do a better job the second time around:
Italian officials say COVID-19 variant is prevalent among schoolchildren and fueling ‘robust’ uptick | KTLA

 

[cwbullet]

One of the things I read about back in December maybe was that there will be times that the rollout prioritization of people doesn't feel right. Not because it is right and just don't know it, but just they expected the rollout to not be perfect. This is a good example I think.

I'm personally OK with it, because my high risk teacher and pregnant wife (who hasn't been in a classroom since March 13th on doctor's orders) gets her first shot today. Purely selfishly, for her sake and my unborn son's sake...I'm good with that.

I am ok with prioritizing teachers that are high risk. But a 20 year olf teacher should not be at a higher priority than a 65 yr old that of higher risk for being in an ICU. A 20 year old and the students they teach are at much lower risk.

I am also ok with prioritizing professions at a higher level than the general public based on risk to catch, but it need to based on risk and not just turning over to a supporter. Medical folks make sense, because you want to keep them at work to treat those that are ill. First responders fit. Over 75 fits because we can to keep them out of the ICUs. High risk medical make sense. We have to let science and true risk make the decision.

 

[cwbullet]

We didn't do a good job of learning from the Italian experience a year ago.
Let's hope we do a better job the second time around:
Italian officials say COVID-19 variant is prevalent among schoolchildren and fueling ‘robust’ uptick | KTLA

That is not exacly an accurate data point. Plenty of research sicne ahs shown that children are not a significant cause of infections and teachers are unlikely to catch this at work.

Our tracing in GA, SC, and AL, clearly shows that very few infections are caught in the workplace. Most come from other interactions. One large facility with 58,000 beneficiaries and 10,000 CIV employees found that over 70% of infection were caught in the home or community and not at work. Considering, many of us spend 1/3 of our time in the workplace, this is very significant. I would like to see more data from outside the military.

 

[OverTheTop]

Being a teacher is not a high risk position and vaccination should be based on risk. This priority is based on a perceived risk and not a real risk.

I guess it depends on the actual situation which can be quite individual. My wife's cousin in the UK has lost three work colleagues to covid. He works in education. I would not like to be in the position of having to prioritise other peoples lives.

 

[Buckeye]

Being a teacher is not a high risk position and vaccination should be based on risk. This priority is based on a perceived risk and not a real risk.

Not high risk, but teachers are essential for return to normalcy (this is one case of deeming somebody "essential" that I actually agree with). Nothing returns to normal unless kids are in school and middle class families get on with their lives. K-12 and college kids have been royally screwed and lost an entire year of meaningful education and socialization. This is a good step forward as long as the thug teachers unions don't get in the way...

 

[cwbullet]

Not high risk, but teachers are essential for return to normalcy (this is one case of deeming somebody "essential" that I actually agree with). Nothing returns to normal unless kids are in school and middle class families get on with their lives. K-12 and college kids have been royally screwed and lost an entire year of meaningful education and socialization. This is a good step forward as long as the thug teachers unions don't get in the way...

I understand, but essential personal are supposed to wait until the over 75 get it per most recommendations. I guess it depends on who you are trying to satisfy. I am trying to prevent deaths and keep our ICUs from being full.

 

[cwbullet]

I guess it depends on the actual situation which can be quite individual. My wife's cousin in the UK has lost three work colleagues to covid. He works in education. I would not like to be in the position of having to prioritise other peoples lives.

It does. Unfortunately, politicians, on both sides, have made this a political issue instead of trusting medical folks to do the right thing based on the risk levels. My medical staff are tired and we need a break. The only way to get that break is to immunize the right folks with risks.

 

[stealth6]

State of Utah (my home) just opened up eligibility to all persons aged 50 and over.
My local health department and retail providers are also beginning to give folks a choice of the two-dose or the one-dose versions.
At least in my area (I very much realize it's "different all over"), the options/availability are continuing to open up.
One more step (on a long road) to getting through this nightmare....which is a very good thing.

s6

 

[Marc_G]

Being a teacher is not a high risk position and vaccination should be based on risk. This priority is based on a perceived risk and not a real risk.

I understand, but essential personal are supposed to wait until the over 75 get it per most recommendations. I guess it depends on who you are trying to satisfy. I am trying to prevent deaths and keep our ICUs from being full.

I'll post a somewhat different perspective, with the caveat that I'm not being argumentative, just seeing things from a different viewpoint. The other caveat is that things are different in each state, and even within states. So the YMMV disclaimer applies.

OK, with my CYA thoroughly established, here's my point:

The vaccines have been available in some form to some people for well over two months now. Most states have been offering it to the elderly, high risk patients, and high risk medical professionals for much of that time. So, at least here in Indiana and in several states where I have a bunch of friends, those most at risk have had the ability to sign up for it for a while. Here in Indiana the supply seems to be steady enough compared to the demand that now anyone 50+ can sign up to get it (I'm 53- I signed up within minutes of the announcement that 50+ are now eligible--I get my first shot on 3/17, but could have signed up for a mass vaccination clinic this weekend if I had so chosen).

I have lots of teacher friends and several have gotten COVID-19, though mostly contact tracing has been inconclusive for them. Many of them-and their networks beyond my friends- believe they were infected at school, but with no way to prove it. Teachers, and school staff more broadly, represent a connection point between family bubbles. While I wouldn't prioritize them above patient-facing medical staff, it seems reasonable this far into the vaccination effort, that they should be added to the priority list.

I mean, are there still states where medical staff haven't had access to the vaccine? Just because Indiana is pretty far along doesn't mean it's the same everywhere, but from what I'm reading from across the country, one of the hold-ups in getting staff widely vaccinated is their willingness to get the shot.

For sure medical staff and the elderly should be first in line based on risk, but it seems like they have broadly had a chance to get it, or could sign up immediately if they just haven't personally prioritized it. So, my view is it's now reasonable to put others who have some level of enhanced risk into the queue.

In Indiana, teachers are I think now eligible, or will be starting soon. But I as a 53 year old work-at-home type would have gladly given my slot in line to a 30 year old teacher who sees students face to face. Just my two cents.

Edit: Teachers eligible now, here: https://www.indystar.com/story/news...-any-age-eligible-federal-program/6906839002/

 

[Flyfalcons]

There are lots of people who go to work and face the public. If you were truly selfless as a stay at home type, you wouldn't have signed up immediately upon eligibility.

 

[kuririn]

There are lots of people who go to work and face the public.

Yeah, like teachers who have to work in a room full of "petri dishes".
Chuck's term, not mine.

If you were truly selfless as a stay at home type, you wouldn't have signed up immediately upon eligibility.

If everyone were truly selfless, then we wouldn't have front line medical personnel declining to receive the shot. I applaud MarcG for doing his part to fight this pandemic. And thank you for your input, Dr. Winslow.

 

[Marc_G]

There are lots of people who go to work and face the public. If you were truly selfless as a stay at home type, you wouldn't have signed up immediately upon eligibility.

This is a good point. When word came out that 50+ would soon be able to sign up, I gave it a hard think for reasons aligned as you suggest.

In the end I chose to pick a spot two weeks out, where there is plenty of availability for anyone the state considers eligible, leaving the sooner slots --such as several mass vaccination clinics this weekend-- open for those feeling more urgency based on their estimation of risk.

My main risk factors include a son in hybrid school and quite a few doctor appointments (mine and my family's). Otherwise it's just the grocery store and pharmacy for me, mainly.

This seemed the ethical thing to do given the direction from authorities to get vaccinated versus my concern that others may be more in need when the state rather abruptly opened it up to 50+.

 

[kuririn]

One more point. The recommendation to vaccinate teachers and give them priority was not based on their risk as a group or on politics. It is because of the enormous psychological and social damage that is being incurred by young schoolchildren because they are no longer socially developing and learning in classrooms. Since they are least affected by the virus and are the last on the list to be vaccinated then the only way to reopen schools ASAP and safely is by vaccinating teachers and administrators. Teachers and their unions endorse this, don't know why anyone would be opposed to it.

 

[afadeev]

I understand, but essential personal are supposed to wait until the over 75 get it per most recommendations.

That's not what CDC is recommending.

Group 1a:

• health care personnel //somewhat loosely defined, but less than 100% of the healthcare sector employees
• residents of long-term care facilities //note that this group is defined by residential density, not age

Group 1b:

• Frontline essential workers (fire fighters, police officers, corrections officers, food and agricultural workers, USPS workers, manufacturing workers, grocery store workers, public transit workers, and those who work in the educational sector (teachers, support staff, and daycare workers.))
• 75+ year olds //at highest risk of hospitalization, illness, and death from COVID-19. 75+ year olds who are also residents of long-term care facilities should be offered vaccination in Phase 1a.

Group 1c:

• 65—74 years olds
• 16—64 years with underlying medical conditions
• Other essential workers (transportation and logistics, food service, housing construction and finance, information technology, communications, energy, law, media, public safety, and public health).

When Vaccine is Limited, Who Gets Vaccinated First?

Learn more about the CDC’s recommendations for who should be offered COVID-19 vaccine first.

www.cdc.gov

I guess it depends on who you are trying to satisfy. I am trying to prevent deaths and keep our ICUs from being full.

For the 2nd part, we've got that figured out, more or less. With the exception of TX and MO.
For the former, the idea is to un-freeze as many parts of the economy as possible. And that is hard to do without allowing parents to ditch their kids in schools and kindergartens (teachers), and help folks get to work (transportation) and eat (agriculture, grocery stores).

I don't have a strong preference either way (our school district has figured out ways to stay open for in-person instruction), just reconciling the reality with logical patterns.
That would have been a lot easier if we had a National vaccine distribution standard and policy, instead of each of the 50 states spit-balling, improvising, and politicizing things as they see fit. Alas, the emphasis in the US is on S, not the U.