Composite Motor Propellant Compositions?

[clarinet]

As a chemist, I am curious to know what the compositional difference is between Aerotech "blue thunder" and "white lightening" composite propellants or the CTI equivalents. My understanding of "white lightening" is that it's based on ammonium perchlorate (AP) oxidizer and aluminum powder fuel in a polybutadiene binder. What is different about "blue thunder" that makes it faster to ignite, faster to burn, produce higher thrust, and generate very little smoke? Does it use some other fuel besides aluminum?

 

[DavidMcCann]

In about four seconds someone will be along to tell you all discussions of this nature are restricted to the the EX forum.

 

[clarinet]

If that is so I apologize, but I am only asking about standard commercial propellants and not experimental or research motors. I am not interested in making propellants, only in understanding the chemistry of how they work. A lot of information is publicly available about the standard AP/aluminum propellants.

 

[cbrarick]

The problem with the question is that the question's application is research. THAT's why they will whine. PLUS there's ITAR, which no one wants to run a foul with. Believe it or not, some of our information is restricted. Seems rather odd, but it's the truth. We wouldn't want the North Korean's turning their scud's exhaust red, would we???

 

[Zeus-cat]

If that is so I apologize, but I am only asking about standard commercial propellants and not experimental or research motors. I am not interested in making propellants, only in understanding the chemistry of how they work. A lot of information is publicly available about the standard AP/aluminum propellants.

You have a legitimate question. I don't know the answer, but I am sure someone here will chime in and tell us. Personally. I think they grind up Smurfs for the blue lightning propellant.

 

[DavidMcCann]

there are other metals than Al used.... and catalysts like iron oxides,

 

[samb]

My guess is dust from the dwarf mines in the Blue Mountains of Middle Earth. I wonder if Aerotech would consider the ingredients proprietary info or maybe just the proportions.

 

[djs]

Remember too that it's not just the chems and ratios involved, but also the processing they do.

FYI to the original poster, you probably won't get any solid answers until you're on the research forum. That being said, there's commonalities for each type of propellant (white, green, red, etc)

 

[OverTheTop]

My guess is dust from the dwarf mines in the Blue Mountains of Middle Earth.

The Blue Mountains are in Australia :wink:

 

[mikec]

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showthread.php?105888-What-makes-motor-flames-colored is an old thread that discusses some of these questions.

 

[samb]

The Blue Mountains are in Australia :wink:

Middle Earth... Oz... I get 'em confused sometimes.

 

[prfesser]

If that is so I apologize, but I am only asking about standard commercial propellants and not experimental or research motors. I am not interested in making propellants, only in understanding the chemistry of how they work. A lot of information is publicly available about the standard AP/aluminum propellants.

All commercial composite propellants contain ammonium perchlorate as the oxidizer and a synthetic rubber (polybutadiene) as binder and fuel. Burn rate is controlled (mostly) by burn rate catalysts, which are transition metal compounds.

Some chemistry geek has written a book about all this stuff, but I wouldn't trust him. He's ugly and his mommy dresses him funny.

Best regards,
Terry

 

[dhbarr]

All commercial composite propellants contain ammonium perchlorate as the oxidizer and a synthetic rubber (polybutadiene) as binder and fuel. Burn rate is controlled (mostly) by burn rate catalysts, which are transition metal compounds.

Some chemistry geek has written a book about all this stuff, but I wouldn't trust him. He's ugly and his mommy dresses him funny.

Best regards,
Terry

^_^

 

[Zeus-cat]

The Blue Mountains are in Australia :wink:

I have been to the Blue Mountains; we saw a skink!

 

[mccordmw]

All commercial composite propellants contain ammonium perchlorate as the oxidizer and a synthetic rubber (polybutadiene) as binder and fuel. Burn rate is controlled (mostly) by burn rate catalysts, which are transition metal compounds.

Some chemistry geek has written a book about all this stuff, but I wouldn't trust him. He's ugly and his mommy dresses him funny.

Best regards,
Terry

You should put a link to your book site in your signature. Might help some people find it. Or are there rules against that unless you're a vendor...

 

[djs]

You should put a link to your book site in your signature. Might help some people find it. Or are there rules against that unless you're a vendor...

I'm not the good doctor, but here is the link for his book. I would consider this as mandatory reading for anyone who wants to make EX propellants:

https://aeroconsystems.com/cart/literature-software/experimental-composite-propellant/

 

[samb]

Is this still a good website to acquire Dr. McCreary's book ?

https://www.compositepropellantbook.com/

 

[OverTheTop]

I have been to the Blue Mountains; we saw a skink!

Lizards are cute. We get skinks in the backyard here. I enjoy catching big lizards by hand in the outback, just for fun. Still haven't managed to catch a goanna or perentie yet. Not sure what the outcome of that will be

 

[dhbarr]

Smee Goans? :-D

 

[Zeus-cat]

Lizards are cute. We get skinks in the backyard here. I enjoy catching big lizards by hand in the outback, just for fun. Still haven't managed to catch a goanna or perentie yet. Not sure what the outcome of that will be

I love the note someone added to the bottom of the sign.