CNC for rocket part cutting?

[GrouchoDuke]

Looking for some recommendations. I’m selling one of my 3D printers and considering picking up a CNC router/engraver/cutter/whatever to cut rocket & quadcopter parts. I plan to cut parts from flat plate (carbon fiber, fiberglass & maybe some wood). I think something in the 300x400mm range is plenty for what I want. Smaller might work too, but 200x250 is probably as small as I’d go. This will be for hobby cutting, not production. My budget is no more than $1k, but less would be great. Does anyone have a favorite CNC in this range?

I have one friend here with an OpenBuilds C-Beam. Any others?

Thanks!

 

[DinoAP]

I have a Bobs CNC E3. Not too shabby for what it is. Great for fins, CR’s, etc...

 

[jlabrasca]

I have a Bobs CNC E3. Not too shabby for what it is. Great for fins, CR’s, etc...

How long did it take you to put it together? Back when I was shopping, I looked at some un-boxing pictures in customer reviews and was scared off by that pile of laser-cut jigsaw puzzle pieces.

Looking for some recommendations... I plan to cut parts from flat plate (carbon fiber, fiberglass & maybe some wood)... 200x250 is probably as small as I’d go. .... My budget is no more than $1k, but less would be great. Does anyone have a favorite CNC in this range?

That's a tough one.

I did this calculation a couple of months ago, and I landed on a Shapeoko XL. Outside your price range -- and also well outside my original budget (like you, I was hoping to keep it under $1000). I rationalized a more expensive machine on the grounds that it is made of steel and extruded aluminum, it has a large and active community of users, and there there are even a few 3rd-party vendors making accessories (like a dust shoe, which you will have to get if you plan to cut CF and FG). You are probably operating under different constraints, but for me it finally -- really -- came down to deciding that my time and peace-of-mind were worth $500 additional.

 

[DinoAP]

As far as the Bob’s E3 I won’t sugar coat it. It was a metric crap ton of pieces and I put it off for a few weeks. Once I finally got the nerve to put it together it was about 8 hours in total. I would do it again for sure. One thing I learned the hard way is USE LOCTITE!

Figuring out what software to use was the hardest part.

Librecad for drawing the part.
ESTLcam for creting the gcode
UGS universal gcode sender for telling the CNC what.

 

[mkadams001]

Take a look at this one.. https://www.inventables.com/technologies/x-carve/customize#500mm ....It will go over your budget...$1000 will be a challenge. I built a CNC Router Parts Pro for work....but that was around $12,000 for a 4' x 4' and it is used for production...Love it...

If you have a Makers Fair in your area that is a good place to look at CNC routers for hobbyists.

 

[GrouchoDuke]

I didn't know about Bob's or the X-Carve. On first glance, I like the construction/design of the X-Carve better. The standard-sized Shapeoko might work too.

Keep 'em coming!

 

[PBic]

I just went through this myself, albeit at a budget of ~$1500, and I’m going with a Shapeoko. One of the biggest determining factors for me was the overall stiffness of the Carbide 3D extrusions vs the X-Carve. Take a look at a direct visual comparison at https://carbide3d.com/vs/shapeoko-vs-xcarve/ . Shapeoko also has a large user community. BobsCNC isn’t an option because I live in the moist Pacific Northwest. Now if Bob had water jet cut it from aluminum and steel, I probably would have paid twice the price for it.

Good luck and have fun!

Paul B.

 

[AllDigital]

I’ve had a shapeoko 3 with dewalt 611 for a few years. I use it for aluminum bulkheads, fiberglass, wood, plexiglass, and more. I really love it. It is bigger (16” x 33&#8221, but I find the extra room is helpful for larger material. Make sure you get limit switches, as being able to home the machine is critical for multi step workflows. I’ve done a lot of 3D printing and CNC is harder to learn, but the shapeoko software (create and make) is great for most things you will make and easy to use once you get the hang of it. Proper bits are critical for aluminum or harder. It might be slightly out of budget, but it is a workhorse and is forgiving if you jam up the Spindle.

 

[jlabrasca]

I’ve had a shapeoko 3 with dewalt 611 for a few years. I use it for aluminum bulkheads, fiberglass, wood, plexiglass, and more. I really love it. It is bigger (16” x 33&#8221, but I find the extra room is helpful for larger material. Make sure you get limit switches, as being able to home the machine is critical for multi step workflows.

Not to rat-hole this discussion, but I think that limit switches are standard equipment with the Shapeoko 3 now.

I do multi-step work flows all the time and I never use the limit switches to home the machine. In fact, I am not entirely sure that the limit switch on the Y-axis works. I just don't turn off the electronics between operations (I do unplug the spindle when changing out mills, because I read in another thread here about tendons being yanked out by spinning router bits... <g>)

I&#8217;ve done a lot of 3D printing and CNC is harder to learn, but the shapeoko software (create and make) is great for most things you will make and easy to use once you get the hang of it. Proper bits are critical for aluminum or harder. It might be slightly out of budget, but it is a workhorse and is forgiving if you jam up the Spindle.

Agreed on the endmills. I don't know if the $1K budget includes endmills, but they cost. Good quality coated endmills (for aluminum and brass) are particularly expensive. It will be heartbreaking the first time things suddenly get quiet and you realize you've left half the cutter in the stock and the machine is just cutting air

Don't let it discourage you, but CNC machining is a hobby all to itself. You can go broke and also make yourself crazy pretty quickly chasing after the precision you know the machine can give you. Eventually you will start to worry about tramming the carriage and the run-out on the spindle.

https://elairecorp.com/routercollets.html

https://www.precisebits.com/gateways/EndMillsHome.htm

https://www.endmillsandmore.com/col...ducts/cnc-router-end-mill-6-piece-starter-set

Here is the dust shoe I got when my mill ate my shop-built and jury-rigged shoe.

https://www.suckitdustboot.com/

 

[rhildinger]

This is way outside the OP's original budget, but I was curious if anyone has ever used a Glowforge for this purpose?

 

[dhbarr]

This is way outside the OP's original budget, but I was curious if anyone has ever used a Glowforge for this purpose?

I wouldn't recommend it. Just sent some polycarb through, 10 passes lots of smoke & char.

I'd stick with a router, bad idea to touch carbon fiber or epoxy w/ a Laser and glass strands just slag.

 

[mkadams001]

I wouldn't recommend it. Just sent some polycarb through, 10 passes lots of smoke & char.

I'd stick with a router, bad idea to touch carbon fiber or epoxy w/ a Laser and glass strands just slag.

Don't cut polycarbonate with a laser...acrylic is fine.

 

[GrouchoDuke]

Thanks for all the great thoughts, everyone. This all really helps.

I just went through this myself, albeit at a budget of ~$1500, and I’m going with a Shapeoko. One of the biggest determining factors for me was the overall stiffness of the Carbide 3D extrusions vs the X-Carve. Take a look at a direct visual comparison at https://carbide3d.com/vs/shapeoko-vs-xcarve/ .

That comparison is awesome. Looks like a comparison between an F350 and a Yugo. I'm really curious if that much is really needed for carbon plate though. I guess growth capability to cutting big blocks of metal would be cool though. I haven't personally used one a "hobby CNC" to cut carbon plate, so that'd be good to see.

I’ve had a shapeoko 3 with dewalt 611 for a few years. I use it for aluminum bulkheads, fiberglass, wood, plexiglass, and more. I really love it. It is bigger (16” x 33”), but I find the extra room is helpful for larger material. Make sure you get limit switches, as being able to home the machine is critical for multi step workflows. I’ve done a lot of 3D printing and CNC is harder to learn, but the shapeoko software (create and make) is great for most things you will make and easy to use once you get the hang of it. Proper bits are critical for aluminum or harder. It might be slightly out of budget, but it is a workhorse and is forgiving if you jam up the Spindle.

Thanks. Yeah, maybe $1000 was the wrong number. You can have it cheap, fast and good...but you can't have all three. After a little more research, I'm curious about the belts though. Any issues with them?

Agreed on the endmills. I don't know if the $1K budget includes endmills, but they cost. Good quality coated endmills (for aluminum and brass) are particularly expensive. It will be heartbreaking the first time things suddenly get quiet and you realize you've left half the cutter in the stock and the machine is just cutting air

Don't let it discourage you, but CNC machining is a hobby all to itself. You can go broke and also make yourself crazy pretty quickly chasing after the precision you know the machine can give you. Eventually you will start to worry about tramming the carriage and the run-out on the spindle.

Good point about the endmills. Yeah, much like 3d printing I figured this would be a hobby of its own. Before long, I'll have all the tools to start a rocket kit business...and then I can really spend all my time & money on rocketry.

 

[patelldp]

Shapeoko 3 XXL and eBay user drillman1 for end mills here. It's about as good as you can buy for a belt driven unit.

 

[jlabrasca]

... Before long, I'll have all the tools to start a rocket kit business...and then I can really spend all my time & money on rocketry.

"Before long...." this kind of nonsense will start to seem like a good idea

 

[Jdog13]

I have a Bobs CNC E3. Not too shabby for what it is. Great for fins, CR’s, etc...

I have one and it is great for plywood and plastic, but I'm not sure you would be getting good results with cf or fg. You also have to remember how dangerous those are to cut.

 

[DinoAP]

I have one and it is great for plywood and plastic, but I'm not sure you would be getting good results with cf or fg. You also have to remember how dangerous those are to cut.

Definitely would want a very slow feed and speed and good dust collection.

 

[GrouchoDuke]

"Before long...." this kind of nonsense will start to seem like a good idea

View attachment 341834

Oh boy. With how much time I already spend designing parts to 3D print for rockets, I can only imagine how much in never-ending machining hell I'll be.

Definitely would want a very slow feed and speed and good dust collection.

Yeah, good point. It's a good excuse to buy a new respirator too.

 

[JohnCoker]

It is indeed awesome to be able to make perfectly interlocking parts. I love my CNC machine, a ShopBot desktop. I highly recommend it, but it's way outside that price range.

 

[ericm541]

If your not afraid of Chinese products check this place out https://www.omiocnc.com/ at work we purchased the largest one the smallest is just under $1,000 290mmX390MM cutting area. I like the machine we've cut balsa to aluminum they come with decent spindles. I already had 15 years of CNC experience prior, not that it's needed though, we were cutting parts out the day we got it. There's pros and cons with the china products, i suggest read though everything and even ask questions.

 

[SCP]

I never make recommendations in these types of posts, but was surprised not to hear any other ideas on a used full size old knee mill, like the original Bridgeport Boss Machines....? I am only trying to spur the thought, and every situation is different, like portability, weight, shop space, volts/amps available, the list is endless......but I got my first CNC by buying two old Bridgeport Boss 5 machines (fully functional) for 1500 I think it was. I didn't even power them up, I completely gutted out the controls and put in a modern PC based control, and sold one of the machines to pay for the entire project. So you could say that was a hobby machine as it became a hobby type project just gutting them and getting them working with my own DIY controls.

That machine still does some work to this day, reliable old workhorse and rigid enough to make real life effective cuts in aluminum or anything. Since then, of course the FADAL is the flagship of the shop, but I love the old "real" iron, and adding the newer control was quite a fun project. I would never have time for a project like that again.

I have no experience with the smaller hobby machines.......and if its really just cutting balsa....then what the heck just do it. Have fun with the decision! You will have a lot of fun no matter what machine you get. Just hope if its a hobby level machine, you get some real productive time out of it. Hobby to me and the associated prices (I can't believe the low cost, that blows me away) means the machine itself will take a lot of babysitting as it is a hobby in and of itself.

 

[AllDigital]

Here&#8217;s an old thread of mine showing the Shapeoko aluminum and fiberglass cuts. It does a great job at making insets, perfect mm rings, fins, and more. I don&#8217;t know how I made rockets before having a CNC.

https://www.rocketryforum.com/showt...ke-8%94-L3-Cert-Build-quot-Maximum-Plaid-quot

 

[jlabrasca]

I got my first CNC by buying two old Bridgeport Boss 5 machines (fully functional) for 1500 I think it was...

You got two Bridgeport mills with stepper motor controls, $1500? Was that apiece? And where do you shop?!

I have no experience with the smaller hobby machines.......and if its really just cutting balsa....then what the heck just do it. Have fun with the decision! You will have a lot of fun no matter what machine you get. Just hope if its a hobby level machine, you get some real productive time out of it. Hobby to me and the associated prices (I can't believe the low cost, that blows me away) means the machine itself will take a lot of babysitting as it is a hobby in and of itself.

Its kind of apples and oranges. The use cases for a Bridgeport (or a Tormach) don't much overlap with those for a bench-top CNC, but you might be surprised by how capable the bench-top machines are getting to be.

https://community.carbide3d.com/t/m...ack-on-the-shapeoko-3-start-to-finish/5468/44

Certainly not production-worthy for even moderate volumes, but precise and powerful enough for for one-off parts fabrication.

If I was shopping now, knowing how much use I get from the tool, I'd be looking at this

https://www.cncrouterparts.com/benchtop-standard-2424-2-x-2-cnc-machine-kit-p-369.html

Easily $3K by the time it is dressed and ready to work, but a more robust machine than the Shapeoko.

 

[JohnCoker]

Another option is a local maker space. (I got my first experience with a ShopBot at a TechShop.)

 

[Random Flying Object]

Another option is a local maker space. (I got my first experience with a ShopBot at a TechShop.)

+1, Absolutely!

www.davincimakerlabs.com

 

[GrouchoDuke]

Yeah, I&#8217;d love to use a makerspace here. Sadly, they don&#8217;t have any sort of CNC machine there.

 

[mkadams001]

If I was shopping now, knowing how much use I get from the tool, I'd be looking at this

https://www.cncrouterparts.com/benchtop-standard-2424-2-x-2-cnc-machine-kit-p-369.html

Easily $3K by the time it is dressed and ready to work, but a more robust machine than the Shapeoko.

We bought the 4' x 4' Pro model with plug and play with spindle, base, and software (Vcarve pro and Mach 3) That will set you back about $12K. This works everyday for hours. If there is a problem (which is rare) or need help, CNC Router Parts will answer within a few minutes. Fairly easy to build. Follow the instructions on installing Mach 3.

What I am saying is that this is good company and good machine. Plus, I can add on to increase the size of the table without a lot of effort.

Just for fun if you want to check this out take a look at this video of frank howarth building one....https://youtu.be/dY8v0j6uEJc



Sorry, this is far away from the $1000 budget and nowhere near a bench top machine. However, I think any machine mentioned that is close to the $1000 budget will get the job done for cutting balsa, light ply and such.

 

[jlabrasca]

Yeah, I&#8217;d love to use a makerspace here. Sadly, they don&#8217;t have any sort of CNC machine there.

Yeah, even if they had one available I wonder what the folks in charge would say about cutting CF or FG plate? The not inconsiderable health risks notwithstanding, FG is murder on the tool. It wears out the endmills really fast, and the dust is abrasive to all of the parts that slide, spin, or roll.

The makerspace nearest my house (a 10 minute walk, if I dawdle) does commercial fabrication as well as providing tools and instruction to the membership. About the time I was starting to get interested in digital fabrication, they decided that the laser cutter and full-sheet Shopbot were too important to the non-makerspace part of the business, and took them away from the members. That was actually a big part of my decision to get my own CNC.

 

[dlb]

Love my Shark CNC, easy the setup and use.

https://www.rockler.com/cnc-shark-ii

 

[JohnCoker]

Yeah, even if they had one available I wonder what the folks in charge would say about cutting CF or FG plate? The not inconsiderable health risks notwithstanding, FG is murder on the tool. It wears out the endmills really fast, and the dust is abrasive to all of the parts that slide, spin, or roll.

Well, if you bring your own cutters, the wear shouldn't be an issue. Yeah, the dust is nasty to breathe and CF dust can ruin electric motors.

The makerspace nearest my house (a 10 minute walk, if I dawdle) does commercial fabrication as well as providing tools and instruction to the membership. About the time I was starting to get interested in digital fabrication, they decided that the laser cutter and full-sheet Shopbot were too important to the non-makerspace part of the business, and took them away from the members. That was actually a big part of my decision to get my own CNC.

That's too bad! I was able to use the Shopbot for years at the TechShop. Good luck with whatever you choose.