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clearcoat over decals?

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Johnny1Eye

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I have always been told that spraying clearcoat over the decals is the thing to do. Every time I have tried it in the past, I get a runny mess.

Is there something I'm missing? Getting back into rocketry, after 10+ years off (BAR +2). I would like to put matte clearcoat on a rocket I am building, after I put the decals on... don't want a mess. Allready had to re-learn the "multiple thin coats" thing with spray paint....

-Jon
 

troj

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I have always been told that spraying clearcoat over the decals is the thing to do. Every time I have tried it in the past, I get a runny mess.
Clear, especially, has to go on light or it runs.

-Kevin
 

stickershock23

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Another tip. always wipe your rocket down with some rubbing alcohol before you apply it. clear really does not like to stick to anything greasy.. even fingerprints.
 

WDG

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Another tip. always wipe your rocket down with some rubbing alcohol before you apply it. clear really does not like to stick to anything greasy.. even fingerprints.
So I know you have seen the way various producers of bottled consumer products avoided having to surface treat plastic to ensure adhesion for labels. Some use very thin plastic rather than paper on which to print labels. The labels are then roboticly loaded into the blow molder and the bottle is blown into the label - the label will not come off and need not be separated from the rest of the bottle when reground (either in plant or post consumer). That is for detergent bottles, anti-freeze, etc. But beverage bottles often have a heat shrink sort of label. Do you, or do you know of anyone who does so, make custom printed shrinkable labels that may work on rockets?
 

stickershock23

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So I know you have seen the way various producers of bottled consumer products avoided having to surface treat plastic to ensure adhesion for labels. Some use very thin plastic rather than paper on which to print labels. The labels are then roboticly loaded into the blow molder and the bottle is blown into the label - the label will not come off and need not be separated from the rest of the bottle when reground (either in plant or post consumer). That is for detergent bottles, anti-freeze, etc. But beverage bottles often have a heat shrink sort of label. Do you, or do you know of anyone who does so, make custom printed shrinkable labels that may work on rockets?

Shrinkable? I don't know of anyone off hand.

Is there a reason vinyl will not work for you? my vinyl decals are the same vinyl used for professional signs and for automotive and RV use. I can also do printed on WRAP vinyl. that means they go on the same martial used to wrap cars. you know the ones you see where the whole car is covered in some sort of art. they are rated to last 5 years on a vehicle in direct weather for 5 years. that means they are going to last a lifetime on your rocket.

YOu can also clearcoat over my decals if you like this will make them look a shiny and last even longer.

I have done regular vinyl decals for a carbon fiber rocket that did almost Mach 2. the decals did NOT peel off, they actually melted from the heat.

I hope that helps you out!
 

Micromeister

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I have always been told that spraying clearcoat over the decals is the thing to do. Every time I have tried it in the past, I get a runny mess.

Is there something I'm missing? Getting back into rocketry, after 10+ years off (BAR +2). I would like to put matte clearcoat on a rocket I am building, after I put the decals on... don't want a mess. Allready had to re-learn the "multiple thin coats" thing with spray paint....

-Jon
Jon:
A couple comments:
a: NO sparying "clearcoat" over your completed model and decals is NOT the best thing to do. Clear coats become brittle and fine off with a little time and when bumped and banged around in the car and on landings.. when they do they take some of the decal with it.
Better to give a finished model a couple coats of Furture floor finish or Nu-finish polymer instead. this "protects" your decals more then any clear coats.

B: That said however; There is a reason to clear coat most decals produced these days and all of the after market decals being printed on Alps and other dry transfer ink decals. Because these printers lay down rows of ribbon ink if they are not clear coated after printing they tend to come apart along the 1/2" division lines during application. Some of the newer Silkscreened mass production kit decals recently have been printed so thinly they also seem to fall apart badly during application.
To prevent this there are several methods. Best is to coat them with "microscale" decal clear. This is a brush-on liquid that drys very clear and Super fast.
Next best is to apply very light coats of Krylon UV resistant Gloss Clear #1305 allowing them to dry between coats and keeping the overall coating light as spraying to heavy a coat will crinkle the decals on the sheet. It is best to do either of these processes with the complete decal sheet taped to a table top or board laying flat as I've done with the very thinly printed decals from an Interceptor-E kit in the photos.
It's also possible to use very old (30yr+) decals by applying a fresh coat of Clear before cutting them apart for application.
Hope this helps some

474p03a-sm_Stock Decals out of the bag_02-07-08.jpg


474p03b-sm_Stock Decals after 1st mist UVclearcoat_02-07-08.jpg


474p03c-sm_Stock Decals after 2nd UVclearcoat_02-07-08.jpg
 

Johnny1Eye

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Future floor finish? really? Is there something special about that brand, or can I use the stuff I use at work almost every day (read free).

Nice tip about spraying decal sheets. I have a few OLD rockets in the closet, last time I built one, the decals were junk.

-Jon
 

Micromeister

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No ya really need to use "Future" or "Pledge with Future" as Future is an acrylic polymer rather then just a wax.

Same with Nu-Finish; some call it a wax but it isn't, it's really a polymer that bonds with the dried paint film instead of simply sitting on top.

Hope this helps.
 

Johnny1Eye

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Most, if not all comercial floor finish is "acrylic polymer". Anyways, what about weight? Would this be an OK technique for smaller rockets? I would have to brush it on... I'm guessing that makes for a pretty thick coat.

-Jon
 

troj

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Most, if not all comercial floor finish is "acrylic polymer". Anyways, what about weight? Would this be an OK technique for smaller rockets? I would have to brush it on... I'm guessing that makes for a pretty thick coat.
The thing to do would be to try it on a set of decals you don't care if you ruin. That way, if it reacts with the decals, it's not an issue.

I'd apply it with an airbrush, if you have one. Otherwise, try the brush method and see how well it works.

-Kevin
 

Micromeister

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Most, if not all comercial floor finish is "acrylic polymer". Anyways, what about weight? Would this be an OK technique for smaller rockets? I would have to brush it on... I'm guessing that makes for a pretty thick coat.

-Jon
What Troj said! Not all things work that same. The only floor finish that i've had any luck with at all is Future. Personally I have not tired the Pledge with Future, but some have reported is works.
My personal preferrence is Nu-Finish polymer.

Most people brush Future on with a polybrush without adding much in mass, but as troj mentioned an airbrush is a better way to go.
 

troj

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I suspect (but could well be wrong on this) that Future is nothing but a household strength commercial floor wax -- diluted to make it easier and less expensive to apply.

-Kevin
 

Micromeister

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I suspect (but could well be wrong on this) that Future is nothing but a household strength commercial floor wax -- diluted to make it easier and less expensive to apply.

-Kevin
Kevin:
Future is NOT a wax at all.
 

cjp

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Does Future shine affect vinyl decals in anyway?How about slide on decals?
 

stickershock23

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Does Future shine affect vinyl decals in anyway?How about slide on decals?
I have never tried future on vinyl decals, I would be willing to send out a sample for someone to try and report back their results.

:confused2:
 

cjp

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I have never tried future on vinyl decals, I would be willing to send out a sample for someone to try and report back their results.

:confused2:
I just bought a red max decal from you,but would willing to report back on with a sample.
 

Micromeister

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haven't used Future on printed vinyl decals but have used it on applied 3M and Avery adhesive backed vinyl home made graphics and lettering. Works just fine as long as all the wetting agent used in the application has had a few days to evaporate and the vinyl has been re-squeeged down before the Future is applied.

Have used Nu-Finish on Estes type stickers.. which seems to lift the edges if that helps any?
 

stickershock23

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I just bought a red max decal from you,but would willing to report back on with a sample.
Cool tell us how they work! if by chance it does cause a problem with the decal I will be willing to fix it too.
 

cjp

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I bought some Future and applied it to my wetslide decals,it really worked out great.I'm waiting to get my vinyl decals in the mail.They should be here in a day or two.Will keep you posted.
 

Marlin523

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I would love to have a sample. I've never ordered from you and would really like to try them. I promise to "Future" them and report back.
 

roadkill

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I applied Future over Mark's (Stickershock)
marvelous 4inch Red Max decals and the results
were fantastic.

It made the colors and contrast much brighter,
the whole rocket looks much more vivid without
any side effects at all.
Guys at the latest launch used big words like
'superb' and 'exquisite' ...

Pix to follow one of these days...
:)
 

jim fustini

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The key here is "Acrylic" whether it be Future or spray can clear coats. It is a polymer. A plastic. I have used Rust-oleum "Painters Touch" and Faskolor air brush paints on all my model and high power builds BOTH are Acrylic based pigments. With great results. I have spayed the Painters touch over waterslide and vinyl decals with no problems on over sixty rockets and RC cars. Always spray a light "tack coat" first let it dry a little while, and then spray your cover coats. (this will prevent runs) The Faskolor is a water based paint. but does not give you a real glossy finish like Future of painters choice. But it will absolutely not harm or react with any paint I have used on any of my rockets and it is a little pricey. I sprayed it over a 30 year old sheet of water slide decals with no problems. The clear coat paint most likely to ruin decals are enamels and lacquers.

116.jpg
 

cjp

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Nice paint jobs on all your rockets,they really stand out with the gloss finish.
 

roadkill

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Looks pretty good to me...



Kinda cloudy day, mr. Max is a lot
more shiny than shows up in the pic...
 

stickershock23

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so I have to ask, I have never used "future" I pictured it as a spray can of a wax like substance

I must be mistaken, can some one clue me in to how it works?

Sue the Red max looks SWEET!
 

roadkill

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'Future' is actually clear liquid
that comes in a plastic bottle,
barely thicker than water.

Some prefer airbrushing it on but
I used two coats applied with a foambrush.
Just go easy on it...
 

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