Quantcast

Build thread: Blackfish

The Rocketry Forum

Help Support The Rocketry Forum:

neil_w

Chuffed as ninepence
TRF Supporter
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
9,492
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Northern NJ
What does anyone think of the white diamonds on the tail cone?
1593632998593.png

Too much?

Printed the decals at work today, did not get very deep blacks, which makes me nervous. My alternative would be to print at home and deal with the clear-coating, but I've not had consistent results with that, particularly with decals that need to be black all the way to the edge. I've ended up with little white specks everywhere that I needed to touch up with sharpie or paint or whatever afterwards. Haven't solved that problem yet.
 

neil_w

Chuffed as ninepence
TRF Supporter
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
9,492
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Northern NJ
Well I just had an absolute disaster trying to print my decal sheet on inkjet paper. Never had the problem before, but it came out all... well all kinds of bad. Totally unusable. After the first sheet, I ran the printer through the complete suite of self-cleaning utilities, tried again, and got the same results. No clue what is going on, but that was my last sheet of white inkjet paper, so that's that.

So I guess I'll be going with my not-dark-enough laser print. That is a bit of a bummer to be honest, but don't seem to have any recourse at the moment.

If one day in the future I'm somehow able to print a better set, I can apply them on top of the ones that are there now.
 

Ted Cochran

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 22, 2009
Messages
513
Reaction score
173
Is cutting out the chevrons and applying them piece by piece out of the question?
 

neil_w

Chuffed as ninepence
TRF Supporter
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
9,492
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Northern NJ
Is cutting out the chevrons and applying them piece by piece out of the question?
At this point I have to consider it, but it’ll be a miserable job. Still won’t look quite right, but should be better. Maybe I’ll try it on one side; I printed extras so I one screwup won’t kill me.

I still have one other thing to try. Will update tomorrow.
 

neil_w

Chuffed as ninepence
TRF Supporter
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
9,492
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Northern NJ
OK, so my idea was to print the decals on clear inkjet paper, and put them on top of the laser decals. The laser decals would provide the opacity needed, and the inkjet decals would add the additional depth of black where needed. This strategy had the extra benefit that if a bit of the ink washed away on the top decal layer, it wouldn't be noticeable (as compared with white-backed paper, where it shows white underneath.

I figured that my printing problems yesterday were due to using the manufacturer-recommended "plain paper" print setting. I think, among other things, that signaled to my printer to use the pigment black cartridge for the black.

So this time I did what I thought was needed in the first place, which was to use a glossy paper setting. Indeed, the print came out beautiful. I wish I had tried that yesterday before I ruined my last sheet of white.

Unfortunately, due to my clownish incompetence, I seem to have made the print a bit too small. I could swear that I had scale set to 100%, but facts are facts: this printout is less than 100%. Therefore it will *not* do as an overlay for the other decals. And hey, guess what? That was my last sheet of clear inkjet decal paper. I suck.

So the plan now is to use the laser sheet and apply each chevron independently. If I hate the way it looks, then in the future I will add a layer of clear inkjet on top of it, as proposed above. I still think that'll work well, although it'll be a tedious job lining each one up perfectly.
 

mbeels

Yes balsa
TRF Supporter
Joined
Feb 9, 2019
Messages
2,204
Reaction score
1,037
So the plan now is to use the laser sheet and apply each chevron independently. If I hate the way it looks, then in the future I will add a layer of clear inkjet on top of it, as proposed above. I still think that'll work well, although it'll be a tedious job lining each one up perfectly.
Ah nuts. Applying each Chevron sounds really tricky!
 

neil_w

Chuffed as ninepence
TRF Supporter
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
9,492
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Northern NJ
Ah nuts. Applying each Chevron sounds really tricky!
It will be a slow and careful process, that's for sure. I'll use masking tape to guide me, and can only hope it works out OK.
 

boatgeek

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2014
Messages
2,730
Reaction score
1,152
OK, so my idea was to print the decals on clear inkjet paper, and put them on top of the laser decals. The laser decals would provide the opacity needed, and the inkjet decals would add the additional depth of black where needed. This strategy had the extra benefit that if a bit of the ink washed away on the top decal layer, it wouldn't be noticeable (as compared with white-backed paper, where it shows white underneath.

I figured that my printing problems yesterday were due to using the manufacturer-recommended "plain paper" print setting. I think, among other things, that signaled to my printer to use the pigment black cartridge for the black.

So this time I did what I thought was needed in the first place, which was to use a glossy paper setting. Indeed, the print came out beautiful. I wish I had tried that yesterday before I ruined my last sheet of white.

Unfortunately, due to my clownish incompetence, I seem to have made the print a bit too small. I could swear that I had scale set to 100%, but facts are facts: this printout is less than 100%. Therefore it will *not* do as an overlay for the other decals. And hey, guess what? That was my last sheet of clear inkjet decal paper. I suck.

So the plan now is to use the laser sheet and apply each chevron independently. If I hate the way it looks, then in the future I will add a layer of clear inkjet on top of it, as proposed above. I still think that'll work well, although it'll be a tedious job lining each one up perfectly.
This is your daily affirmation. You're good enough, you're smart enough, and doggone it, people like you! 😀
 

jqavins

Joseph Avins
TRF Supporter
Joined
Sep 29, 2011
Messages
3,777
Reaction score
1,338
Location
Howard, NY
Unfortunately, due to my clownish incompetence, I seem to have made the print a bit too small. I could swear that I had scale set to 100%, but facts are facts: this printout is less than 100%. Therefore it will *not* do as an overlay for the other decals. And hey, guess what? That was my last sheet of clear inkjet decal paper. I suck.
Well, you know my motto: measure twice, cut once, try to fix it. (Or various variations on that.)
 

neil_w

Chuffed as ninepence
TRF Supporter
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
9,492
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Northern NJ
I just took a closer look at the laser decal sheet and it's not as bad as I thought. In fact, the problem isn't the blackness of the print, it's the very uneven finish that I noticed when doing PDII. The finish of the laser print is mottled between "flat" and "flattest". That diffuses light reflection and causes it to look lighter.

I tried applying Future, and after three thin coats it's somewhat blacker. Still not uniformly glossy, but noticeably darker. So I think I'm gonna cross my fingers and do the chevrons in one big piece per side. Actually I might split each one into two pieces to make them easier to handle, we'll see.
 

neil_w

Chuffed as ninepence
TRF Supporter
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
9,492
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Northern NJ
These will do fine. Sorry for the false alarm.
Chevrons-1.jpg

Here's a super-close-up of a black area, that shows (sort of) what I meant by the mottled flat finish:
Chevrons-2.jpg

It gives a distinctly gray-ish appearance when the light it as the wrong angle. We'll see how it looks after the Future.
 

mbeels

Yes balsa
TRF Supporter
Joined
Feb 9, 2019
Messages
2,204
Reaction score
1,037
Yeah, at least from way over here, it looks pretty darn ok.
 

Greg Furtman

Well-Known Member
TRF Supporter
Joined
Nov 10, 2018
Messages
1,268
Reaction score
619
Location
Webster, Wisconsin
I just took a closer look at the laser decal sheet and it's not as bad as I thought. In fact, the problem isn't the blackness of the print, it's the very uneven finish that I noticed when doing PDII. The finish of the laser print is mottled between "flat" and "flattest". That diffuses light reflection and causes it to look lighter.

I tried applying Future, and after three thin coats it's somewhat blacker. Still not uniformly glossy, but noticeably darker. So I think I'm gonna cross my fingers and do the chevrons in one big piece per side. Actually I might split each one into two pieces to make them easier to handle, we'll see.
PDII? I can't find the acronym for this one.
Primary Dermal Irritation Index (toxicology) h

Pusat Dokumentasi dan Informasi Ilmiah

Product Development and Innovation Institute
 

boatgeek

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 27, 2014
Messages
2,730
Reaction score
1,152
PDII? I can't find the acronym for this one.
Primary Dermal Irritation Index (toxicology) h

Pusat Dokumentasi dan Informasi Ilmiah

Product Development and Innovation Institute
Plasma Dart II? But only Neil knows for sure.
 

neil_w

Chuffed as ninepence
TRF Supporter
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
9,492
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Northern NJ
PDII? I can't find the acronym for this one.
Did you not review the syllabus before enrolling in this thread? It is quite clearly stated that intimate familiarity with all my previous build threads is prerequisite.

I will let you off with just a warning this time.

PS Boatgeek is correct
 

BABAR

Builds Rockets for NASA
TRF Lifetime Supporter
TRF Supporter
Joined
Aug 27, 2011
Messages
6,263
Reaction score
1,542
PDII? I can't find the acronym for this one.
Primary Dermal Irritation Index (toxicology) h

Pusat Dokumentasi dan Informasi Ilmiah

Product Development and Innovation Institute
Still reminds me of the RSO quote on the microphone at NSL last year

“Hey, I can’t get anything on the P pad!
 

neil_w

Chuffed as ninepence
TRF Supporter
Joined
Jul 14, 2015
Messages
9,492
Reaction score
2,684
Location
Northern NJ
DECALS, PART 1

First decals went on today. Only one side at a time, because it'll be hard to do the other sides without significantly handling the first.

I did the big chevron pieces in two pieces so I won't need an excessively large tub of water for soaking. The cut is right behind the 6th chevron, counting from the front. It's pretty much invisible. Aligning the two separate pieces proved to be very easy. I eyeballed the whole thing, including the white diamond in the back.
First decals-1.jpg

This picture once again fails to capture the grayness of the decal black areas; in person it's quite apparent. I will continue to hope that the Future improves it somewhat, but however it ends up it will have to suffice.

I wish the orange came out brighter, but that's the limitations of the laser printer I guess, plus the effect (maybe) of applying the decals on top of black paint.

One nice thing about working with such large decals: they don't slip out of position accidentally. I wet the tube underneath with Micro-set so I'd be able to adjust them if I need to, but it's not like tiny decals that move if you so much as look at them funny.

The single chevrons on the pods went pretty easily as well, once again eyeball-aligned. I did all of them at once.
First decals-2.jpg

I'm happy with the choice of design there. The orange tips on the nose would have been nice, but the paint matching process would not have been worth the grief. I wasn't really sure where to position them; I ended up putting them fairly far back , pretty close to the ring. I'm not sure if that was the best choice but it's also not very important so I won't worry about it.

Oh, I tried a slightly different waterslide technique this time. Worked well. Will detail it in the next post.
 

mbeels

Yes balsa
TRF Supporter
Joined
Feb 9, 2019
Messages
2,204
Reaction score
1,037
That does look good, I can't see the seam at all. I imagined I could see it after the 5th chevron, but it's not there. I'll be curious to see how the side with the lettering looks, so far so good!
 

Latest posts

Top