Boyce Saturn 1B

Discussion in 'Low Power Rocketry (LPR)' started by aerostadt, Oct 25, 2017.

Help Support The Rocketry Forum by donating:

  1. Oct 25, 2017 #1

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    I got the Boyce Aerospace 3D-printed 1/125th scale Saturn 1B today. This is reminiscent of the Cox sport scale flying model from about 45 years ago. There are very few parts to put together with CA and the modeler needs to provide the kevlar line and chutes. The hard part is sanding and painting to remove the 3D-printing surface. The model uses D12-5 motors.

    IMG_4519.jpg
     
  2. Oct 25, 2017 #2

    fyrwrxz

    fyrwrxz

    fyrwrxz

    latest photo

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Messages:
    6,461
    Likes Received:
    11
    If you ever got to hang with Alex, you 'd know he puts his heart and soul into what he does. Enjoy your rocket! Straight smoke and good chutes!
     
  3. Oct 27, 2017 #3

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    From my previous experience with the Boyce Nike Zeus I'm starting sanding with 220 grit sand paper. There are a lot of nooks and crannies with the Saturn 1B, so I don't think that I am going to do as much sanding as last time. I was sanding the top of the escape tower when it broke off. (I can see now why Boyce is specifying a trapeze parachute harness for the upper part.) It went back on easily enough with Super glue gel, but I won't be sanding that part again. At first I was using a heavy pair of scissors and an Xacto knife to cut out the escape tower struts and rocket nozzles, but then I realized that the the struts and nozzles could easily be pried away from the board with the Xacto knife. The parts are then glued on to the escape tower with super glue gel.

    IMG_4524.jpg IMG_4527.jpg
     
  4. Nov 2, 2017 #4

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    The directions say to sand the mating surfaces so the parts fit together easily, but I have found that this is not necessary. The parts go together very well. I think the details of this model look, especially if you consider the model to be sports scale. I do not intend to make this model a master piece like TRFer's do for the Dr. Zooch kits.

    These kits do need some finishing to handle the 3D printing grain. I first sanded with 220 grit (dry sandpaper), which is coarser than what the directions call for. Rather than use gray automotive primer for the first coat, I used Rustoleum 2x Flat White Primer followed by sanding with 320 grit dry sandpaper.
     
  5. Nov 3, 2017 #5

    GlenP

    GlenP

    GlenP

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2014
    Messages:
    1,578
    Likes Received:
    138
    does that kit come with engine nozzles for display? You could make a set of them from cardstock transitions, glue to a mounting plate on the end of an engine casing, or coupler-size tube insert for display only. that would be a nice touch.
     
  6. Nov 3, 2017 #6

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    It does not come with engine nozzles for display. It has a motor retainer to keep a D12 motor (24 mm) in place. It looks like there might be enough room for a coupler tube with a mounting plate for display nozzles.
     
  7. Nov 3, 2017 #7

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    I sanded with 400 grit paper and put on one last coat of white primer.
     
  8. Nov 13, 2017 #8

    NJRick

    NJRick

    NJRick

    Saturn 1b nut TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,773
    Likes Received:
    6
    how could I have missed a Saturn 1b build thread?? awesome!! can't wait to see how yours turn out. I was looking at this kit. I did buy the Boyce Nike Hercules but have not started it yet.
     
  9. Nov 13, 2017 #9

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    NJ,
    This model will not be like one of those masterpieces that you do for the Saturn 1B. I am thinking of this as a sports scale or even more so like the RTF the Cox put out for the Saturn 1B about 45 years ago. I have been spray painting with Rustoleum 2x Ultra Cover white semi-gloss paint + primer sometimes sanding with 400 grit paper and sometimes not. I think I will be masking and painting black soon.
     
    jdud likes this.
  10. Nov 14, 2017 #10

    NJRick

    NJRick

    NJRick

    Saturn 1b nut TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,773
    Likes Received:
    6
    looks like a cool kit aerostadt....masking those roll patterns will be fun! Love the 1b and look forward to seeing yours when you are done! I always manage to screw up some of the fins when I am painting them by reversing to roll pattern. I like the Rustoleum 2x as well...I have pretty good luck with that paint.


     
  11. Nov 15, 2017 #11

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    NJ,
    You are right about the reversing pattern. The masking operation is almost like trying to take a negative of the actual pattern with your mind. I looked at Peter Always Saturn 1B in his Rockets of the World and tried to come up with the masking pattern. There are a lot of do-dads on the second stage and I am not sure that all of them are in exactly the right place. The model has corrugation on the second stage, which makes masking even more difficult. On the upper second stage corrugation pattern I decided to make everything black, which is easier. You can see in the photo's that the model uses screws for motor retention.

    001.jpg 002.jpg

    003.jpg 004.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2017
  12. Nov 15, 2017 #12

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    I seen on TRF that a lot of modelers use Tamiya tape for masking. So, I ordered some. It looks like good stuff. It is much sticker than blue masking tape, which in general is good. However, it tends to stick to the scissors, so it is hard to cut. Also, it tears fairly easy, especially, if you buy the wide roll. Someone else mentioned that using an X-acto knife comes in handy for trimming the tape, where the the first stage booster tanks meet the lower fin transition. I found this to be true. It helps to use a new blade, too.

    005.jpg 006.jpg

    007.jpg [ ATTACH=CONFIG]332146[/ATTACH]
     

    Attached Files:

    • 008.jpg
      008.jpg
      File size:
      62.9 KB
      Views:
      95
    Last edited: Nov 16, 2017
  13. Nov 16, 2017 #13

    GlenP

    GlenP

    GlenP

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 4, 2014
    Messages:
    1,578
    Likes Received:
    138
    if you press the tape edges down well, you should be fine with regards to bleed through. another idea is to spray a light coat of the white again, on top of the tape to let that same color bleed through to seal the tape, or clear, then spray the black. Not really essential if you did a good tape job. you can always experiment on a scrap cardboard box to test this technique.
     
  14. Nov 16, 2017 #14

    RIB

    RIB

    RIB

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 3, 2017
    Messages:
    63
    Likes Received:
    0
    Uh, just a thought. From AS- 206 on, the Saturn 1B's first stage tanks were all white...........
     
  15. Nov 20, 2017 #15

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    Glen,
    Thanks for the good advice. Unfortunately, I didn't see your post until after I started painting black. (I used Rustoleum 2X paint+primer flat black) If I had it do over, I think a light coat of white on the masking tape would have been my preference. I did press down on the corrugation with my finger nail, but it seemed like after awhile the tension in the tamiya tape would cause the tape to lift. The upper corrugation worked fine. I think the biggest problem was the bleed through on the booster tanks. Only one white tank turned out good. I will try touching up with white paint from a bottle and a small brush. I might also try some white self-adhesive monokote.

    RIB, I thought about some of the easier paint patterns, but decided that I wanted to capture the classic Saturn 1B look.

    002.jpg 003.jpg 004.jpg

    005.jpg 006.jpg 007.jpg
     
  16. Nov 23, 2017 #16

    NJRick

    NJRick

    NJRick

    Saturn 1b nut TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,773
    Likes Received:
    6
    Tamiya also makes a more flexible "tamiya tape" for complex curves etc....the tape is white. I am not sure if it would have worked any better though. That is a really difficult pattern to paint. the red United States lettering that will go down middle of the black tank has a white background. You can buy some plain white decal sheet for that section if you do not want to mask that and paint it white.
     
  17. Nov 25, 2017 #17

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    NJ,
    Thanks for the advice. I know you are the master on these Saturn 1B's. I am taking the easy way out on the "United States" and "USA" lettering. I've ordered the decals from Sticker Shock. I balanced the Boyce Saturn 1B according to the directions (I put a D12-3 in the aft end) and put 3 lead egg sinkers, weighing 1/4 ounce each, with epoxy into the nose cone.

    002.jpg 003.jpg 004.jpg
     
  18. Nov 27, 2017 #18

    NJRick

    NJRick

    NJRick

    Saturn 1b nut TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,773
    Likes Received:
    6
    she is looking great! I give you a lot of credit for painting the roll patterns...that is NOT an easy task at all. Then throw in corrugations that just makes masking even harder. I have heard a lot of people talk about Sticker Shock ...I have to check them out!

     
    Last edited: Nov 27, 2017
  19. Dec 1, 2017 #19

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    Thanks, NJ, you are most kind! I'm not into making decals and rather let Mark at Sticker Shock do it. The pictures below show the decals on the Saturn 1B. I think that the USA lettering should be thinner, but I think I actually like the thicker letters. Remember this is sports scale. I still need to put on the silver mylar on the service module. Again, I'm not going to be fully accurate on that.

    002.jpg 003.jpg 004.jpg

    005.jpg 007.jpg 008.jpg
     
  20. Dec 2, 2017 #20

    NJRick

    NJRick

    NJRick

    Saturn 1b nut TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,773
    Likes Received:
    6
    beautiful job! I might just have to pick one of these up!
     
  21. Mar 3, 2018 #21

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    Thanks, NJ,
    I put some silver mylar on the service module. The model is ready to fly. Hopefully, it will fly this Spring.

    001.jpg 002.jpg

    004.jpg 005.jpg
     
  22. Mar 4, 2018 #22

    dpower

    dpower

    dpower

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2009
    Messages:
    1,086
    Likes Received:
    17
    That’s a nice looking 1B. What is the final weight?
     
  23. Mar 4, 2018 #23

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    Right now, with parachutes, a D12-5 motor, and everything, the weight is 9.24 oz.
     
  24. Mar 7, 2018 #24

    NJRick

    NJRick

    NJRick

    Saturn 1b nut TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,773
    Likes Received:
    6
    she turned out great!
    I have watched your Boyce builds that you have posted ...inspired me to buy their Nike Hercules...I sense a build thread coming in the future..



     
  25. Mar 7, 2018 #25

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    Thanks, NJ! Your Saturn 1B builds have been historic. A Boyce Nike-Hercules build thread would be welcome, especially sanding and handling a 3D printed surfaces. BTW there is a possibility that Boyce may make a limited production run of a new Nike-Hercules.
     
  26. Apr 15, 2018 #26

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    This model did not fly well with a D12-5. The model went up to about 100 feet perhaps going sideways part way up and then fell back. There was damage. The model may need more nose weight.

    007.jpg
     
  27. Apr 21, 2018 #27

    MaxQ

    MaxQ

    MaxQ

    Tripoli 2747

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2009
    Messages:
    4,377
    Likes Received:
    45
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Central Viginia - USA
    Sorry to hear that...
    How did the SR-X fly?
     
  28. Apr 21, 2018 #28

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
  29. Apr 24, 2018 #29

    NJRick

    NJRick

    NJRick

    Saturn 1b nut TRF Supporter

    Joined:
    Aug 27, 2011
    Messages:
    2,773
    Likes Received:
    6
    sorry to hear of this! I hope the damage is not too severe


     
  30. Apr 28, 2018 #30

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    aerostadt

    Lifetime Supporter TRF Lifetime Supporter

    Joined:
    Oct 27, 2009
    Messages:
    2,826
    Likes Received:
    64
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Brigham City, UT
    Thanks, NJ. After working on it I realized the damage is not too bad. I'm just about done. I checked the c.g. after the flight and it was right at the location where the instructions stated it should be. I added another 1.52 oz. in the nose cone where I already had 0.75 oz. This moved the c.g. forward a good inch.
     
    jdud likes this.

Share This Page