Five
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Anyone have any experience with the LOC High Tech rocket
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Five
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In your opinion, would say that it’s stronger that CA glue(quick cure, medium cure) or any type of JB weld?
For mid-powered rockets I like using a combination of gorilla super glue gel with JB weld slow cure. There is one downside about using super glue which is, you better have what you are gluing in it’s correct spot or else your screwed. I make sure I can position whatever it is I’m gluing first. Then JB weld for the fillets.
Like I mentioned I’m a newbie. This may be common knowledge to you but yet it’s useful information for me that I do take into consideration and is much appreciated.
CA glue of any common kind shouldn’t be relied on to keep on the fins of a mid-powered rocket. It’s sole job is to tack the fins in place so they don’t move around while the fillets are drying. As far as I can tell by text post, you are doing things correctly. I use medium cure and a bottle that can cure it near instantly once the fins are where I like them.
When it comes to JB weld slow cure versus titebond, depending on the exact products being compared, either could be stronger, but generally JB weld will have an edge in strength.
However, titebond is cheaper, easier to sand, and usually plenty strong for midpower rockets. I think titebond is a non-foaming glue but some wood glues (like gorilla glue) do foam. Do a test on some scrap material before hand to make sure you are satisfied with the result.
Titebond also has a limited working time of 5 minutes for the first two products and 8-10 for their fancier glue if my memory serves me right. This should be plenty, but if you try to work past this, this could significantly weaken the result.
Next comes epoxies. JB weld is a type of epoxy with lots of fillers already mixed in that isn’t particularly strong and modestly expensive, but can handle somewhat extreme heat much better than its competitors in the price bracket.
For high power rockets, we use strong epoxy for practically everything, except for attaching objects under moderate stress to high temp components like a engine retainer to a motor tube or the root of fins to the motor mount.
I consider most 5 minute epoxies to be crap and wouldn’t bother with them. 30 minute epoxies tend to be nice and strong. I use more specialized types for my rockets, but usually 30 minute does nicely for most hobbyists.
The best part of epoxies is that you can tailor them to your exact needs. You can thicken them to practically any consistency you desire. You can add chopped carbon fiber to make an incredibly strong fillet (it’s on a whole different level than anything we talked about before). You can make it sandable and so much more.
It can be cheap in largish amounts for the general use stuff or very expensive for specialized versions.
However, it can also be bad for your health especially after repeated exposure. You don’t want to get it on your skin or breathe in the fumes from certain volatile types or the particles of some kinds of fillers.
The basic types can be squeezed out by eye but the nicer types will require a scale to measure out precise amounts by weight of the two components.
I’m used to using epoxy for high power rockets so I use it for pretty much everything.
However, you’ll likely be best served with a non-foaming wood-glue and CA to tack the fins. However, if what you are doing now works for you, you don’t have to change.
If you have any further questions or want clarification, feel free to ask.
When it comes to JB weld slow cure versus titebond, depending on the exact products being compared, either could be stronger, but generally JB weld will have an edge in strength.
However, titebond is cheaper, easier to sand, and usually plenty strong for midpower rockets. I think titebond is a non-foaming glue but some wood glues (like gorilla glue) do foam. Do a test on some scrap material before hand to make sure you are satisfied with the result.
Titebond also has a limited working time of 5 minutes for the first two products and 8-10 for their fancier glue if my memory serves me right. This should be plenty, but if you try to work past this, this could significantly weaken the result.
Next comes epoxies. JB weld is a type of epoxy with lots of fillers already mixed in that isn’t particularly strong and modestly expensive, but can handle somewhat extreme heat much better than its competitors in the price bracket.
For high power rockets, we use strong epoxy for practically everything, except for attaching objects under moderate stress to high temp components like a engine retainer to a motor tube or the root of fins to the motor mount.
I consider most 5 minute epoxies to be crap and wouldn’t bother with them. 30 minute epoxies tend to be nice and strong. I use more specialized types for my rockets, but usually 30 minute does nicely for most hobbyists.
The best part of epoxies is that you can tailor them to your exact needs. You can thicken them to practically any consistency you desire. You can add chopped carbon fiber to make an incredibly strong fillet (it’s on a whole different level than anything we talked about before). You can make it sandable and so much more.
It can be cheap in largish amounts for the general use stuff or very expensive for specialized versions.
However, it can also be bad for your health especially after repeated exposure. You don’t want to get it on your skin or breathe in the fumes from certain volatile types or the particles of some kinds of fillers.
The basic types can be squeezed out by eye but the nicer types will require a scale to measure out precise amounts by weight of the two components.
I’m used to using epoxy for high power rockets so I use it for pretty much everything.
However, you’ll likely be best served with a non-foaming wood-glue and CA to tack the fins. However, if what you are doing now works for you, you don’t have to change.
If you have any further questions or want clarification, feel free to ask.
Rocks&Rockets
Re-tired Inspector
My experience with the quality of LOC Precision products has been mixed. I like the heavier wall thickness of their cardboard tubes. However the last "kit" I bought was not a great experience. The 3" IRIS came with 1/8" plywood fins that were so warped they wouldnot fit the slots in the tube. The nosecone wasn't made for the thicker wall tube and left a step at the leading edge of the airframe. And... no decals were in the package. They said the material is "5-ply aircraft plywood" fins but they were lasercut from 3-ply and severely warped. The company responded quickly with a usable set but they are the same, 3-ply material. Had to buy a longer, 3in nosecone that fits properly from MAC. (I'm not concerned about scale detail). Recently finished the assembly and hoped to use it to cert L1 in the fall after a couple preliminary G flights. Are there any significant advantages to using aircraft5ply vs 3ply in structural areas? I've looked at Lloyd's specs and can't really compare
5 ply is stronger in all directions while 3-ply is just a bit weaker and depending on how it is made can be nearly as strong in one direction and very weak on another or just a slightly inferior version of 5-ply.
If you where building a wooden plane, the difference could be vital but assuming they bought a decent 3-ply it should be totally fine for an L1 rocket.
3-ply is usually cheaper and usually cuts easier on a laser cutter.
Warping is disappointing and usually the result of improper storage conditions or sometimes very poor quality plywood.
If you where building a wooden plane, the difference could be vital but assuming they bought a decent 3-ply it should be totally fine for an L1 rocket.
3-ply is usually cheaper and usually cuts easier on a laser cutter.
Warping is disappointing and usually the result of improper storage conditions or sometimes very poor quality plywood.
Rocks&Rockets
Re-tired Inspector
Some kind of quality assurance would be nice to have. There are formal standards applied to descriptions such as Baltic birch plywood, "aircraft quality" or 5-ply- and the supplier can therefore justify higher prices. But you also get a higher quality product such as known wood species/percentage of it, absence of interior voids and uniform dimensions and thickness- all problems I've found in "plywood" from bigbox hobby stores.
I was not aware 5-ply was more difficult to laser cut, but then I still don't have a laser cutter (or 3D printer) in my shop!
I was not aware 5-ply was more difficult to laser cut, but then I still don't have a laser cutter (or 3D printer) in my shop!
user 30299
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Everyone and every kit manufacturer runs into issues with plywood parts at one time or another. When I started moving away from kits and into my own design & build I went looking for better plywood grades; strength & stability. I now use a 12-ply Birch plywood (1/4" thickness) for my fins, centering rings, etc. I can also get 1/8" thickness in 5 or 6 ply. The strength & stability comes from the additional glue lines, more layers of grain orientation, and the ability to reduce voids and defects during the ply layup.
The Hi-Tech 45 was my "BAR" rocket when I finally got back in the hobby with a vengeance.
I double walled the entire airframe and redesigned the bird for dual deployment using the anti zipper design. I also overbuilt the whole thing.
Flew great on H-J motors. I flew it several times on J350's then went for the gusto with a J570. Unfortunately I lucked out with one of the RMSEZ surprise 0-second delays. If it wasn't for that, she probably would have survived.
Video of one of several J350 flights.
Here is the flight of the J570 flight.
Have fun.
I double walled the entire airframe and redesigned the bird for dual deployment using the anti zipper design. I also overbuilt the whole thing.
Flew great on H-J motors. I flew it several times on J350's then went for the gusto with a J570. Unfortunately I lucked out with one of the RMSEZ surprise 0-second delays. If it wasn't for that, she probably would have survived.
Video of one of several J350 flights.
Here is the flight of the J570 flight.
Have fun.
Five
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Impressive videos.
