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Another Estes Big Daddy (2162) Lawndart Questions Thread...

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If you had an Estes Big Daddy (2162) lawndart, did you apply tape to the shoulder of the nosecone?

  • Yes

    Votes: 1 25.0%
  • No

    Votes: 3 75.0%

  • Total voters
    4

K'Tesh

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I keep getting pushback on FB from veteran BD owners... Here's the last exchange...

Random Big Daddy Owner said:
I’ve flown my two Big Daddys dozens of times and seen plenty more flown by others...never experienced a problem or seen someone else have one with the nose cone ejecting.
K'Tesh said:
I'm glad to hear that you haven't had any problems with your BD.

Please answer this question. Have you done anything... anything at all... to improve the fit of your nosecone to the body tube? Such as applying tape to the shoulder to snug the fit of the nosecone to the body tube. This would be following the instructions found in the "PREPARE RECOVERY SYSTEM" step (damn I miss instruction step numbers).
I suspect that the BDs that are lawndarting (the ones that are not having ejection charge failures (something that some people are claiming is the cause)) did not follow the step indicated in red in the image below. I believe that this easy-to-overlook-step is a *MAJOR* part of the reason that this kit has the reputation that it does. The rest of the cause is that the nosecone is simply too loose in its manufacture to allow that ramp to open up in a drag separation situation
1611429898396.png


So, you've seen the poll question... Here's some answers I'd like to find out...

If you had a BD lawndart:
Did you apply masking tape or any other kind of tape, to the shoulder as indicated in instructions?
Did you modify the nosecone *IN ANY WAY*? If so, how?
Did you believe that there was a weak ejection for some reason? Why do you feel this way? Is there any evidence for a weak ejection?
Was there any scorching or other indication that the ejection charge fired off (or didn't)?
Were you flying it with non-Estes motors (e.g. Aerotech RMS) and forget to add the ejection charge?

And the BIG QUESTIONS...

Did you file a MESS Report?
Did you contact Estes?
If so, who, or what department, did you contact about this explaining what happened? FYI their Compliance Officer is currently Heather Brown (in the past it was either Mary Roberts, or Chandra Serfoss).

If you've flown a BD, but never had a lawndart:
Did you apply masking tape or any other kind of tape, to the shoulder as indicated in instructions?
Did you modify the nosecone *IN ANY WAY*?

Thanks!
 
Last edited:

Long_Gone

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I had a Daddy dart (Twice) BUT, I put in C6-3 and it's not enough................................... All D&E flights BP and RMS were textbook!

LG~
 

K'Tesh

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Update: got an answer to the question I posed to the previously mentioned BD owner.

Random Big Daddy Owner said:
yes, I have some tape on my nosecone. I have tape on the nosecones of many of my rockets, and there are a few others that I’ve had to lightly sand for proper fit. And in my experience sometimes tape needs to be added or removed to adjust fitment based on weather conditions or even for soot build up- especially in the Big Daddy with its short stubby tube. In my opinion it’s a pretty basic part of the hobby that most other than beginners would be aware of.
Again, it's my theory that the major reason this kit has a history of falling out of the sky is the looseness of the nosecone and the combination of the high drag of the short body tube and its lightweight construction. This theory has evolved to explain why some have a problem with it, and others don't... Missing the instruction for adjusting the fit of the nosecone or finding that step, and following the given instruction. Those that miss it have problems, those that don't miss it, don't. Their are possible fixes that Estes could do. Either change the design of the shoulder (tightening it and/or removing the ramp (which would be expensive)), or do a better job of making it obvious that this design (and likely the new nosecone for the Der Big Red Max (9721)) *REQUIRES* tape to adjust the fit (a simple change to the instructions and a lot cheaper than re-tooling the mold). Either way would likely be a lot cheaper than if someone gets hurt because one of these rockets falls on them, and any lawyer representing them finding these threads discussing this issue.

Another theory I have for the BD's nosecone... The shoulder was made loose as it was to accommodate heavy walled body tubes.
 
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Long_Gone

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I never taped the nose cone, and I just looked at it and the only thing I did to is was sand the flashing from the seam. I fits pretty snug not loose at all. Maybe that's why I never had issues. No room to tilt at all. Is it possible the design was ever so slightly modified during the production run to change the characteristics? Mine is pretty old, easily 10 years old. About 25-30 flights total. Was on the shelf for a while, especially when I was deployed and the wife will not launch rockets without me there.

EK~
 
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