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Altitude w/ no dual deploy

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viciouspeanut

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Hey everyone,

Planning out some motors for my next launch and just wanted to get some of your personal rules about how high you will fly without dual deploy of some sort (CR or traditional). I know it depends on mind and your particular launch site - ours is regional airport with some trees on two/three sides and them farmland beyond that. I have lost a rocket there before so I'm a bit paranoid, but I've also seen flights to 5K with motor deploy land 100' from the pads so...

Wanting to up the power a bit from an H123 last time (hit ~1600') to a baby I that might hit 2600' but am starting to talk myself out of it as I don't have a CR yet.

anyways - what is your rule of thumb and what have you gotten lucky with? :)
 

REK

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In the times I have gone to go see rocket launches. I have been able to spot 4" diameter rockets 3,000 feet in the air. Several had the main chute deploy at that altitude and landed pretty far out.

Dual deploy I will recommend once you hit 2,000 feet and higher.

Hope this helps


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cerving

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It's a crapshoot of course, but I think 3000' is a pretty safe number. Of course if the wind kicks up, all bets are off... your little Estes Alpha on a C6-5 may end up half a mile away.
 

stealth6

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Of course it depends on a lot of factors and conditions....wind, terrain, line of sight on the ground, how much or how little private land comes into play, how much I'm willing to walk/chase a rocket, the rocket in question, etc., etc.

But, all that said, I start using dual deploy once I get into the 1600'-2000' range, and definitely for anything going higher than that.

s6
 

DavidMcCann

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Experience with you rocket helps too. I've nearly lost rockets on 1200' flights because I didn't know exactly how they'd fall under chute and they drifted off a bit. My Optimas..... I've landed them over the top of launch pads on 2,000 foot flights.
 

viciouspeanut

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Hmm - Maybe I can eek a Chute Release out of the budget before the launch. Really don't want to take any risks. If not I'll just fly something else.
 

Kallahan11

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If I plan to launch a rocket north of 1500 feet I build it with dual deploy (With the exception of the odd Estes Yankee on a d21). If I've built a rocket with dual deploy I'll DD regardless of how high it will go. With either redundant electronics or additional motor ejection I'm more likely to have a good flight with DD.
 

My Gypsy

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We launch MPRs routinely to 3200' with motor deploy. Launch a few LPRs first to get an idea of what the winds aloft are doing and then swag the rail angle. Most of the time ours land within 1000' of the pad.

Disclaimer: If the winds are pushing 10 mph, I won't attempt to fly that high without DD.

PS.... Go ahead and get the JLCR. You'll wonder why you did not get it sooner.
 

djs

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I've hit 4000ft on single deploy/motor eject. Would not recommend. Anything over 3k would get DD for sure.
 

viciouspeanut

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I guess I'll just feel it out on the day, talk to some guys more familiar with the field and get their opinions. CR may or may not happen by then lol.
 

markkoelsch

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I fly mostly at Bong Recreation area in Wisconsin. There are a variety of hazards including trees, swamps, small lakes, and corn and soybean fields. So, we technically have a 10k waiver. I personally, unless the winds are REALLY low, will not fly more than 5k there. A couple times I have done 7500' plus, and I am at 50% recovery.

So, to answer your question almost everything I fly that is heading north of 2000' is pretty much dual deploy.


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Buckeye

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I fly all my HPR and many MPR with dual deploy, because I want my rocket to "do something" during flight. Also, motor delays are too variable.
 

jd2cylman

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My L2 was motor deploy at 3500'. But that was WAAYYY before JLCR. Now, my max altitude for no CR or dual deploy is 500'. Yep... I'm lazy. I want it back now! The beauty of the CR is that there is very little re-prep time. I've had the battery last for four flights in a day.
 

Tonimus

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Does popping the main of a DD at apogee count? If so, 6700'.
 

patelldp

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Dave has pics of my Bad Attitude at a 10,300' apogee that subsequently shook the main out at 8000'+. Recovered not terribly far away.


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FredA

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The hard and fast rule is: DO NOT go outside your waivered cylinder.
 

Flyfalcons

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My L2 was motor deploy at 3500'. But that was WAAYYY before JLCR. Now, my max altitude for no CR or dual deploy is 500'. Yep... I'm lazy. I want it back now! The beauty of the CR is that there is very little re-prep time. I've had the battery last for four flights in a day.
That's it? My CR batt lasts half the summer.
 

dhbarr

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I agree, we need one with a half-sized battery ^_^. Long and skinny, like you'd find in a 24mm coupler....
 

REK

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Maaaaayyyybeeee....








A clear day really helps.
Clear days are the best days to launch rockets. I consider myself lucky to hear the loud pop of the main chute deploy of my Mariah 54 after being launch 6,000+ feet in the air and lost sight of it in the few clouds that were around.

Those are some amazing photos.


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Handeman

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Hey everyone,

Planning out some motors for my next launch and just wanted to get some of your personal rules about how high you will fly without dual deploy of some sort (CR or traditional). I know it depends on mind and your particular launch site - ours is regional airport with some trees on two/three sides and them farmland beyond that. I have lost a rocket there before so I'm a bit paranoid, but I've also seen flights to 5K with motor deploy land 100' from the pads so...

Wanting to up the power a bit from an H123 last time (hit ~1600') to a baby I that might hit 2600' but am starting to talk myself out of it as I don't have a CR yet.

anyways - what is your rule of thumb and what have you gotten lucky with? :)
I think if you read all the previous replies, you will start to understand what "fly the field" means. Most HPR fields are large enough that you can fly LPR and MPR all day and still land in the field. It's when you start in HPR, and your sig. says L1, that you start learning about flying the field and the conditions. I think you are at that point. At my field, I've had days where I didn't want to go over 1,500 ft with DD, and other days when I wanted to push the 16K ft. waiver. It all depends on conditions, which are not just surface winds, but winds aloft, wind directions at various altitudes, cloud deck altitude, etc.

It doesn't really get talked about much on TRF because it's such a local field thing, but Welcome to HPR! What you learn about flying your field will do you well when you move up from the 2 - 4 K flights of L1 to the 3 - 8 K flights of L2. Just try not to lose too many rockets while learning that. Trackers are your friend...
 

viciouspeanut

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I think if you read all the previous replies, you will start to understand what "fly the field" means. Most HPR fields are large enough that you can fly LPR and MPR all day and still land in the field. It's when you start in HPR, and your sig. says L1, that you start learning about flying the field and the conditions. I think you are at that point. At my field, I've had days where I didn't want to go over 1,500 ft with DD, and other days when I wanted to push the 16K ft. waiver. It all depends on conditions, which are not just surface winds, but winds aloft, wind directions at various altitudes, cloud deck altitude, etc.

It doesn't really get talked about much on TRF because it's such a local field thing, but Welcome to HPR! What you learn about flying your field will do you well when you move up from the 2 - 4 K flights of L1 to the 3 - 8 K flights of L2. Just try not to lose too many rockets while learning that. Trackers are your friend...
Thanks Handeman - you're absolutely right. I think I have much to learn about the field as I've only flown small motors there and even then only four launches. I'll get with the experienced L2 and L3 guys our club has and try and pick their brains next month.
 

TomSmith58

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One time I went to Jean Dry Lake outside of Vegas an launched an Apogee Aspire on a G79 and a scratchbuilt that had heavier stock tubing on the another G79. I got a good recording of my altimeter on the scratch built. 4600 feet. I bet the Aspire went a mile. They were both near impossible to spot again. I had to search for a while. I have both of them back. After that I decided that an Eggfinder is a good investment.

Tom
 

Nathan

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I've flown over 4000 ft with streamer recovery. That works well if you have a soft grassy field but if you are flying at an airfield with lots of concrete then streamer recovery might not be so good.
 

ActingLikeAKid

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My personal limit - given that I use Chute Release and there's really no time or money or complexity penalty for using it, is if it's over about 1000', I'll CR it. Obviously, if I were doing dual deploy with charges, there'd probably be some risk/return calculation I'd want to do - the risk of losing a rocket to the wind vs the risk of a bad ematch/missing something on a checklist/low battery/etc etc that can cause a DD failure. But with Chute Release, for me anyway, the only reasons not to use it would be:
-It doesn't fit
-I'm not going much over the altitude I'd release at anyway.
 
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