AeroTech Open Thread

[Art Upton]

I could be wrong, but I don't think a load developed for the RMS 38/720 motor would be considered milspec or military surplus. Unless there is a other I600 out here that was mil surplus. Also, I imo redline wouldn't be good candidate for a mispec propellant. It doesn't store well. Also if it was milspec, you would be paying a lot more for it.

Then why would Karl say otherwise ?

 

[Art Upton]

I could be wrong, but I don't think a load developed for the RMS 38/720 motor would be considered milspec or military surplus. Unless there is a other I600 out here that was mil surplus. Also, I imo redline wouldn't be good candidate for a mispec propellant. It doesn't store well. Also if it was milspec, you would be paying a lot more for it.

You do know the DOD bought AT 98mm and 75mm cases and reloads from AT. That is why after the fire CTI started making reloads that would fit in AT cases, as there was a DOD need for them.

 

[n3tjm]

No I wasnt aware of that.

 

[n3tjm]

Doing some searching I see a lot of references that the I600 was designed for bowling ball lifting event at LDRS. Basically a J420 with cores enlarged to bring the TI to a full I. I don't see any reference it was developed for any gov contract's. That doesn't mean it wasn't, maybe the bowling ball event was a covenant cover story. nor does it mean the gov hasn't used them "off then shelf".

 

[Art Upton]

Doing some searching I see a lot of references that the I600 was designed for bowling ball lifting event at LDRS. Basically a J420 with cores enlarged to bring the TI to a full I. I don't see any reference it was developed for any gov contract's. That doesn't mean it wasn't, maybe the bowling ball event was a covenant cover story. nor does it mean the gov hasn't used them "off then shelf".

I suggest you ask Karl...he would not make stuff up...

 

[Rocketjunkie]

You do know the DOD bought AT 98mm and 75mm cases and reloads from AT. That is why after the fire CTI started making reloads that would fit in AT cases, as there was a DOD need for them.

I bet we (taxpayers) paid several times what hobbyists pay. Scott Dixon (Vulcan) told me the DOD paid him 10x what he could sell the same motor to us. There are a lot of additional paperwork requirements. When I ran CIC, we had to charge a 100% fudge factor while commercial customers got 15%.

 

[Art Upton]

I bet we (taxpayers) paid several times what hobbyists pay. Scott Dixon (Vulcan) told me the DOD paid him 10x what he could sell the same motor to us. There are a lot of additional paperwork requirements. When I ran CIC, we had to charge a 100% fudge factor while commercial customers got 15%.

I recall Scott and vulcan smokey sam motors; guess what they were use for for the DOD

 

[Art Upton]

Ok Training F16 pilots ...

 

[3stoogesrocketry]

I suggest you ask Karl...he would not make stuff up...

The I600 is a large core J420 that was developed for the bowling ball launch at the Geneseeo LDRS. I placed third behind Derick Deville then Geoff Elder. Unless Gary says otherwise.

 

[AeroTech]

I could be wrong, but I don't think a load developed for the RMS 38/720 motor would be considered milspec or military surplus. Unless there is an other I600 out here that was mil surplus. Also, I imo redline wouldn't be good candidate for a mispec propellant. It doesn't store well. Also if it was milspec, you would be paying a lot more for it.

I’ll ask Karl what he meant by that.

 

[AeroTech]

Conway Stevens didn’t quite break the K motor altitude record with his minimum diameter K250W powered rocket that nearly reached Mach 3, but it flew to a very respectable 31,374 feet at NSL West!

 

[AeroTech]

The I600 is a large core J420 that was developed for the bowling ball launch at the Geneseeo LDRS. I placed third behind Derick Deville then Geoff Elder. Unless Gary says otherwise.

It was indeed designed for the bowling ball loft contest as it was a detuned J420R. However, Karl says that It was also used by several mil/gov entities for projects, such as China Lake, also other mil ops tried it early on for Smokey Sams.

 

[chuck5395]

@AeroTech
Where can I find assembly instructions for the High Power RMS motors? I want to review the instructions before the launch but I don't want to break the seal on the package until I'm ready to fly.
Thanks!

 

[Sandy H.]

I bet we (taxpayers) paid several times what hobbyists pay. Scott Dixon (Vulcan) told me the DOD paid him 10x what he could sell the same motor to us. There are a lot of additional paperwork requirements. When I ran CIC, we had to charge a 100% fudge factor while commercial customers got 15%.

I just now read this post, so there was zero bias. I had a conversation earlier today with a guy who said precisely the same thing. They figured out what the job would cost a typical commercial customer and multiply by 10 and send the bid. They won a lot of government contracts and their business was not in a niche business. Your town probably has one or two companies doing the same thing, just not doing the proper paperwork to be able to bid the government jobs. But the government jobs weren't 10x as profitable, they did require so much special handling that they made better money than on generic jobs, but it took way longer and many more man hours to handle all of the detail requirements. I know the same from personal experience. . .

 

[Handeman]

I just now read this post, so there was zero bias. I had a conversation earlier today with a guy who said precisely the same thing. They figured out what the job would cost a typical commercial customer and multiply by 10 and send the bid. They won a lot of government contracts and their business was not in a niche business. Your town probably has one or two companies doing the same thing, just not doing the proper paperwork to be able to bid the government jobs. But the government jobs weren't 10x as profitable, they did require so much special handling that they made better money than on generic jobs, but it took way longer and many more man hours to handle all of the detail requirements. I know the same from personal experience. . .

I worked at a govt. facility for 30+ years. I talked to a contractor that was building decorative walls and flower beds around the front entrance. He told me he didn't want the job so bid it so high he was sure he wouldn't get it, but he did.

He did a good job. 20 years later, everything still looked really good.

 

[AeroTech]

@AeroTech
Where can I find assembly instructions for the High Power RMS motors? I want to review the instructions before the launch but I don't want to break the seal on the package until I'm ready to fly.
Thanks!

The RCS Store

The RCS Store

www.rocketmotorparts.com

 

[jmasterj]

@AeroTech, what is this I140N that I just saw listed at an unnamed vendor?

 

[AeroTech]

@AeroTech, what is this I140N that I just saw listed at an unnamed vendor?

I think they meant to list I40N.

https://d11fdyfhxcs9cr.cloudfront.net/templates/170652/myimages/i40n-p%20cert%20letter_1656515912758.pdf

 

[jmasterj]

I think they meant to list I40N.

https://d11fdyfhxcs9cr.cloudfront.net/templates/170652/myimages/i40n-p%20cert%20letter_1656515912758.pdf

That would make more sense, thanks!

 

[crossfire]

Dose AT still make the J520? It should have been a very popular motor.

 

[AeroTech]

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[AeroTech]

Dose AT still make the J520? It should have been a very popular motor.

Yes, it is still being produced on a regular basis.

 

[crossfire]

Yes, it is still being produced on a regular basis.

Isn't that being shipped with out hazmat fee?

 

[Art Upton]

Isn't that being shipped with out hazmat fee?

From Chris' site:

"The AeroTech motor reload kit comes with 1 rocket motor reload. Reload kits include all internal motor components and FirstFire™ Initiators. This AeroTech motor is U.S. mailable with no hazmat fee! "

 

[Art Upton]

From Chris' site:

"The AeroTech motor reload kit comes with 1 rocket motor reload. Reload kits include all internal motor components and FirstFire™ Initiators. This AeroTech motor is U.S. mailable with no hazmat fee! "

That would mean that each grain is under the USPS limit for propellent weight. Nice in such a larger motor.

Aerotech J520W-13A White Lightning Rocket Motor

Aerotech J520W-13A White Lightning Rocket Motor Chris' Rocket Supplies has live inventory, same/next day shipping with order tracking, and full time support.

csrocketry.com

 

[Charles_McG]

Is there any way to estimate the delay length if I put the delay element from a 38mm I1299 warp nine into an I600 redline? The red was missing its element, and I don't think our vendor is expected at the launch tomorrow.

I just need 8 seconds - and may decide to forego the black powder and just go with electronic ejection. The motor is for redundancy.

 

[jd2cylman]

Is there any way to estimate the delay length if I put the delay element from a 38mm I1299 warp nine into an I600 redline? The red was missing its element, and I don't think our vendor is expected at the launch tomorrow.

I just need 8 seconds - and may decide to forego the black powder and just go with electronic ejection. The motor is for redundancy.

Somewhere there used to be a RDK matrix that said what delay worked in which motor. Or maybe I’m thinking of things that don’t exist for $500 Alex…

 

[Titan II]

Is there any way to estimate the delay length if I put the delay element from a 38mm I1299 warp nine into an I600 redline? The red was missing its element, and I don't think our vendor is expected at the launch tomorrow.

I just need 8 seconds - and may decide to forego the black powder and just go with electronic ejection. The motor is for redundancy.

I may be missing something here, but I believe the I1299 Warp Nines are all plugged.

 

[Charles_McG]

I may be missing something here, but I believe the I1299 Warp Nines are all plugged.

Yes - but they still have a delay grain. I can tell it’s not the same one as the redline from the main ordering list.

 

[EBurg]

@Charles_McG I have this file - can't confirm if it's still valid, but I've used it to match up delay elements with motors. Hope it helps. I think if you have a .610" plastic element you're in good shape. You can cut or drill as you need from there.