Accur8 skins Mercury Redstone.

The Rocketry Forum

Help Support The Rocketry Forum:

jazzviper1

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 27, 2011
Messages
797
Reaction score
153
These things are a P.O.S.
I have used wraps before from Stickershock, and others and never had this much trouble.
I finally gave up and tossed them.
The cut marks are poorly placed, ever time you trim one side you remove the marks needed for another side.
They stretch making it almost impossible to get the panel lines to line up.
I feel like I got ripped off.
I do not recommend them unless you can work miracles.
 

mikec

Well-Known Member
Joined
May 9, 2009
Messages
2,554
Reaction score
405
These things are a P.O.S.
I feel like I got ripped off.
I have no experience with this particular wrap, but I used John Pursley's much more involved set of wraps for the Cosmic Interceptor and they were fine. If you're that unhappy, you should let John know.
 

Pointy_end_up

Active Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2016
Messages
28
Reaction score
1
I had great success with the redstone wraps. I followed the instructions and everything came out beautifully. I had no problems with the cut marks or anything else.
 

johnpursley

Old Rocket Guy
Joined
Feb 11, 2011
Messages
46
Reaction score
3
I certainly appreciate the supportive comments from Pointy and Mikec. I only discovered Mr. Jaskolski's difficulties after comments left in his eBay feedback on the skin ("...product is TRASH grade of product Z"). Prior to that feedback posting he not contact me expressing his concerns or difficulty prior to posting the feedback on eBay nor before he made the posting here. It is the first and only non-Positive (no Neurtrals or Negatives...ever) feedback I have been selling on this eBay account for 10 years and this is the only instance to use a description even approaching "TRASH.") As soon as I saw his feedback on eBay I reached out to him a couple of times telling him that I would be happy to refund his money or replace the kit. He DID respond back within a couple of days (it was very cordial and not reflective of his attitude in the eBay feedback nor his initial posting here to start this thread...I do not fault him at all in how our direct business communications have gone. It is not my intent to "bash" him). I have since sent him a replacement kit that I modified and printed just for him (it has a grey hairline outline that goes all the way around the perimeter of each body skin section...the corner marks can be ignored if he likes) as well as a very lengthy series of tips, suggestions and instructions for using the skins. I am sure that he will make out better with his second effort if he follows the instructions and considers the suggestions and tips. I have also offered to him that if he sent me his body tube I would be happy to skin it for him at no charge. This is the same commitment I would make to ANY of my customers who are unhappy or having difficulties with my product. I'm not just spreading bovine scatology here!

For any and all... My skins are a tensilized (generally meaning dimensionally stable) POLYVINYL product (they are not paper) and as such they are somewhat conformal and WILL also deform if you pull and tug during installation or pull them off with too much..."vigor." I have exposed them and all materials I use to reasonable heat, cold and even complete submergence in water just to be sure. The fact that they are vinyl and the fact that they are very thin (think of the "skins" that are applied to cars for advertising as well as the NASCAR racers, etc.) is explained in the eBay listings. The Mercury Redstone skins are my VERY SIMPLEST skins to apply. They are only applied to the cylindrical body and the flat surfaces of the fins. No pulling or stretching is needed (neither are the application of any alignment marks or "tricks") to apply them. Just follow the instructions and you will have no problems. If you do have problems, just drop me an email (my personal email is printed on virtually every skin sheet) and I absolutely guarantee a response (usually within a day...most often within a couple of hours) to any question or problem you may have. If I can't resolve it, I will replace the product as quickly as possible or refund your money in full...which ever you desire.

As soon as Mr. Jaskolski mentioned his belief the marks were mispositioned I checked and double checked. They are very precisely positioned so that when you place a straightedge to their inside (straightedge over the image so that wayward cuts that wander away from the straightedge [it happens!] do not slice into the image area) you end up with a perfectly dimensioned skin cutout. Positioning your straightedge INSIDE the marks also assures both the up-down, left-right legs of the corner marks are always visible and you know exactly how far to cut and don't end up cutting away the important marks for the next 90-degree cuts. This is THE conventional method of marking the extremities of rectangular areas for cutting in the graphics arts (which I first became engaged in some 40 years ago) and I suppose I took it for granted and didn't fully explain step-by-step how to cut between the marks in the various skin instructions printed on the skins or separate sheet instructions (which I will resolve immediately). I suspect Mr. Jaskolski sliced all the way across the sheet (or all the way vertically), discarding the all important marks for the cross cuts. There are literally THOUSANDS of skins out there with corner marks such as with the Mercury Redstone and this is the very first case where a user has had problems with determining how to use them or with their positioning. Having said that, I realize that I should not have assumed that the "obvious" is really obvious. There are those of us perhaps without patience, experience or skills involving the fairly unique and "different" experience of "skinning." Believe me, I have had plenty of stupid "mess ups" myself (i.e., patience, skills, experience) with my skins...particularly in the early stages years ago.

The big difference in my skins has primarily to do with the fineness of detailing that I can achieve as well as overall precision. For some of my other skins (some Interceptors, Ragnarok, etc.) they are a two-pass or even three-pass print process achieving registration between passes within .003" or so both vertically or horizontally between passes (try that with your average inkjet, offset, or silk-screening processes!). Also, the colorfast, UV resistance and pigment density (most inkjet inks are dye inks) surpasses that of some "waterproof/UV proof) offset press inks. It's not cheap nor fast to print these things and at best, I encounter about a 10% reject rate per run and sometimes a bad sheet gets past me. BUT, I can offer a very personalized experience with my skin kits both in the kits themselves and with my support...you 'just gotta let me.' I consider it an investment in my success, the success of my product and in my customers. Again, nothing bovine here!

I almost forgot. Mr. Jaskolski indicated he received a skin kit which had positions for launch lugs printed on them...indicative that I may have sent him a kit for the balsa-finned versions vs. the plastic finned version he needed...totally my fault if I sent the wrong kit (or perhaps a prototype...it has happened).

I have also recently switched to a less "aggressive" adhesive which allows for easier repositioning when performing initial "tacking" of the skins on one edge. The downside is that the surface to which the skins are applied MUST have a very clean glossy finish...the closer to "glasslike" the better. They should also be "burnished" (pressed firmly in place) to achieve best adhesion (a simple "brayer" or roller burnisher...usually under $10 at art or print supply stores...and online...and you can just use an engine casing or dowel to do the same thing, too). I have extended the dimension of the skins so that when wrapped around the tube they have about a 1/16" overlap. The skins are very thin and frankly the overlap joint looks better than the butt joints most modelers achieve. The adhesive adheres very well to sticking to the overlapping skin (i.e., it sticks to itself well).

In fairness, though, some modelers have had issues with the "less aggressive" adhesive (and I also had modelers who had problems with the "very aggressive" adhesive of the prior skins...sometimes you just can't win). I may have found a material that has an adhesive that is "in between" in its stickiness. It's a tad thicker (by about .0005" or so) and has a matte finish...not as matte or "flat" as my previous skins and definitely "whiter." If my test runs work with the new material I will offer it either as an option or switch to it entirely.

Mr. Jaskolski, if you think I have unfairly or erroneously presented the problem you were having (or with my offers and efforts at resolution) I certainly welcome your corrections, comments or feedback (as long as they are civil and constructive to interested modelers...otherwise just drop me an email...it's on the skins) or directly by email. I welcome any feedback or questions from modelers (at anyone reading this thread) about my skins be they current customers, future customers or just "curious."

I hope I have addressed your issue here as completely as possible because...well...you brought it up here on this forum. I figured it would only be fairly addressed to you on this forum.

The End

Thanks for reading my version of "War and Peace" <G>
John Pursley
Accur8 Spacemodeling
 

JJSR

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 12, 2012
Messages
776
Reaction score
65
Accur8 skins are great !
I've done two of estes interceptors, (Very Difficult!) plus I have one for the E version
GOOD product
don't know about the Redstone wrap, but if its just around a BT ,,,,,,,,
when I first purchased my skins I emailed and asked questions about applying them and he was very helpful.
8 fins and that nose cone :eyeroll: wow I thought I got in over my head, but with a little patience and time it worked out great
Picture or Video 050.jpgPicture or Video 058.jpg
 

Gus

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 18, 2009
Messages
1,731
Reaction score
119
I've used a number of the Pursley wraps on various projects. Absolutely fantastic. And you will find no finer scale modeling anywhere than Pursley's. Original poster could not be more wrong.
 

TangoJuliet

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jun 26, 2016
Messages
1,239
Reaction score
9
Now that John has weighed in with his response to the OP, I'll add my comments.

I recently purchased and applied John's Mercury Redstone skin to my own Estes Mercury Redstone (w/ Balsa Fins). I'm a fairly experienced modeler though using a vinyl wrap was a new experience for me. Wrapping the BT was fairly simple and straight forward. I did end up with a bit of a misalignment between sections, but I was too afraid to try to pull up the wrap and reapply them, so I left it, and I can live with it... Nothing a black Sharpie can't hide.

The only real problems I had were 1) After cutting away the portions of the lower (Fin Can) wrap to glue the fins on, the wrap wants to pull away from the BT; and 2) I used AeroGloss Sanding Sealer on my fins (2 coats, sanding in between) thinking that would provide a smooth enough finish for the Fin Skins to adhere to... It was not. What I probably should have done is paint my fins with a Gloss White paint prior to adding the skins. As it turned out, I may have ruined my fin skins, so I'll probably have to paint them anyway :facepalm:.

My first issue isn't really an issue. When I glue the fins on, the edges of the wrap that are lifting will get captured in the epoxy glue I use and will NEVER lift again. The second issue is more of a problem, but it IS NOT a problem with John's product, instead it's a problem I created by not following John's instructions and advice more closely and providing a proper smooth finish for the skins to adhere to. My bad, NOT John's.

Never did I feel that John overstated what he was offering, nor did I blame him or his product for my issues. One has to keep in mind that some skill as a modeler is required to use John's product, and if the modelers skill is not up to the task, inferior results are not the fault of the product that John is selling.
 
Top