4x OT R/C Glider Ignition

[aerostadt]

I ignited the Blue Glider shortly after separation, so it was very high up (probably about 800 feet) and very difficult to see especially through sun glasses. The glider was gliding when the motor fired. I could see a little black smoke, but I didn't give any input on the R/C controls. A spectator told me that he could also see a little bit of black smoke and that the glider was doing figure-8's. I am not sure about that, but I do think that the glider was going in circles, which is typical for my half-hull gliders. The glider tended to do circles all the way down. The landing was a little rough with one tail fin breaking off, but that is easy to fix. I just checked the servo's and they are working fine. The weight of the glider is 1 lb 4 oz ( 20 ounces). I am wondering if an E6 can do very much with a glider this heavy. I do have an F10 in my inventory and I am contemplating trying that next time. In any case either an E6 or F10, I will allow the glider to get closer to the ground and in good visual range. Two years ago with the similar Red Glider I tried to trim the glider on the way down to straighten out the circular glide pattern with some success.

 

[TheTellurian]

With an E6 you should have pretty close to a 1:1 thrust ratio.

Get someone to video a flight or 2. It would be cool to watch and inspiring to boot.

Richard

 

[burkefj]

I don't know if you rebalanced the glider with a motor in it but you're going to be tail heavy with the motor installed if you haven't adjusted your CG,; once you adjust the CG with you'reloaded motor you are going to be nose-heavy for glide so you're going to need a trim position setting just like you would if you were launching from the ground. I wouldn't ignite the motor at apogee I'd come down much closer around 200 feet to the ground and then boost, with an e6 if you've already got some Air speed you can just let it fly horizontal and then zoom up.

 

[aerostadt]

With an E6 you should have pretty close to a 1:1 thrust ratio.
Get someone to video a flight or 2. It would be cool to watch and inspiring to boot.

Richard

I don't know if you rebalanced the glider with a motor in it but you're going to be tail heavy with the motor installed if you haven't adjusted your CG,; once you adjust the CG with you'reloaded motor you are going to be nose-heavy for glide so you're going to need a trim position setting just like you would if you were launching from the ground. I wouldn't ignite the motor at apogee I'd come down much closer around 200 feet to the ground and then boost, with an e6 if you've already got some Air speed you can just let it fly horizontal and then zoom up.

Good advice ! I'm going to give this some thought for next time.

 

[aerostadt]

I got Nadine's pictures today for the 4xOT with the blue glider at Hellfire-24.

 

[aerostadt]

I am planning to try the 4xOT at LDRS with the E6 motor. I have made a swap-out motor mount using the F13 reloadable motor, but I think I will use the E6 for now. My Red Glider weighs about 1 lb 4oz and I am thinking that I may have used 0.5" up elevon for glide. The Blue Glider will weigh about 1 lb 5.5 oz with no motor. The motor will add about 1.9 oz for a total of about 1 lb 7.4 oz. The empty burn-out E6 motor is about 0. 8 oz. So, for the Blue Glider option after separation I will need something less than 0.5" up elevon to glide until in-flight ignition. I will try hand-tossing in the back yard to see how well this works.

 

[burkefj]

I am planning to try the 4xOT at LDRS with the E6 motor. I have made a swap-out motor mount using the F13 reloadable motor, but I think I will use the E6 for now. My Red Glider weighs about 1 lb 4oz and I am thinking that I may have used 0.5" up elevon for glide. The Blue Glider will weigh about 1 lb 5.5 oz with no motor. The motor will add about 1.9 oz for a total of about 1 lb 7.4 oz. The empty burn-out E6 motor is about 0. 8 oz. So, for the Blue Glider option after separation I will need something less than 0.5" up elevon to glide until in-flight ignition. I will try hand-tossing in the back yard to see how well this works.

So you're going to use the e6s for air starts?

 

[aerostadt]

So you're going to use the e6s for air starts?

Yes, I don't know if I will do a second 4xOT flight. Sometimes I have damage after the first flight and I need repairs. The Red Glider with no in-flight motor was able to fly twice at HF-22 back in 2017. The Blue Glider had a successful in-flight E6 ignition at HF-24 in 2019, but it was too high to see what was happening. I want to bring the Blue Glider down some before firing this time.

I just hand tossed the Blue Glider this morning with a loaded E6 motor in the back yard. The model feels fairly heavy to me and I don't feel comfortable hand-tossing. The first toss was from near shoulder height pushing from the rear. I didn't like that so I went with tossing from waist height holding the front and the rear at the same time. I am not sure that is an accurate toss. Anyways, it seemed that even 1/8" up-elevon was too much. With zero up elevon the glide seemed to be good. So, the transmitter flap position "0" will be no up elevon as usual for launch. Position "1" will be about 1/8" up elevon and Position "2" will be about 1/2" up elevon. After the parasite glider separation I think I will see how the Blue Glider behaves with no flap position change or be very cautious if I do make any change. I sustained a little bit of damage doing the hand-tossing, so I am done with hand-tossing/testing for now.

 

[burkefj]

I never try to test glide in all up config, just before adding electronics to verify neutral glide trim and max rearward CG. I think with zero trim you may be ok.

Frank

 

[aerostadt]

We flew the 4x OT again on Friday of LDRS-39 for the seventeenth flight since 2008. I drilled 7 seconds off the delay charge of the CTI J270-13 motor. Usually, this works pretty good, but not this time. The ejection charge went off very late. However, the parachute did open and there was no zipper or damage. The glider did separate, but not very high. I fired the E6 motor, which appears very sluggish in this glider and did not seem to do very much. I could hear the glider motor, but that was about all. I did use a floating e-bay on Flight #13 at Hellfire-13 to eject the parachute, but I was dissatisfied with the results. I now need to go back and re-examine using the electronic ejection. Tahoma Photography (Jim Wilkerson) caught some very good pictures of the lift-off (first 3 photo's below). I think Nadine (Photos by Nadine) photos (second 3 photo's below) may show that the OT was angled out too far from the flight line. I had a long walk to retrieve the rocket. I would say between a quarter-mile to a half-mile. The LCO sent out a golf cart to get me off the flight range. Nadine did catch the opened parachute. It might be a good idea to convert the sustainer to rail buttons rather than 1/2" launch lugs, but the electronic ejection is a higher priority.

 

[aerostadt]

After a very late parachute ejection for the OT at LDRS-39, I've decided that relying only on the drilled-down motor delay is too unreliable. Sometimes it seems like the motor delay is on time and sometimes it is way too late. In post #50 & 51 I built a floating e-bay, but that module takes up too much room. So, I am going to build the e-bay into the nose cone. I ordered some custom-made 1/4" thick bulkheads from LOC Precision. One set has a 3.60" diameter and the other set is 3.48" diameter. I am thinking that the old PML part of the company cut the bulkheads. The tolerance is very good and the fit with my modified coupler tube is very good.

 

[aerostadt]

Moving the e-bay into the 4x OT nose cone has been completed. The ejection charge will be on the piston like it was the floating e-bay described in post #50 & 51.