2008 F250 superduty........

[cjl]

Kevin I don't like that you are insinuating that I am a lawbreaking teenager looking for trouble. I am sure you break laws everyday even if they are small, speeding? ever littered and not bothered to picked it up?

The cat converters put on and DPF filters and other EPA items actually cause more harm then they prevent. The filter traps the black soot created from burning a diesel engine. Well, in order to clean that filter (its a regen cycle) it adds more fuel in to heat up the filter/pipe to about 8-900 degrees and blows it all out. Well, its burning more fuel and just adding all that from the exhaust back into the air. Its not saving anything. The only time these engines produce black soot is if you put it to the floor. The turbo kicks in and give a little bit of soot. Other than that they burn extremely clean with the new cleaner low sulfur diesel and better combusting engines.

Ben

Ben,

Diesels produce soot all the time, the only question is the quantity. It's true that a good modern diesel will only put out visible quantities when you are stepping on it, but that doesn't mean that the soot is not coming out at other times.

As for the catalytic converter, it greatly reduced carbon monoxide and unburnt hydrocarbon emissions. It also almost completely eliminates the emission of nitrogen oxides. This is a significant benefit, and it certainly doesn't cause more harm than it prevents. If you want, you could replace it with an aftermarket model - you can buy less restrictive catalytic converters that don't cause as much backpressure, but to eliminate it entirely would be fairly stupid.

 

[pmlkid]

ben were did you buy the truck?? i had a 03 F-250 with the 7.4 powerstroke that came with no Catalytic converter this was off the showroom floor as for toys go with bully dog exhaust turbo back and chips :bangbang::bangbang: ps.god i miss that truck fuel was killin me

 

[luke strawwalker]

Kevin I don't like that you are insinuating that I am a lawbreaking teenager looking for trouble. I am sure you break laws everyday even if they are small, speeding? ever littered and not bothered to picked it up?

The cat converters put on and DPF filters and other EPA items actually cause more harm then they prevent. The filter traps the black soot created from burning a diesel engine. Well, in order to clean that filter (its a regen cycle) it adds more fuel in to heat up the filter/pipe to about 8-900 degrees and blows it all out. Well, its burning more fuel and just adding all that from the exhaust back into the air. Its not saving anything. The only time these engines produce black soot is if you put it to the floor. The turbo kicks in and give a little bit of soot. Other than that they burn extremely clean with the new cleaner low sulfur diesel and better combusting engines.

Ben

Ya know, I agree with you Ben, but here's the problem... depending on the laws of your state or locality, it's probably illegal. Since it's a road vehicle and you have to get it licensed and maybe even inspected (I'm in Texas and we have a yearly 'safety inspection' that in selected counties surrounding urban areas (I'm five miles from the river crossing but unfortunately on the wrong side of the river and must get an emissions inspection yearly) also includes an emissions inspection. An under-vehicle inspection WILL nail you, and since everything is computer controlled nowdays, the OBD-II will tell off on you too, by probably throwing codes that WILL fail you on an emissions inspection. I agree that most of the stuff you said is true, but it's still the law, and really IMHO you're throwing good money after bad. I've done some mods to my truck, but they're LEGAL mods. Cat-back systems are legal most places, as are intake mods so long as they don't mess up the computer into throwing codes. I don't like the laws either; they're stupid and overbearing idiocy to solve nonexistant problems, but unfortunately we're stuck with them. Believe me, you're not the only one who doesn't like it, and you're affected by it FAR, FAR less than most folks are.

You think the regs are bad now?? Wait til the new Tier 4/Teir 5 diesel emissions come in this year... We just got training on it for the new schoolbuses (not that our district has bought any in three years or is likely to for another three at least, except the one new handicapped bus they bought with the 'use it or lose it Obama money' he threw at the schools with specific earmarks for what it could be spent on, primarily handicapped stuff, and the district had no other "approved" use of the money but to buy a new handicapped bus.) The new diesel buses are going to have TWO fuel tanks-- one for ULS Diesel, the other for UREA. Urea is a farm fertilizer in case you don't know, and will be 'burned' in the catalytic converter to "clean up" the diesel emissions. If you run out of urea, the bus will continue to run, but the computer will only allow you to drive 5 mph in "limp home mode". You can floorboard the accelerator all day long and the computer locks it out. If you shut the engine off with the urea tank empty, the computer WILL NOT ALLOW the engine to restart until the urea tank is refilled and the system is primed and ready. This is going to be a TOTAL PITA and is bound to cause problems FAR FAR WORSE than the emissions ever thought about being! BUT, it's the law that our brain-dead government has instituted, and so.... what can you do??

As for the "strobes" (which are police/EMS lights, and very very likely illegal in most localities unless you hold a valid peace officer's license, are a volunteer or professional firefighter or EMT and have both valid professional credentials AND A DEMONSTRATED NEED to be permitted to use them-- and YES I have known both reserve cops and vol. firemen/EMT's that got into trouble for using "emergency lights" on their vehicles when THEY DIDN'T HAVE THE PROPER AUTHORIZATION for them!) are NOT a good idea. Frankly, IF you install them, I HOPE you get caught and get the book thrown at you! You have NO BUSINESS doing that sort of 'stunt' for "kicks"... emergency lights are restricted to EMERGENCY VEHICLES, and FOR A REASON-- whether you like it or not! I used to be a cop and I can tell you, even just because your a cop doesn't give you the right to do whatever you want!

I'm glad you're enjoying your new truck-- good for you! BUT, having a massive, powerful vehicle DOES NOT MEAN YOU OWN THE ROAD. You have no "RIGHT" to flash strobes or other such nonsense at other folks on the road who may be driving slower and more responsibly than you just "because you can" or "because you want to go faster than they're going". You have to share the road. Other people pay for their vehicles and fuel and pay their license fees, inspections, and road taxes the same as you do. They have as much right to use the road as you do, IN A RESPONSIBLE AND SAFE MANNER! If you can pass safely, go ahead. If not, WAIT. Sorry to inconvenience you, but THAT'S LIFE! If you want to speed, go ahead-- you can pay your ticket as well (and if it's bad enough, lose your license or whatever else the local laws say can happen in your area). Hopefully your attitude will change before you end up killing yourself or somebody else...

I REALLY am troubled by the tone of your responses and frankly, your attitude. I have been run off the road by more than a few "kids" (regardless of age, but meaning irresponsible immature folks playing with their new expensive "toy" and thinking that somehow gives them the right to "own the road") driving "Daddy's Dually" with the wide fenders and dual tire over the line in my lane... among other stupid things I've seen them do. I run two farms and haul hay and equipment 100 miles between them, and haul hay and cattle from various farms and fields and drive a schoolbus as a sideline, and I can tell you, that sort of attitude can result in a tragedy. I've seen it too many times myself. Standing there watching somebody die and not being able to do a thing about it is tough, believe me! And no, I've never been involved in an accident personally, but I have worked them and been at them... it's NOT pretty. NOTHING you might think you "need" to do can justify driving fast or crazy enough to get somebody killed... and BIG vehicles are MUCH more likely to kill someone if you hit them, they're harder to stop, and slower to manuever. If you are in THAT big a rush, you should have started sooner!

One of my pet peeves is that these kinds of attitudes are so prevalent. It's the result of the decay of our society, I suppose, the ultimate result of the "me first" generation(S)... I see it every day. I haul more stuff and run more miles than a lot of professional drivers, and yet in running two farms 100 miles apart, I only need a 1/2 ton pickup. If the diesel costs are eating you up, GET A SMALLER TRUCK!! My F-150 SuperCrew four door cab has the EXACT SAME CAB as your diesel, and I get 20 mpg... which is pretty good for a pickup! My brother in law has done the same thing though-- bought a new SuperCrew F-150 and souped it up, and drives like a bat out of Hades 50 miles to his teaching job and back every day and then whines and complains about the fuel costs... I don't feel ONE BIT of sympathy for him-- he should drive slower and easier (less acceleration and brake slamming, which waste TONS of fuel) and/or get a smaller truck-- he lives in town and has NO USE for the big pickup-- he MAYBE hauls a few tubas once a year for my sister (who's a school band director) if that, and has NEVER pulled a trailer with it. I use mine to haul a trailer or stuff at least a couple times per month.

People gripe about pollution and foriegn oil, and the price of fuel and cost of vehicles, yet every time I go to Walmart or Tractor Supply, the parking lot is FULL of huge diesel dually's. When I look at them, I can tell that 95% of them are just 'cowboy cadillacs' that have NEVER had a trailer hitched to them, and most have never had anything more thrown in the bed but a sack or two of horse feed or a couple little bales of hay... stuff that could be done just as well if not better with a half-ton pickup, or even a Ford Ranger or Chevy Colorado... It's just 'all hat and no spurs' late for the rodeo types wanting to show off that they have enough money to blow it on a $40,000 pickup. Ce la ve--- it's a free country and folks can do what they want, but IMHO it's STILL stupid...

Oh well... do what you want. You're attitude says you will anyway. Same mindset goes for a lot of HPR fliers I've seen that just want to "shove the biggest motor they can in that bad-boy and see what happens"... (which is another pet peeve, but I'll shut up before I get in trouble on that one...

Later and be careful! OL JR

 

[Chuck Taylor]

I thought this was The Rocketry Forum, not the POS Redneck Truck Forum

 

[Mikus]

lol, my dad already said I might be getting truck nuts for my Bday in April :roll:

Ben

Overcompensation issues? :eyepop:

LOL! Relax, its just a joke....

 

[pmlkid]

I thought this was The Rocketry Forum, not the POS Redneck Truck Forum

well ben does not have the money for a bentley or a Mercedes benz :2:

 

[ben_ullman]

Ya know, I agree with you Ben, but here's the problem... depending on the laws of your state or locality, it's probably illegal. Since it's a road vehicle and you have to get it licensed and maybe even inspected (I'm in Texas and we have a yearly 'safety inspection' that in selected counties surrounding urban areas (I'm five miles from the river crossing but unfortunately on the wrong side of the river and must get an emissions inspection yearly) also includes an emissions inspection. An under-vehicle inspection WILL nail you, and since everything is computer controlled nowdays, the OBD-II will tell off on you too, by probably throwing codes that WILL fail you on an emissions inspection. I agree that most of the stuff you said is true, but it's still the law, and really IMHO you're throwing good money after bad. I've done some mods to my truck, but they're LEGAL mods. Cat-back systems are legal most places, as are intake mods so long as they don't mess up the computer into throwing codes. I don't like the laws either; they're stupid and overbearing idiocy to solve nonexistant problems, but unfortunately we're stuck with them. Believe me, you're not the only one who doesn't like it, and you're affected by it FAR, FAR less than most folks are.

You think the regs are bad now?? Wait til the new Tier 4/Teir 5 diesel emissions come in this year... We just got training on it for the new schoolbuses (not that our district has bought any in three years or is likely to for another three at least, except the one new handicapped bus they bought with the 'use it or lose it Obama money' he threw at the schools with specific earmarks for what it could be spent on, primarily handicapped stuff, and the district had no other "approved" use of the money but to buy a new handicapped bus.) The new diesel buses are going to have TWO fuel tanks-- one for ULS Diesel, the other for UREA. Urea is a farm fertilizer in case you don't know, and will be 'burned' in the catalytic converter to "clean up" the diesel emissions. If you run out of urea, the bus will continue to run, but the computer will only allow you to drive 5 mph in "limp home mode". You can floorboard the accelerator all day long and the computer locks it out. If you shut the engine off with the urea tank empty, the computer WILL NOT ALLOW the engine to restart until the urea tank is refilled and the system is primed and ready. This is going to be a TOTAL PITA and is bound to cause problems FAR FAR WORSE than the emissions ever thought about being! BUT, it's the law that our brain-dead government has instituted, and so.... what can you do??

I actually have done some more reading since posting. There are some nice 4" aftermarket cat.conv. and Im actually looking at getting a low flow one with an adjustable exhaust brake. Because thats one thing you can always use is stopping power.

I understand what you are saying about driving people off the road and such. I have some friends who do that with the large trucks. They drive like crazy just because they can. I feel I don't do this at all. I actually helped a few people in the recent snow problems. Pulled some cars out and jumped some poeple, for no money. I am lucky enough to drive a 4x4 I may help the less fortunate, because I have been there before.

Ben

 

[rokitflite]

Ahhh, Ben is getting into trucks the same way he got into rocketry. I see a truck retirement in a couple of years as well...

 

[Peartree]

Ahhh, Ben is getting into trucks the same way he got into rocketry. I see a truck retirement in a couple of years as well...

My 3/4 ton was retired when I moved off the "farm" (7 acres) and into town. It used too much gas to drive all the time so it was just sitting. No point in paying insurance on a truck you don't use. Driving the car is less fun, but a whole lot cheaper.

 

[bobkrech]

Well my dad bought one, 6.4L 5spd auto, turbocharged, upgraded alternator, supercab 8ft bed, gooseneck, tow package, 4 wheel disk brakes, 50gal aux. tank in the bed! Oxford white in color lariat leather interior.

I really like this thing. Anyone have any performance upgrades they suggest. Its got 87k miles so were not worried about ruining any warrantys at this point (referring to the 100k mile 5 year powertrain). I want to get rid of the exhaust. go 5" all the way back from the headers. Im tired of the regen cycles due to the DPF filter. Its only getting 11.5mpg and dumping that and the cat. converter should push it to 13-14mpg.

My dad and I were looking at chip upgrades. at $650 avg. we want to get it right. I would like something that has some user interface so we could set turbo limiter and things like that. Gas milage is a key, power and torque are nice added benefits. I would like a turbo limiter over 65mph because once you get rolling you can keep it at 10psi or less because you don't need all that power at those speeds it just eats gas.

Air intake is another big upgrade. Looking at doing that but for $300 or so I would rather get exhaust first.

Some little things I want to do are use the upfitter switches to add airhorn, running board lights, and a police/strobe kit. Always wanted to flip that on to get slow cars out of the way, people listen when you have strobes

Just looking for comments/suggestions. I will try and get some shots of her. The only thing thats it will need come next spring is new tires. Looking at like 22s with 34" tires 9.5" or 10" wide. Something good on the road but with nice mud grip incase we go to another LDRS

Ben

Ben

My friend bought a 2006 GMC 2500 diesel with a 5 speed automatic and gets 27 mph highway commuting, and 17 mph towing a 21' boat compared to the 17 mph highway he got commuting and 7 mpg towing the boat with a gas engined 2500. Fords don't get the mileage that GM diesels get, but you're not getting 20+ MPG on the highway with your truck in stock condition, you have a lead foot or too high a rear end ratio. At least you don't have the V-10 which is without doubt gets the worst mileage of any American truck because of a very poorly designed intake manifold.

You do realize that you have a vehicle that weighs 7,500 pounds on a good day, and that a diesel burns 0.35 gal/hr/hp, and 10 seconds at full throttle will eat up 1/3 of a gallon of fuel with the stock engine.

Changing the exhaust or removing the cat or the filter will not increase your fuel mileage, or enhance the performance significantly, neither Will changing the air cleaner. Soup it up with a new engine controller chip and it will consume more fuel, not less. Changing the chip will add power, but will greatly reduce your mileage because the chip allows greater fuel flow.

You don't have to restrict the turbos on this vehicle. Restrict the motion of your right foot. There is a small turbo for low end torque and a larger turbo for high end hp. Keep the RPMs down and the bigger turbo never kicks in.

Your truck should have a 3.77 rear unless you changed it. Since the motor has a lot of torque, you could actually reduce the ratio to get the mileage up without reducing performance greatly.

If you want performance and mileage, get a BMW Alpina 2-liter dual turbocharged diesel. 300 ft-lb torque, 300 hp, 0-60 in <5 seconds, 47 mph and 170 mph top end.

Bob

 

[luke strawwalker]

I actually have done some more reading since posting. There are some nice 4" aftermarket cat.conv. and Im actually looking at getting a low flow one with an adjustable exhaust brake. Because thats one thing you can always use is stopping power.

I understand what you are saying about driving people off the road and such. I have some friends who do that with the large trucks. They drive like crazy just because they can. I feel I don't do this at all. I actually helped a few people in the recent snow problems. Pulled some cars out and jumped some poeple, for no money. I am lucky enough to drive a 4x4 I may help the less fortunate, because I have been there before.

Ben

Glad to hear it Ben and I'm glad that you realize the *folly* of your friend's ways...

Hope I didn't seem to come down on you like a ton of bricks, but being a schoolbus driver and some of the stunts I've seen, it's a rather touchy subject with me... It's easy to get a bit 'over enthusiastic' about stuff sometimes, isn't it?? Guess that got us both!

Sounds like you're on the right track with the aftermarket cats. Don't underestimate the performance gains from replacing the stock intake system, either-- a cold air kit with a K&N filter can get you some nice cheap horsepower. The factory induction systems are rediculous-- the one on my 4.6 V8 uses a 3-4 inch tube from the filter to the throttle body, BUT it's 'smashed flat' like a pancake and has silencer chambers built into the curved part, and a clunky 'top hat' style filter. Most rediculous of all, the top hat filter inside the filter can was drawing air from behind the fender, which is actually good as a 'cold air' intake, BUT, it used a 'snorkel' tube to connect the air filter can to the fenderwell. It LOOKED ok from the outside, but when I pulled it out of the hole in the fender to inspect it, turns out it's FUNNEL SHAPED and had a hole MAYBE 1.5-2 inches in diameter in the center of the trumpet-horn shaped funnel inside the fender-- which does ABSOLUTELY NO GOOD WHATSOEVER FEEDING A FOUR INCH INTAKE PIPE! SO, that piece of plastic went in the trash right then and there, and I installed a short piece of clothes dryer hose to connect the air filter can to the hole in the fender (it fit over the filter can entrance and into the fender hole VERY neatly!) Later I upgraded to a K&N intake/filter and tube that uses the factory MAF sensor since it's a 4 inch bore (or thereabouts) and has plenty of flow volume, and continues that 4 inch bore through a chrome pipe straight to the throttle body valve, with the appropriate connections for the IAT sensor, PVC supply air, and IAC valve air supply hose fittings...

Good luck! OL JR

PS. If it was strictly off-road, I have NO PROBLEM with tossing all that junk and modding to your heart's content... but for a licensed vehicle... I see the Tier 3/4 stuff as rediculous on the agriculture equipment they're putting out now... I'd toss most of it myself eventually...

 

[luke strawwalker]

Ahhh, Ben is getting into trucks the same way he got into rocketry. I see a truck retirement in a couple of years as well...

Oh, I doubt that... there are things you can do in trucks you can't do in rockets... LOL

Like take girls for a ride... girls like trucks... OL JR

 

[rokitflite]

Oh, I doubt that... there are things you can do in trucks you can't do in rockets... LOL

Like take girls for a ride... girls like trucks... OL JR

A. Not if you build the rockets big enough like Ben was heading towards ANYWAY.

B. Are you referencing the old Toyota(?) commercial

 

[Peartree]

Oh, I doubt that... there are things you can do in trucks you can't do in rockets... LOL

Like take girls for a ride... girls like trucks... OL JR

Unless of course you spend so much feeding the beast that you can't afford girls.

 

[luke strawwalker]

A. Not if you build the rockets big enough like Ben was heading towards ANYWAY.

B. Are you referencing the old Toyota(?) commercial

Old Toyota commercial?? Don't remember which one you refer to...

Ya know, though funny you mentioned Toyota... I was just thinking of their latest ad campaign slogans and how they should be changed in regards to their latests problems...

Lemme pitch a few and see how you like 'em...

"TOYOTA: Moving Forward" should be changed to:
"TOYOTA: Moving Forward-- WHETHER YOU WANT TO OR NOT!" :eyepop:



How about this one??

"TOYOTA: Moving Forward" should be changed to:
"TOYOTA: Moving Forward-- STOPPING IS THE PROBLEM!" :shock::jaw:

:roll::roll::roll:

I shoulda been in advertising...

I've got a million of them... LOL Later! OL JR

 

[luke strawwalker]

Unless of course you spend so much feeding the beast that you can't afford girls.

Sounds like my brother... just sold his 76 El Camino project car he's been working on for the last several years; 454 V8, Automatic, 12 inch rear tires, 10 inch front, Rally wheels, custom narrowed front/rear bumpers, fiberglass induction hood (with working induction intake), custom interior, big sound system, blue dot taillights, lots of hop-ups...

Bought him a new Mustang 4.6 V8 5 speed leather interior tricked out... of course now he's spending money on new rims, and some other stuff to trick it out further... In addition to his 69 Ford F-100 that he's restoring; 351 Cleveland w top loader 4 speed tranny, 12 inch rears, 10 inch front "modified" factory wheels/hub caps, totally restored interior, slightly upgraded, 4 inch drop in the front, 3 inch in the rear, front/rear stabilizer bars, new gas tank (behind seat) redcoated and sealed with bedliner spray-on outer coating, and a bunch of other stuff I can't even think of...

No time for women though... :eyepop: Guess it should keep him out of trouble... L8er... OL JR