20 Plus Year Old Space Camp Rocket - Please Help Me ID This Rocket.

[wonderboy]

Family Space Camp, eh? I have grandkids... and they like rockets...

This looks like a rocket that needs built. Thanks to @wonderboy and others who contributed!

I just read your post to my wife... she commented that there were a few grandparent / grandchild pairs when they were there.

FYI: My son was a 1st grader when they went, but I think they have programs aimed at other age groups (have to admit I haven't looked into it in quite a while). I do know that although not every activity was incredible, the overall experience is one that they both have positive memories of. Just moved my son into his apartment for his second year of college, man time flies.

 

[bobby_hamill]

That looks like a 4 inch upscale to me

I even have some 4 inch clear tubing for the payload section

Bobby

 

[K'Tesh]

Thanks wonderboy for the photos!!!

And the package you've sent!!!

Can't wait to see the scan of the fins! JimZ has been alerted on this thread.

 

[K'Tesh]

I took some pics of the components all laid out next to a ruler, and can take some caliper measurements too.

With regard to the plastic, it sounds unusual to identify them this way, but I think it is poly-styrene. With multiple nosecones in a bag together, the sound they make when they clank is to "bright" of a sound. It's really hard to explain, but it seems that any of the polypropylene cones sound more "dead" when they clank together. I may be completely full of it, but I think these are poly styrene. And yes, molded in blue.

The engine hooks (both the ones the family came home with and the ones I recovered in the woods) all had the finger hook.

One more comment: these use a long length of 1/8" launch lug, 2-3/8" long.

Here are more pics and measurements.

Body Tube:
OD: 1.085"
Length: 11"
Three fin slots 1-5/8" long, starting 3/4" from bottom of tube
View attachment 536325

Payload Tube:
OD: 1.065"
Length: 6"
Wall thickness: (varied around circumference) 0.021" - 0.025"
View attachment 536328

Nose Cone:
Overall Length: 4.218"
Length Above Shoulder: 3.170" (stick the nose cone on the tube and how much sticks up above the tube)

Payload Tube Adapter:
Overall Length: 2.085"
Center Rib thickness: 0.070" (the visible part when a body tube is stuck onto each end)
Only one eyelet
View attachment 536326

Fins:
Measurements too wonky... I'll just post the scan tonight. Need to pull the scanner out of the closet.
View attachment 536327

Raw Decal Scan:
(note a PDF cleaned up version was posted on my first post above)
(second note: this is just what I could peel off of one of the donor rockets and what was left of my kids decal sheet after being there)
View attachment 536339

NOTE: I have a high res .TIFF image (about 26MB) if you want an uncompressed version of the scan above)

Please send the .TIFF file... If you can, break it into parts, the scan only, and the cleaned up image (smaller files = easier to share).

I also need the length of the launch lug, if you have that. It's not in the updated parts database.

Thanks!

 

[wonderboy]

I've uploaded the uncompressed .TIFF file to my google drive. Here is the link:
Raw Uncompressed TIFF file scan

Cleaned up PDF of all decals:
PDF File - Printable Decals

The launch lug measures 2-3/8" long.

 

[bobby_hamill]

I see where the decal sheet is part number PN037144.
Will call Estes Wednesday to see if the decal with that part # is still available ?

 

[K'Tesh]

My first draft of the kit. No graphics, save "paint" on the clear payload section to cover the nosecone and tube coupler's shoulders. The tapered sections on them are also simmed up, and may have an effect on the estimated altitude.

 

[wonderboy]

Here is a scan of the fins:


I've also uploaded the raw TIF image to my google drive (large file):
Raw Scan File (TIF) of fins

Note: I'll draw these up in a CAD program later this week/weekend if that helps anyone.

EDIT: forgot to post the thickness. I measured two originals (unpainted) at almost exactly 0.100" (give or take a few thou).

 

[bobby_hamill]

K"Tesh
I zoomed in on the fin outline shown on page 1 of the directions and traced the outline in MS Paint
Here is the result

 

[Antares JS]

They didn't allow much time for the project, so when they got home, we spent time fixing them up a bit. We re-glued glue joints and sanded/painted the fins.

I built a ton of these as a space camp counselor. I'm pretty sure the Eagles are made to be built quickly.

What was offensive to me though was when they built Loadstars with the Space Academy kids, they would have the counselor attach the fins for them with hot glue, and they would put the launch lug in the fin root and have the nose (which is larger than the body on Loadstars) ride hard against the launch rod until it cleared the rod. I rebelled against this and had my kids glue the launch lug standoff into the fin root to use as a spacer before gluing the lug on.

FYI: My son was a 1st grader when they went, but I think they have programs aimed at other age groups (have to admit I haven't looked into it in quite a while).

Parent-child space camp is aimed at younger kids with parents, if I remember correctly. For slightly older kids about 8-11, there is "Space Camp." Middle school age kids go to "Space Academy" and high school age kids go to "Advanced Space Academy."

I do know that although not every activity was incredible, the overall experience is one that they both have positive memories of.

I can think of a couple of activities I would have eliminated in favor of giving the kids more time to do a decent rocket build, especially for the Loadstars.

 

[wonderboy]

Update on parachute details: Unfortunately, I've removed the chutes from both original rockets. They've gone into the general parachute population and I have no idea which ones are attributable to which rocket anymore. Sorry!

 

[Antares JS]

Update on parachute details: Unfortunately, I've removed the chutes from both original rockets. They've gone into the general parachute population and I have no idea which ones are attributable to which rocket anymore. Sorry!

The parachute on the Space Camp Eagles is a standard Estes 12-incher with the white and orange stripes. No special markings or anything. (At least not in 2008 when I was working there.)

 

[wonderboy]

@Antares JS: I think that would have been a lot of fun getting to be a counselor at space camp. I imagine it's not all fun-and-games, but it sure seems like a cool place to have worked.

I feel you on the loadstar "shortcuts". It would have driven me nuts to have to support the build with the kids, only to be forced to follow these shortcuts. The only saving grace with the hot glue is that once you got home, it would be easier to "reverse" the build process and start over and do it right! With the SCRV Eagles I recovered from the woods, I was fortunate that so little elmers glue was used that I was able to pop most of them apart without any real damage. I even managed to get a motor mount out of the tube on a couple.

Also, I may have understated it a bit: Both my wife and my son LOVED their time at spacecamp. There are just obviously some activities that were more fun than others.

 

[Antares JS]

@Antares JS: I think that would have been a lot of fun getting to be a counselor at space camp. I imagine it's not all fun-and-games, but it sure seems like a cool place to have worked.

I feel you on the loadstar "shortcuts". It would have driven me nuts to have to support the build with the kids, only to be forced to follow these shortcuts. The only saving grace with the hot glue is that once you got home, it would be easier to "reverse" the build process and start over and do it right! With the SCRV Eagles I recovered from the woods, I was fortunate that so little elmers glue was used that I was able to pop most of them apart without any real damage. I even managed to get a motor mount out of the tube on a couple.

Also, I may have understated it a bit: Both my wife and my son LOVED their time at spacecamp. There are just obviously some activities that were more fun than others.

The story behind me working there was that I had three semesters of college left, but a lot of the classes I wanted to take were Fall semester only. I had to either pick different classes or take a spring semester off, and at the time, Space Camp offered free on-site housing and food for counselors who agreed to do night duty in the dormitories. It was a good deal so I took them up on it and worked there from January-August 2008.

It was fun, and I got to impress a lot of people with my extensive space knowledge. I also got to learn a few things there from others that I didn't know before. I also got to meet two of von Braun's original team from Germany (both of whom have passed), along with several astronauts. 2008 was also the 40th anniversary of NASA celebration, along with the opening of the Davidson Center that was the new home for the 500F Saturn V. A big shindig was held at the new Davidson Center and I was on duty as a doorman that night, and greeted about a dozen Apollo astronauts by name as they entered.

I was also in the best shape of my life in 2008 from running all over the US Space and Rocket center every day.

 

[bobby_hamill]

found this info about the space camp eagle

https://estesrockets.com/wp-content/uploads/Certificates/001766.pdf
and a good list of downloadable instructions

https://estesrockets.com/instructions/#001000

 

[K'Tesh]

Here's a photo from Bill Cooke of his Eagle built in 2007. According to him, the kit had die cut fins. He was also able to locate the scans he did of the instructions for it, and it lacks the color that was seen in Frank's set of instructions, but does mention that the glued areas were supposed to be red.




FWIW I asked bill about his paint job, and was told that the blue is Krylon's True Blue.

In our conversation we talked about the kit, and its evolution, and the working theory goes like this: The kit originally came with the 072626 nosecone (seen above)... and with die cut fins. Then some time prior to 2007, they changed the instructions to have it come with the 072638 nosecone (still with die cut fins), but didn't change the actual kit. Then they changed the fins to laser cut*, but didn't change the instructions, (and still shipped it with the 072626 nosecone). Then finally discontinued the kit in 2021, having never changed the nosecone.



About the sim, I've also run a quick upscale check, and the Olympus would be a good (not perfect) match for this nosecone shape. The body tube would be ~3/16" too short for a perfect match. The payload section would be about 9 15/16" long. eRockets has a clear plastic tube that would work for it. I'm thinking that I'd build it for 29mm motors, and adapt down to the 24mm if I wanted to fly it on smaller motors.

Pointy Side Up!
Jim

*As evidenced in the photos found on Worthpoint, an eBay price resource for past auctions.

 

[bobby_hamill]

I chatted with an Estes rep and he said all of the parts decal sheet,fin sheet,nosecone and bulkhead were all for the Eagle kit only. When ever Space Camp needed more Eagles the parts
were special ordered the kits were assembled and shipped to Space camp

 

[K'Tesh]

I chatted with John, and he gave me the dimensions of the fins... Which I incorporated directly into the sim. Now with laser cutting and finishing steps, minor differences can be expected.





These are the decals that he was able to share with me. Other than converting from .pdf to .png, I've made no alterations to them. The defects in the flag are what I got.
My sim will preserve this. However, my builds will use the cleaned up images from Frank. According to Dick Wolbers the Space Camp circular decal is 1 3/16" in diameter The stars decal is 5/8" X 2 1/4".

 

[bobby_hamill]

K'Tesh

Is the flag better now ?

 

[bobby_hamill]

The Rocket Gods are smiling down on me today

I was ordering a RC helicopter from a hobby shop over in the UK and the subject switched over to
rocketry. The rep I was talking to said he had a box of rockets that did not sell when they went from rockets and RC to RC only.
I was offered the box for 100 quid and I said what the heck and got the Helicopter and box of rockets .

Well long story cut short the box came in today The label on the box was dated 10/08/19 after regaining my composure I took the photos below .
all 12 kits are OOP and sealed factory mint !! The rep said that was the last of the rocketry stuff the store had .

Enjoy !!!

 

[techrat]

Ye Gods! What a haul... You're about to make a small fortune on eBay.

 

[bobby_hamill]

No eBay here,

I kept one kit for myself and the other 11 have been donated to a worthy cause
and some lucky students and their teacher

 

[K'Tesh]

JimZ has the file up now...

http://www.spacemodeling.org/jimz/est1766.htm
Thanks to all who helped with this.