New Guy's Onyx + Minie Magg Build

Hmm, I sanded down the cracked primer back to the epoxy, resprayed, and the cracking came back.

DizWolf said:

some take multiple coats. Much of the cause of this photo was filling spirals, but I had some cracking exactly like you showed on some early coats on this Optima.


Final coating came out ok. I used Testors One Coat Lacquer.


I also had the problem on my Executioner, which was 4 minute high temp epoxy (it was on hand) and Rustoleum primer. Covered that with some random floro green, had to sand the first coat and re apply. Had a phoenix show the same initial cracking, clean finish with duplicolor black. Not the cleanest fillets ever (was my first time with epoxy) but they painted OK-

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So you went ahead and sprayed ontop of the cracked primer?

dasein668 said:

It could be due to amine blush which is typical with some epoxies.

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Hmm, this is the first time I've heard of "amine blush" so I googled it up, and it helps to spell it amine blush vs anime blush.... The second spelling didn't yield any useful results! :roll:


One of the results I found said to clean exactly as you said with water and a scotchbrite pad.

I'll try that.

Thanks.

Kainam said:

So you went ahead and sprayed ontop of the cracked primer?

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with the executioner,Sanded over it, and then applied the fluorescent green over that thinking I fixed it. The green had the same kind of dry finish to it. sanded again, and the second coat was OK.

With the optima, I sanded down, and resprayed. I did *cough12CANScough* of primer on that one. long story....but I filled those damn spirals. Most got sanded off.

What kind of temps are you dealing with? I've noticed more issues when it's either very humid, or chilly. Seems I'm never ready to paint on calm dry days. I've got something like 6 rockets waiting on a good day to paint. Might be time to build a very large booth in the garage. (one of them just has to be a Magg)

Well, I've been keeping all my stuff inside where it is 70 or so. When I spray, I run outside real quick, spray, and bring everything back inside.

Outside, the temps have been anywhere from 40 - 50 lately.

Ugh! Nothing I do is helping. I Scotch brited it down, and reprimered, the cracking came back. Scotch Brited down a second time, reprimered, cracking still coming back! :rant:


What can I do???

Try using high build duplicolor primer. I used to have the same issues with krylon and rustoleum. I found that alot of it was my own error of either applying too heavy a coat or that i wasnt following the window that the paint is designed for. The cracking your dealing with is a surface tension issue with the paint where its too thick and hardens while the solvents underneath are still working and trying to escape so the paint is shrinking and basically pulls apart. This is a major hazard or a physically drying paint multiple thin coats with the correct amount of time for the solvents to flash out of it or you have to wait so many days to recoat so that it doesnt happen, I believe krylon is 2-3 days to recoat but im paranoid so i wait atleast a week at 70 degrees or higher. One other option is to go to a catalyist style automotive primer. Its a pain due to expense, the smell and the mess but they are easier to build and fill imperfections and sand alot easier and smoother the first time.

The primer can I have does say "Fast Drying". Is that the cause of my problems?

Look. It keeps happening. Unless you are seriously tight on cash, here's my idea:


Paint it. Sand the primer down, and final coat it. It's a diffrent kind of paint. May not crack. If it does, you're in the same place. If it doesn't, you're win.

Light light coats man.

Well on a good note, I have the 3rd color coat on the nose cone. It turned out good, still need to put a clear coat on it. The color shift to purple is hard to capture on an indoor pic.

DizWolf said:

Look. It keeps happening. Unless you are seriously tight on cash, here's my idea:


Paint it. Sand the primer down, and final coat it. It's a diffrent kind of paint. May not crack. If it does, you're in the same place. If it doesn't, you're win.

Light light coats man.

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If I was using an opaque paint, that might be feasable. But with candys, especially light color candys, the flaws will show through. I'd rather not chance it with $20 paint that I have to put on order.

It sounds like the coats are too thick and your waiting a lil too long to spray a second coat, if I remember correctly the last rustoleum primer that i used i could hit with another light coat in 10 minutes and if i went beyond 30 minutes i had to wait acouple days. The application details on the back of the can should tell you what your windows are and remember, less is always more

Conquered!


I did find some of the Duplicolor high build primer and bought some, but have not had the chance to try it yet due to the weather. Prior to that I tried some Bondo, but it was doing the same thing as the Rustoleum primer.

So while waiting for a good day to try out the Duplicolor primer, I tried using some of the Fix-it epoxy putty to fill in the cracks, figuring I have nothing to loose.... and that seems to have done the trick!




Still need to do some smoothing/blending sanding on the putty before painting.

With all the primering and wet sanding that has taken place, my fins look really good now!

It doesn't look like today will be a good day for primering, but it looks like my problem has been conquered. Next paint day, I will get the body tube spirals finished up.

I've been doing all of my painting with Duplicolor auto primers and base coat top coat paints. I haven't had any problems with them and have also painted outside in 40 degree weather. I take the paint cans and set them in hot water from the faucet to warm it up. then spray outside. It works great with no issues.

I'm glad to see that the fix-it epoxy seems to have fixed the paint issue.

I do believe the Rustoleum primer was the cause of the cracking.

Today I used the Duplicolor primer that was suggested on the Onyx.
I let that dry for an hour or so and no cracking appeared, so I went ahead and sanded the fillets on the Minie Magg to rough them up a bit and also used the Duplicolor primer on that. No Scotch Briting with water or wiping down with alcohol. Just knocked the gloss off with sand paper and blew off the dust with compressed air.

6 hours later and no cracking on either rocket at all, and I layed the primer on heavier on the Minie Magg today than what I did previously with the Rustoleum on the Onyx.

A couple good primering days and I should be good to go with final paint.


Thanks for the Duplicolor primer suggestion!

Next step, wet sand it with 400 wet/dry paper!

cmcain said:

Next step, wet sand it with 400 wet/dry paper!

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Yup! I used some 320 wet/dry today and put on another coat on both rockets.

Just now double checked with my trusty Surefire flashlight, no cracking!

I ran into the cracked primer problem when I was attempting to re-do my Der Red Max's replacement nose cone. I was using a high-fill content primer and had the can down in the garage. This was about a month ago--and here, it was starting to act like November. I think it was just because the stuff was too cold, because I used it again after bringing the can inside for a day with good results after I sanded everything off and stepped up from 60-400 before I squirted it with the paint.

Later!

--Coop

I was able to get some painting in last weekend before the weather took a turn for the worse.

Here is the base coat that came with the Duplicolor Mirage paint kit. Fillets came out much better than with the Rustoleum primer!




And here is what they call the Ice color. It came out darker than what I was expecting. Seems like you could use this on whatever color base you wanted to obtain a different color base, as the color shift material is suspended in a clear paint.

I still need to do the fins in the purple/green color shift paint, then clear after that.




Looks like it will be atleast a week before weather cooperates again before I can do any more painting.

I present the first "Der Red Magg".

I had Mark from StickerShock make up these stickers.

First time that I've used any vinyl stickers. I think it came out great!





I have the Onyx all painted, and used the "Onyx" sticker that came with it. I'll have to wait for a good day to take some outside pictures with that color shifting paint.... indoors and a flash just doesn't do it justice.

Bodacious Red Magg, Kainam.

Oh, dang. Now I'm going to have to add a Red Magg to my DRM collection.

That turned out freaking awesome! Great job!

o1d_dude said:

Bodacious Red Magg, Kainam.

Oh, dang. Now I'm going to have to add a Red Magg to my DRM collection.

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Hey Kit, how about a tubular Red Max?

Here's a couple pics I took outside this weekend:

You can just make out some of the purple color shift in the upper portion of the Onyx nose cone.

Bigger photo here:
https://www.moviephotoforums.com/photopost/data/853/DSCN1347.JPG

Wow, those turned out awesome! I love the background for your Magg. Where is that?

qquake2k said:

Wow, those turned out awesome! I love the background for your Magg. Where is that?

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That is the remains of what used to be a WWII B-29 training base nearby.
[The runways here were also home of the first NHRA Nationals in 1955, and the first AHRA Nationals in 1956... The dragstrips made from these runways are still in use today. ...For the trivia buffs]

The first 7 B-29 Superfortresses were sent here.
Aircrews from all over the country were sent to this base in the middle of Kansas to receive flight training before being sent over seas into war.

All that remains of the buildings is what was made of concrete.

I thought it would make an excellent backdrop for the Der Red Magg.... kinda like the buildings were destroyed by rocket attack.


I took more photos of the B-29 memorial yesterday too, I'll try to get those hosted online as well.

Kainam said:

That is the remains of what used to be a WWII B-29 training base nearby.
[The runways here were also home of the first NHRA Nationals in 1955, and the first AHRA Nationals in 1956... The dragstrips made from these runways are still in use today. ...For the trivia buffs]

The first 7 B-29 Superfortresses were sent here.
Aircrews from all over the country were sent to this base in the middle of Kansas to receive flight training before being sent over seas into war.

All that remains of the buildings is what was made of concrete.

I thought it would make an excellent backdrop for the Der Red Magg.... kinda like the buildings were destroyed by rocket attack.

I took more photos of the B-29 memorial yesterday too, I'll try to get those hosted online as well.

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Wow, that's incredible. I'd love to poke around a historical location like that. Yeah, it's the perfect backdrop for Der Red Magg. Do you ever launch rockets there?

Well, these are the first rockets that I've built in about 30 years...

Also, there is still an active airfield nearby, so I don't think I would be able to launch there....

One of the photos at the memorial....

I'll try to get more photos uploaded soon.

Kainam said:

Well, these are the first rockets that I've built in about 30 years...

Also, there is still an active airfield nearby, so I don't think I would be able to launch there....

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Well, it doesn't look like you've lost any of your mad rocketry skillz! And no, the pilots would probably appreciate if you refrained from launching rockets from their runway. LOL

Kainam said:

One of the photos at the memorial....

I'll try to get more photos uploaded soon.

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That is just awesome. I love military history.

The background caught my eye, too.

Thanks for the explanation.

When I looked at the picture, it reminded me of the bombed out submarine pens I saw long ago in Northern Germany als ich jung war.