Coronavirus: What questions do you have?

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Do we know what Germany is doing different? Is it how they are counting or do they have a different treatment??

Looking at the latest data
Country Confirmed cases Deaths
Italy 119800 14680
Spain 119200 11198
Germany 91959 1277


Italy and Spain are nearly tied for cases. The death rate is "in the same ballpark" for Italy and Spain
The nearly 92K for Germany vs 120K each for Italy and Spain are also in the same ballpark, but the German death rate is only 10% of Italy or Spain. Why?

Thanks! - Stay Healthy!!!!
 
les said:
but the German death rate is only 10% of Italy or Spain. Why?
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I think it was mentioned some pages back that Germany has been testing much more extensively than Italy and Spain, so their denominator (# of confirmed cases) is much higher than their numerator (# of deaths). Actual death rate is probably the same as Italy and Spain but the other two countries probably have asymptomatic carriers not showing up because they are testing less.
 
kuririn said:
I think it was mentioned some pages back that Germany has been testing much more extensively than Italy and Spain, so their denominator (# of confirmed cases) is much higher than their numerator (# of deaths). Actual death rate is probably the same as Italy and Spain but the other two countries probably have asymptomatic carriers not showing up because they are testing less.
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You may be implying this, but just to be clear, Germany's per capita death rate is far lower, so besides the wide spread and rigorous testing, they must also be thoroughly tracking contacts and isolating them to keep the spread, and potential further deaths, in check.
 
cwbullet said:
My opinion on masks is changing. I still think true surgical masks and medical N95 should be used by medical providers. The N95 is a respirator that should be properly sized to work correctly. The mask on you is best used to protect others from your breath and saliva. Many fabrics will work.
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Chuck, looks like the CDC just changed their opinion on masks also. As they now state, "...CDC recommends wearing cloth face coverings in public settings where other social distancing measures are difficult to maintain (e.g., grocery stores and pharmacies) especially in areas of significant community-based transmission."

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/cloth-face-cover.html
 
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Speaknoevil said:
Chuck, looks like the CDC just changed their opinion on masks also. As they now state, "...CDC recommends wearing cloth face coverings in public settings where other social distancing measures are difficult to maintain (e.g., grocery stores and pharmacies) especially in areas of significant community-based transmission."

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/prevent-getting-sick/cloth-face-cover.html
Click to expand...

They have changed their opinion but not for the reason most think. The research data is starting to show that wearing a mask protects others but not the mask wearer as much. The belief is that if you wear a mask, you will shed less virus. The primary passage is still dirty hands.
 
cwbullet said:
attention filler
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Chuck, is it your experience that a solid majority of patients on ventilators are not making it back off? Numbers of a 20% success rate are being thrown around on the news...
 
Flyfalcons said:
Chuck, is it your experience that a solid majority of patients on ventilators are not making it back off? Numbers of a 20% success rate are being thrown around on the news...
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I will have to do some research. In our system, I only have a low number to compare and our population is younger. 60-70% came off the vent in our system.
 
This week is key in our control of COVID. Most states have issued a stay at home order. They come in many flavors. It will be interesting to see if people heed these orders. Ou success as a country and our elder population depend on this success. Let us all bind together to publicly shame those that violate the orders/recommendations. It is time to do what is right and prevent the spread.

China and several other NGOs set us up for failure. It is time that we prove them wrong and kick this virus in the mouth (not literally because that might get you COVID).
 
Angie said:
@boatgeek Thank you for that information. I am liking this pattern I found as it gives sizes for teens, children and adults. And can be either elastic or stretch ties.

https://www.madeeveryday.com/fabric-face-mask-free-pattern/
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The Deaconess pattern is basically the same, except that it starts out with a 9x6 piece of fabric. They weren't real specific about how much to pleat, but another source said to to make the finished mask 3.5" high. That seemed to work fairly well. The only thing I would add to the Made Every Day pattern is a pipe cleaner or other wire across the bridge of the nose to make the fit across the nose tighter. It's fairly easy to slip it in after turning the mask right side out but before pleating it. You can hold it in place with another row of topstitching.
 
boatgeek said:
The Deaconess pattern is basically the same, except that it starts out with a 9x6 piece of fabric. They weren't real specific about how much to pleat, but another source said to to make the finished mask 3.5" high. That seemed to work fairly well. The only thing I would add to the Made Every Day pattern is a pipe cleaner or other wire across the bridge of the nose to make the fit across the nose tighter. It's fairly easy to slip it in after turning the mask right side out but before pleating it. You can hold it in place with another row of topstitching.
Click to expand...

Thanks,

I just sent that to my wife. I think I am going to ask her to sew a few. What would be cool if if someone would start sewing them in Camo.
 
cwbullet said:
Thanks,

I just sent that to my wife. I think I am going to ask her to sew a few. What would be cool if if someone would start sewing them in Camo.
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You can almost certainly get camo calico at any fabric store still open (Jo-Ann is online order but pick up in store).
 
cwbullet said:
What would be cool if if someone would start sewing them in Camo.
Click to expand...

YeeHaw!

Although maybe you nailed it. Some people we can guilt into wearing masks. Others, by adding camo, sequins, rhinestones, Gene Simmons tongue, or other colors or additions we can get to wear masks as a fashion statement.

Whatever works!
 
Went out today and saw a lot of different masks so good some bad a lot looked like a bunch of bank robbers. One thing I did see was a lot of people wearing the ski type face mask (covers mouth and nose only), my concern with these type masks are that they also insulate, trap moisture, and according to my training as a respiratory trainer this should invalidate or severely hamper the ability to protect once they are moisture saturated is my thinking correct?
 
rharshberger said:
Went out today and saw a lot of different masks so good some bad a lot looked like a bunch of bank robbers. One thing I did see was a lot of people wearing the ski type face mask (covers mouth and nose only), my concern with these type masks are that they also insulate, trap moisture, and according to my training as a respiratory trainer this should invalidate or severely hamper the ability to protect once they are moisture saturated is my thinking correct?
Click to expand...

It would render them less effective at protecting the user, but that is not the point. The point of wearing the mask to protect others. They still work for that.
 
I've heard about COVID-19 causing lung damage, but specifics are hard to come by. I'm in my early 60s and in excellent aerobic condition from being an avid competitive cyclist since my 30s. What is the the specific damage you're seeing to the lungs of those older but fit folks who otherwise recover from the virus, and how permanent is it? Thanks, bud.
Good skies,
GlueckAuf
 
GlueckAuf said:
I've heard about COVID-19 causing lung damage, but specifics are hard to come by. I'm in my early 60s and in excellent aerobic condition from being an avid competitive cyclist since my 30s. What is the the specific damage you're seeing to the lungs of those older but fit folks who otherwise recover from the virus, and how permanent is it? Thanks, bud.
Good skies,
GlueckAuf
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Those in their 30s are dying like flies. There is some confounding variable that is causing these deaths. Healthy or not you are at risk. https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200319/20-percent-of-us-covid-19-deaths-were-young-adults
 
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GlueckAuf said:
I've heard about COVID-19 causing lung damage, but specifics are hard to come by. I'm in my early 60s and in excellent aerobic condition from being an avid competitive cyclist since my 30s. What is the the specific damage you're seeing to the lungs of those older but fit folks who otherwise recover from the virus, and how permanent is it? Thanks, bud.
Good skies,
GlueckAuf
Click to expand...

That is a great question. The pathological findings are that the lings "exhibited edema, proteinaceous exudate, focal reactive hyperplasia of pneumocytes with patchy inflammatory cellular infiltration, and multinucleated giant cells". This statement means that they experiencing overwhelming inflammation in response to the virus. This response would inhibit oxygen transmission from the air to the blood and eventually death. It is the reason patients are experiencing acute respiratory distress syndrome or ARDS,

This response is not just in the elderly but it happens in the young too. The aerobic fitness you have, the better you can overcome the hyperplasia (thickening of the walls of the lungs) and inflammation. Smoking, COPD, Asthma, and Vaping all reduce your ability to respond.

Other studies have shown a "wide range of abnormal lung changes that spread rapidly from focused areas of excess fluid in one lung to diffuse buildup in both lungs" on CT. This is consistent with the information above.
 
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Speaknoevil said:
Those in their 30s are dying like flies. There is some confounding variable that is causing these deaths. Healthy or not you are at risk. https://www.webmd.com/lung/news/20200319/20-percent-of-us-covid-19-deaths-were-young-adults
Click to expand...

See post 742. Your statement is blatantly false. The quote is "unexpected 20% of deaths occurred among adults aged 20-64 years, and 20% of those hospitalized were aged 20-44 years". This does not equate to people in their 30s are dropping like flies. The percentage dying in their thirties of all causes is still exceptionally low. To date, there have been zero reported deaths from COVID from 15-24 and only 8 from 25-35.

Young people will die from COVID, but it will be something else that sets them up for death and COVID will be that extra bricks that causes the collapse.
 
cwbullet said:
See post 742. Your statement is blatantly false. The quote is "unexpected 20% of deaths occurred among adults aged 20-64 years, and 20% of those hospitalized were aged 20-44 years". This does not equate to people in their 30s are dropping like flies. The percentage dying in their thirties of all causes is still exceptionally low. To date, there have been zero reported deaths from COVID from 15-24 and only 8 from 25-35.

Young people will die from COVID, but it will be something else that sets them up for death and COVID will be that extra bricks that causes the collapse.
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WebMD reported falsely or mistakenly then. They have since changed their article per this statement: "Editor's note: An earlier version of this story misstated the age range for COVID-19 deaths. The headline of this story was corrected to read "20% of COVID-19 deaths were aged 20-64 years" and the text was adjusted to reflect the correct age range."
 
Dr. H,
Thanks so much for taking the time to research and respond to my question and the many others on these pages. You're a hero, as are the countless like you in the trenches. FIGHT TOUGH!
Good skies,
GlueckAuf
 
Speaknoevil said:
WebMD reported falsely or mistakenly then. They have since changed their article per this statement: "Editor's note: An earlier version of this story misstated the age range for COVID-19 deaths. The headline of this story was corrected to read "20% of COVID-19 deaths were aged 20-64 years" and the text was adjusted to reflect the correct age range."
Click to expand...

No, you are reading it incorrectly. You said, "30s are dying like flies". That is a direct quote from what you said and that would be incorrect. You are misrepresenting webMD. "20% of COVID-19 deaths were aged 20-64 years" does not mean that 20% of people in their 30s are dying. In fact, even if you go up to 44 years of age, only 42 deaths have happened below 44. Most of those were 40-44, but I will give you the benefit of doubt. That is only 3.6% of deaths. Hardly, is that dropping like flies. That statement is inflammatory and blatantly false.

It is hard to argue with the facts. CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/COVID19/index.htm
 
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cwbullet said:
No, you are reading it incorrectly. You said, "30s are dying like flies". That is a direct quote from what you said and that would be incorrect. You are misrepresenting webMD. "20% of COVID-19 deaths were aged 20-64 years" does not mean that 20% of people in their 30s are dying. In fact, even if you go up to 44 years of age, only 42 deaths have happened below 44. Most of those were 40-44, but I will give you the benefit of doubt. That is only 3.6% of deaths. Hardly, is that dropping like flies. That statement is inflammatory and blatantly false.

It is hard to argue with the facts.
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Chuck, the previous article version reported 20% of deaths in the 20-44 range (not 64) with 30 year olds squarely in the middle. I didn't say 20% of those dying were 30 year olds. As you state, only a small fraction of people under 45 are dying with C19. That was/is also my understanding. That is why the article surprised me. As it turns out, the article was false and WebMD redacted its previous version, which I referenced. Sorry I posted this incorrect information.
 
Speaknoevil said:
Chuck, the previous article version reported 20% of deaths in the 20-44 range (not 64) with 30 year olds squarely in the middle. I didn't say 20% of those dying were 30 year olds. As you state, only a small fraction of people under 45 are dying with C19. That was/is also my understanding. That is why the article surprised me. As it turns out, the article was false and WebMD redacted its previous version, which I referenced. Sorry I posted this incorrect information.
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WebMD is a decent site but they are not devoid of errors. I am just correcting the facts to avoid misunderstanding on the forum.

You implied it with "30s are dying like flies". I can tell you that under 40 is far less than 20%. It is less than 2% of the fatalities. In fact, less than 10% of people in their 30s require admission. Your quote "the previous article version reported 20% of deaths in the 20-44 range" is incorrect once again. 20% of admissions are 20-44 and over 90 percent are in 40-44 year group. Very few admission is under 40.

I would not argue with a guy that has the stats at his fingertips. A good source of stats in on the CDC page above.
 
cwbullet said:
WebMD is a decent site but they are not devoid of errors. I am just correcting the facts to avoid misunderstanding on the forum.

You implied it with "30s are dying like flies". I can tell you that under 40 is far less than 20%. It is less than 2% of the fatalities. In fact, less than 10% of people in their 30s require admission. Your quote "the previous article version reported 20% of deaths in the 20-44 range" is incorrect once again. 20% of admissions are 20-44 and over 90 percent are in 40-44 year group. Very few admission is under 40.

I would not argue with a guy that has the stats at his fingertips. A good source of stats in on the CDC page above.
Click to expand...
Chuck, again, I am sorry, you are right. I agree with your data. My post was based on incorrect information I thought was from a reliable source. In the future, I will attempt to let any web report to "soak" for a while so the publishers can correct their errors before referencing.
 
Speaknoevil said:
Chuck, again, I am sorry, you are right. I agree with your data. My post was based on incorrect information I thought was from a reliable source. In the future, I will attempt to let any web report to "soak" for a while so the publishers can correct their errors before referencing.
Click to expand...

No issue. I just did nto want to start a panic. 30-year-olds do not need to go to a cave today. They just need to stay home and protect others.
 
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