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If I don't locate a Sheri's Saturn 1b I figured Loc's larger Nike Zeus might be fun. Hopefully I don't get a bug up my @ss and go overboard with it.
Possibly My Next Project...
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On the LOC Nike Zeus I noticed there seems to be an absence of a third upper tier of fins. Are there variations without them?
There is a small third tier set of fins near the nose cone.
mikec
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Not that I'm aware of for either Nike Zeus B or Spartan. Nor is the nose cone shape very scale like. Don't expect to win a NAR scale competition with this. They probably had to reduce/eliminate the forward fins, and downsize the second set, for stability.
rharshberger
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There were two variants of the Nike Zeus, Zeus-A and Zeus-B. The Estes kit is a version of Zeus-B, the Zeus-A was derived from the Nike Hercules and shares its fin planform (sort of).
Zeus A was two stage, hence two sets of fins. Zeus B was three stage.
The Loc and Estes kits more closely resemble the Zeus EX, which evolved into the Spartan ABM.
The Loc and Estes kits more closely resemble the Zeus EX, which evolved into the Spartan ABM.
I've been looking at the LOC Nike X too. I think it is VERY cool and will most likely grab one in the very near future.
However, It isn't a scale Nike variant at all.It is actually more of an upscale of the Estes Nike X which is also "scale-like".
There was never an actual missile called Nike-X. Nike-X was the name given to the program to develop the advanced ABM defense system that became Sentinel and ultimately Safeguard.
The actual missiles developed over the course of the program were the Nike Zeus A, which looks like a souped up Hercules, but is quite a bit bigger (There is actually some question as to whether this initial version was ever officially called "Zeus" at all, though there is a film from that period showing the test flight that does refer to it as Zeus.). Like Kuririn said, it was two staged and, best as I can tell, was only flown once as a test of various program systems.
The Zeus B had a longer range and was three staged with three sets of fins. The first stage was actually the same as the Zeus A but everything north of that was new. The first stage was quite a bit bigger in diameter than the second stage, which was slightly bigger in diameter than the third stage.
The Zeus EX was an extended range version of Zeus B that was ultimately renamed Spartan when the program became known as Sentinel. The second stage was close to the same diameter as the booster and the forward fins were shaped a bit differently. The Nike-X model is closest to this variant, though it still lacks the transition between second and third stages and has bobbed front fins.
The Zeus/Spartan were to be the long range interceptors designed to do away with incoming warheads before they actually re-entered the atmosphere. Since it was assumed the some of the warheads could get past Spartan, there was a second missile developed to get the ones that made it through. It was called Sprint and was a cone shaped thing that was launched from a silo and accelerated at 100g (
) toward the target, reaching Mach 10 ( ) in just a few seconds and still in the relatively thick atmosphere.
Sorry to be so long winded here, just realized how much I had typed! The Nike-X/Sentinel/Safeguard system and it's missiles have been fascinating to me for years. I guess I got carried away...
Here are a few pics:
Zeus A
Zeus B
Zeus EX/Spartan
Sprint
However, It isn't a scale Nike variant at all.It is actually more of an upscale of the Estes Nike X which is also "scale-like".
There was never an actual missile called Nike-X. Nike-X was the name given to the program to develop the advanced ABM defense system that became Sentinel and ultimately Safeguard.
The actual missiles developed over the course of the program were the Nike Zeus A, which looks like a souped up Hercules, but is quite a bit bigger (There is actually some question as to whether this initial version was ever officially called "Zeus" at all, though there is a film from that period showing the test flight that does refer to it as Zeus.). Like Kuririn said, it was two staged and, best as I can tell, was only flown once as a test of various program systems.
The Zeus B had a longer range and was three staged with three sets of fins. The first stage was actually the same as the Zeus A but everything north of that was new. The first stage was quite a bit bigger in diameter than the second stage, which was slightly bigger in diameter than the third stage.
The Zeus EX was an extended range version of Zeus B that was ultimately renamed Spartan when the program became known as Sentinel. The second stage was close to the same diameter as the booster and the forward fins were shaped a bit differently. The Nike-X model is closest to this variant, though it still lacks the transition between second and third stages and has bobbed front fins.
The Zeus/Spartan were to be the long range interceptors designed to do away with incoming warheads before they actually re-entered the atmosphere. Since it was assumed the some of the warheads could get past Spartan, there was a second missile developed to get the ones that made it through. It was called Sprint and was a cone shaped thing that was launched from a silo and accelerated at 100g (
) toward the target, reaching Mach 10 ( ) in just a few seconds and still in the relatively thick atmosphere.Sorry to be so long winded here, just realized how much I had typed!
The Nike-X/Sentinel/Safeguard system and it's missiles have been fascinating to me for years. I guess I got carried away...Here are a few pics:
Zeus A
Zeus B
Zeus EX/Spartan
Sprint
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Thank you! Yup, it's really a Heinz 57, squint eyed from 50 yards variant.
You're welcome! It is somewhat rare that any of the geeky info I have collected over the years is actually of some use!
Like I said, I am planning to grab one of these myself and I am kind of planning to go at least a little overboard with it.
I downloaded the OR file from the LOC website and started playing with it a bit. I found that if you add a 3"-3.9" transition, a short piece of 3" tubing and a 3" nose cone to your LOC order, and cut the four new fins, you can get perilously close to building a Spartan. So far nothing has been measured, it's all just TLAR, but I have decided that mine will be built this way. How crazy I get about actual measurements remains to be seen!
So far the mods are limited to adding the transition, tube and new nose, new forward fins (shape and size eyeballed) and moving the middle fins forward several inches. 16 oz. of ballast in the nose got it to 1 caliber stability with a J745
Here is the modified OR file in case you are interested:
Like I said, I am planning to grab one of these myself and I am kind of planning to go at least a little overboard with it.
I downloaded the OR file from the LOC website and started playing with it a bit. I found that if you add a 3"-3.9" transition, a short piece of 3" tubing and a 3" nose cone to your LOC order, and cut the four new fins, you can get perilously close to building a Spartan. So far nothing has been measured, it's all just TLAR, but I have decided that mine will be built this way. How crazy I get about actual measurements remains to be seen!
So far the mods are limited to adding the transition, tube and new nose, new forward fins (shape and size eyeballed) and moving the middle fins forward several inches. 16 oz. of ballast in the nose got it to 1 caliber stability with a J745
Here is the modified OR file in case you are interested:
Hey Mugs914 I like your OR file. I just finished assembling a LOC NIKE ZEUS. Had a thought, from your pic of the ZEUS B it looks like the fins at the nose are quite thick. Poke a couple 1/4" dowels thru the nose and drill and mount the fins to them so they can pivot. I've been planning to try that sometime but your rocket would be perfect for it. Course maybe it has been tried and doesn't work.
From the Apogee website. Description of the Cosmodrome Rocketry Black Brant VC:
"Another reason this is a complex rocket is that the forward fins pivot. This is a new construction technique for most modelers, and it requires building an internal structure inside the tube to allow the fins to rotate."
I read that it also helps stability.
rharshberger
Well-Known Member
The Zeus A evidentally was flown at least 3 times possibly 4 according to a source I read a couple of days ago,iirc it was a 1950's issue of Aviation Week someone shared.
I've been looking at the LOC Nike X too. I think it is VERY cool and will most likely grab one in the very near future.
However, It isn't a scale Nike variant at all.It is actually more of an upscale of the Estes Nike X which is also "scale-like".
There was never an actual missile called Nike-X. Nike-X was the name given to the program to develop the advanced ABM defense system that became Sentinel and ultimately Safeguard.
The actual missiles developed over the course of the program were the Nike Zeus A, which looks like a souped up Hercules, but is quite a bit bigger (There is actually some question as to whether this initial version was ever officially called "Zeus" at all, though there is a film from that period showing the test flight that does refer to it as Zeus.). Like Kuririn said, it was two staged and, best as I can tell, was only flown once as a test of various program systems.
The Zeus B had a longer range and was three staged with three sets of fins. The first stage was actually the same as the Zeus A but everything north of that was new. The first stage was quite a bit bigger in diameter than the second stage, which was slightly bigger in diameter than the third stage.
The Zeus EX was an extended range version of Zeus B that was ultimately renamed Spartan when the program became known as Sentinel. The second stage was close to the same diameter as the booster and the forward fins were shaped a bit differently. The Nike-X model is closest to this variant, though it still lacks the transition between second and third stages and has bobbed front fins.
The Zeus/Spartan were to be the long range interceptors designed to do away with incoming warheads before they actually re-entered the atmosphere. Since it was assumed the some of the warheads could get past Spartan, there was a second missile developed to get the ones that made it through. It was called Sprint and was a cone shaped thing that was launched from a silo and accelerated at 100g (
Sorry to be so long winded here, just realized how much I had typed!
Here are a few pics:
Zeus A
View attachment 397430
Zeus B
View attachment 397435
Zeus EX/Spartan
View attachment 397432
Sprint
View attachment 397433
That is interesting, thanks for the info! Was it in one of the AW issues linked in the in the other thread?
This thing really is a mystery bird, it's fun to see all the "new" info that folks are unearthing!
This thing really is a mystery bird, it's fun to see all the "new" info that folks are unearthing!
Thanks 58! I'm pretty sure a LOC 4" Nike X kit is heading my way (I have been dropping hints in a somewhat less than subtle manner for a little while now!). It will be built "Spartan-ized" like the OR file.
As for the pivoting forward fins, I haven't ever tried it, though others have with good results. I may try it on the big Spartan, but I did the OR sims with fixed forward fins. I figure if it is stable in the first place there will be an even greater margin with pivoting fins.
What did you think of the LOC Nike you built? Anything to look out for? Would you be willing to post some pics?
Hi Mugs. It is a nice kit, the only issue I had was it came with a black nose cone Any scratches after painting would show up big time so I am going to use a white cone I have. It is a couple inches longer but I'm not a purist.No pictures yet I have just started spraying primer. It comes as a payloader and I changed it to dual deploy. Am also using an idea from John Cokers website to add Apogees Simple Tracker to my nose cones.
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Ordered my 4 inch Zeus just awhile ago.
