AltusMetrum Launch system

OK, I am not trying to co-opt this thread, but I've been asked a direct question on this thread: How much for a Wilson F/X 64-pad wireless system?

8x PBU-8w $650 each $5200 8-pad pad-boxes with 64x igniter leads 30' long each, included
1x LCU-64 Free when you buy 8x PBU-8w units
1x WRU-c the wireless unit for the controller - also Free when you buy 8x PBU-8w units .
Sub total $5200

You will need to purchase 9x SLA batteries to power the 9 units of your all wireless launch system. These cost $15 each for a total of $135.

And the system will come with 9x 12 gal. hinged lid storage containers for the pad-boxes, igniter leads, and the controller and its wireless unit at no extra charge. Normally cost about $12 each.

So the grand total from WFX will be $5200 plus shipping. And that's the price that anybody gets if and when they purchase this large of a system.
I don't sell batteries, but I do use them so that's how I know they cost about $15 each for a 7 Ah SLA battery.

Brad

RocketRev said:

OK, I am not trying to co-opt this thread, but I've been asked a direct question on this thread: How much for a Wilson F/X 64-pad wireless system?

8x PBU-8w $650 each $5200 8-pad pad-boxes with 64x igniter leads 30' long each, included
1x LCU-64 Free when you buy 8x PBU-8w units
1x WRU-c the wireless unit for the controller - also Free when you buy 8x PBU-8w units .
Sub total $5200

You will need to purchase 9x SLA batteries to power the 9 units of your all wireless launch system. These cost $15 each for a total of $135.

And the system will come with 9x 12 gal. hinged lid storage containers for the pad-boxes, igniter leads, and the controller and its wireless unit at no extra charge. Normally cost about $12 each.

So the grand total from WFX will be $5200 plus shipping. And that's the price that anybody gets if and when they purchase this large of a system.
I don't sell batteries, but I do use them so that's how I know they cost about $15 each for a 7 Ah SLA battery.

Brad

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Thanks for the quick response Brad, IMO the cost difference really is not that extreme. Both systems are made and sold by vendors with good reputations so really it would come down to asthetics, cost, and personal preference.

DaveW6DPS said:

APRS tracker on high altitude balloons do have control operators, as do APRS systems on rockets.

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Where? Where is the control point?

UhClem said:

Where? Where is the control point?

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The control operator is the person responsible for the operation of the transmitter.
If the control operator can prevent ‘non-control operators’ including unlicensed individuals from ‘controlling’ the tracker, the tracker is well within the rules.

Fortunately, the required license is "no code", eliminating the need to learn Morse Code.

RocketRev said:

And you apparently didn't read thru the whole thread about the Armageddon Switch. It no longer even exists in a single-pad controller. There is no individual out there who has one. What is there to fear? So if what you fear no longer exists as of 4 years ago, then what makes this system more trustworthy than a system that is just as trustworthy?

Brad

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Brad,

I see that it is still listed on your website . . . ( Note : The date says February 23, 2019 )

https://wilsonfx.com/2019/02/23/lcu-1-arm-multi-funciont-single-pad-controller

Dave F.

Hello Dave,

After almost a decade, my web guy is finally doing a rebuild of my website. The major background picture is from a local BSA 100th anniversary launch in 2010. I'm a tech guy, not a web guy. And yes, what's on there now is WAY out of date, but I am finally getting him to get the job done.

For the last 9 years, my web guy has been busy producing and raising four of my 6 grandkids, so I must admit that I haven't been too hard on him. I love my grandkids.

But I am working hard with my son on getting the website up to date. This will proceed with as much speed as possible.

Brad

RocketRev said:

Hello Dave,

After almost a decade, my web guy is finally doing a rebuild of my website. The major background picture is from a local BSA 100th anniversary launch in 2010. I'm a tech guy, not a web guy. And yes, what's on there now is WAY out of date, but I am finally getting him to get the job done.

For the last 9 years, my web guy has been busy producing and raising four of my 6 grandkids, so I must admit that I haven't been too hard on him. I love my grandkids.

But I am working hard with my son on getting the website up to date. This will proceed with as much speed as possible.

Brad

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Brad,

I have nothing but respect for you, as a person, after seeing the "Rocket Reverend" segment on "The Rocketry Challenge, back in 2006. Your interaction with the kids was incredible and a tribute to your character and your faith, which I also share.

My concerns originated only from a standpoint of safety, not personal bias against either your systems or those of your main competitor, Altus Metrum.

I now believe that you have done everything in your power to make your systems as safe as possible. It is regrettable that an incident occurred, but a blessing that no one was injured, resulting in a wake-up call to which you have responded to in a very professional, caring, and self-sacrificing manner. Kudos to you , sir !

Respectfully,

Dave F.

Way too expensive. But as far as wireless systems go, I have used one I made out of an old garage door opener. A Genie Intellicode. However, it was not completely wireless. I had a 20' cable going from the launch pad to the battery/receiver, so that even if it were triggered by stray radio signals, I would be 20' away from the rocket when I made the power connections. I could then walk 150' or more from the rocket and use the remote to launch it so I could get a better view of the launch. But this setup is insanely expensive. To me, model rocketry is a hobby, and that means building everything myself, including all launch equipment and designing my own rockets. My launch site is so remote that it takes a lifted Jeep to get to it, so it's pretty safe.

Big-Bob said:

Way too expensive. But as far as wireless systems go, I have used one I made out of an old garage door opener. A Genie Intellicode. However, it was not completely wireless. I had a 20' cable going from the launch pad to the battery/receiver, so that even if it were triggered by stray radio signals, I would be 20' away from the rocket when I made the power connections. I could then walk 150' or more from the rocket and use the remote to launch it so I could get a better view of the launch. But this setup is insanely expensive. To me, model rocketry is a hobby, and that means building everything myself, including all launch equipment and designing my own rockets. My launch site is so remote that it takes a lifted Jeep to get to it, so it's pretty safe.

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20 feet from anything greater than a G is way too close. This is not that expensive for a quality system.

Sorry I guess I forgot to mention I don't use anything larger than a D. I do use clustering and multi staging. The garage door system requires a specific code be transmitted along with the radio signal. I cannot afford to get into mid power rocketry, so I try to make low power as interesting as I can by building and designing everything myself. Safety is a primary concern. Since I design my own rockets, there is no way to be absolutely sure they will function properly without testing them. That is why I use a remote launch site that is at least 2 miles from anyone else, just in case. And I do use only commercially available model rocket parts. Cardboard, plastic, and balsa wood. No metal.

Big-Bob said:

Sorry I guess I forgot to mention I don't use anything larger than a D. I do use clustering and multi staging. The garage door system requires a specific code be transmitted along with the radio signal. I cannot afford to get into mid power rocketry, so I try to make low power as interesting as I can by building and designing everything myself. Safety is a primary concern. Since I design my own rockets, there is no way to be absolutely sure they will function properly without testing them. That is why I use a remote launch site that is at least 2 miles from anyone else, just in case. And I do use only commercially available model rocket parts. Cardboard, plastic, and balsa wood. No metal.

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Then why are you concerned about a high power launch system is expensive. You can launch with just about any wireless launch system. You can make your own for less than $50.

The bottom line: Using this launch system to launch low powder motors only is like using a bazooka to kill a mosquito.

Uh, I did make my own for less than $50. I don't need a high power launch system. I just stumbled onto this thread and saw the cost of that setup. I spend about $100 a month on model rocketry, not including the gas it takes to get to and from my launch site. It seems we may have a misunderstanding here. Sorry about that. I don't want to get into an argument. I just want to enjoy model rocketry on my budget.

Big-Bob said:

Uh, I did make my own for less than $50. I don't need a high power launch system. I just stumbled onto this thread and saw the cost of that setup. I spend about $100 a month on model rocketry, not including the gas it takes to get to and from my launch site. It seems we may have a misunderstanding here. Sorry about that. I don't want to get into an argument. I just want to enjoy model rocketry on my budget.

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No big deal. I edit my response. The high power systems are much more capable than you need.

Ez2cDave said:

Brad,

I have nothing but respect for you, as a person, after seeing the "Rocket Reverend" segment on "The Rocketry Challenge, back in 2006. Your interaction with the kids was incredible and a tribute to your character and your faith, which I also share.

My concerns originated only from a standpoint of safety, not personal bias against either your systems or those of your main competitor, Altus Metrum.

I now believe that you have done everything in your power to make your systems as safe as possible. It is regrettable that an incident occurred, but a blessing that no one was injured, resulting in a wake-up call to which you have responded to in a very professional, caring, and self-sacrificing manner. Kudos to you , sir !

Respectfully,

Dave F.

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Hello Dave,

Thanks for your well considered words. I did and still do, enjoy working with children. I've done multiple dozens of "build-it/fly-it events" with churches, schools, scout troops (BSA and GSA), 4-H, Awanas, and a few others that nobody on this forum's ever heard of I'm sure. Lots of fun. I've wanted to be a part of the TARC finals since its inception, but they keep holding it on MOTHER'S DAY weekend and I can't be gone from church on Mother's Day. This year they finally moved it off Mother's Day but I couldn't go because that was the weekend of my daughter's wedding. I'd have been shot if I missed that. I've also been invited to join the ESRA group doing the America's Cup launch at Spaceport America for the last three years. They bought a 32-pad wfx wireless system. But I can't go because every year its the same week as a church camp I've been counseling with for the last 38 years. I have the children of kids (now grown up) I counseled way back then, coming to camp these days. So cool!

I am also in FULL agreement with you and standing right along side you when you say that your concern is only from a standpoint of safety. I am certain that the folks who have designed and built the TeleLaunch System are every bit as concerned for safety and you and I. Yes, TeleLaunch is obviously the main competitor with Wilson F/X. But my only response to them is, "Welcome to the Marketplace." And I will admit that I do hope to see one of their systems up-close and in-use one of these days.

It is always regrettable when a "situation" occurs and I like you, am very thankful that nobody was hurt. And you are also right, that WFX has done everything that we can to encourage safety. And as I said earlier, it was only the growth of our product's scope that caused the problems that we had to find solutions for over the years. Our encrypted wireless units which are unique to each club's system, will eliminate the vast majority of other problems that may arise from wireless problems. And I can only assume that if problems arise with the TeleLaunch system that they too will step up and get things fixed ASAP. That's the only way to stay in business for the long run.

Can anybody foresee all problems? (I mean besides God.) Of course not, but the longer a product is in the hands of users, the less likely it will be that "new" problems will be found. That's the nature of our hobby from pads, launch systems, motors, kits, parachutes, igniters.... I mean lighters, etcetera. Theory is great, but it is the real world in which we fly our rockets.

Remember, there's no such thing as a free launch!

Brad, the "Rocket Rev.," Wilson

I bow to "God" and all rocket theological beings...

cwbullet said:

20 feet from anything greater than a G is way too close. This is not that expensive for a quality system.

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20ft is not enough to be safe, but it makes a very significant difference when something goes wrong. That's why I always, like Big-Bob, disconnect the igniter cables on the remote box before connecting the igniter, and reconnect them at the latest possible time before leaving the pad area.
Should something go wrong, rapid unscheduled loss of body mass might be experienced, but 20ft of distance can lessen that from the traumatic variant to the excretionary one.

Reinhard

Speaknoevil said:

I bow to "God" and all rocket theological beings...

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I only bow to God / Trinity . . . There are no other theological beings.

Now, before things "get religious" on the thread, my comments in this area are done.

Dave F.