Level 1 w/ Estes Panavia

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FlyBy01

FlyBy01

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I am finally home after a long business trip and get to start my level 1 journey. I am modding and building this kit for a level 1 Certification. The following items will NOT be used from the kit and my thoughts on why:
  • Launch Lugs
    • I would rather use more robust delrin rail buttons.
  • Shock Cord
    • I have opted for Kevlar
  • Estes Shock Cord retainer (White Cardboard)
    • I feel a screw bolt with Epoxy is better (probably over kill on my part)
  • The Estes Safety Sheet (Read Why Before you comment)
    • I am going with the NAR High Power Rocketry Safety of 100 ft.
    • In short I am using a bigger motor and am increasing standoff due to the increased risk
31294041918_4bea08deb6_b.jpg

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You'll actually love it. I did my L1 on a Scion with a single use H115 DM (gotta love the sparkies) and it was a picture perfect flight/recovery to 1800 and change. Estes PSII kits were great for the money and versatility they offered. Could be built light enough to fly on relatively cheap bp motors yet still strong enough to handle some decent reloads. Best of luck and enjoy the process!
 
I also see red x-es.

I wasn't aware of this kit; may have to grab one. Looks like it's the same tubing and nose cone as the Partizon, which is what I used for my L1, and have since flown several times on small H and big G motors.

Build it strong; I used epoxy (yes, probably overkill), a Kevlar shock cord anchored to the MMT, Acme rail guides, and built it to separate in the middle rather than at the nose.

And, have fun!
 
Here is a scenario I see too often in level one attempts. If you avoid it, you will do well.
  • Flier does a fantastic build on the rocket.
  • Flier does a great finish on the rocket.
  • Flier buys a cert motor that will go to about 3000'.
  • Flier shows up on a windy launch day with "go fever," and launches to 3000'.
  • Flier successfully gets main chute deployment at 3000'.
  • Flier watches the rocket drift away under the main chute for over two minutes.
  • Flier never finds the rocket.
Use Chute Release, DD, GPS, or a low altitude motor. Good luck!
 
Okay, I can see the pics now. Looks just like a Partizon, but with different shape to the fins. Build it strong and it will be a great flyer.

WRT the Chute Release: as I mentioned in another thread, if you've never used it before, I'd strongly recommend you fly it (the CR) at least once before the certification attempt, so you can get the "hang" of packing it, how it behaves, where to set it to release, etc. Probably not a bad idea to fly the rocket once as well...
 
Yay, PSII builder! Soon they will be a thing of the past. The Panavia is basically 2/3 of a Partizon with Argent fins.
Built solid it will easily take a small H (woodglue is quite sufficient on these since the tubes will crush and fins will flutter before the joints)

What I do with these Mid to high conversions is install both rail buttons and lugs, so I can fly them on midpower motors more easily (I don't have a rail pad)
 
Should be fine, it'll go high, so the chute release is a good idea. With the high power motors having a bit more BP and being a bit closer to the chute than hobbyline motors, a nomex chute protector is also a good idea. I put eye bolts and Kevlar in all my Pro Series kits and Level 1'd on one (3-tube Leviathan) as well. It'll do fine.
 
Looking forward to following your posts. I am about to start an Estes Mega Der Red Max Build for a L1 attempt. I have found a few stories of builds for the Max, but looking for more good practices to incorporate.
 
Panavia shows “out of stock” on Estes website but the Sahara is still available. IIRC from several conversations on several forums one big factor in Estes dropping the PSII builder kits like Leviathan and Mega Der Red Max is that the plywood they used wasn’t compatible with California consumer products safety regs. The Star Orbiter and new Super Big Bertha are the path that PSII builder kits will take since they build out light enough to fly on both full-size 24mm and 29mm Estes BP motors. My yet to fly SBB weighs in under 11 oz with my sorta heavy building and finishing techniques.
 
Scott_650 said:
Panavia shows “out of stock” on Estes website but the Sahara is still available. IIRC from several conversations on several forums one big factor in Estes dropping the PSII builder kits like Leviathan and Mega Der Red Max is that the plywood they used wasn’t compatible with California consumer products safety regs. The Star Orbiter and new Super Big Bertha are the path that PSII builder kits will take since they build out light enough to fly on both full-size 24mm and 29mm Estes BP motors. My yet to fly SBB weighs in under 11 oz with my sorta heavy building and finishing techniques.
Click to expand...
Wow. Estes had them showing in-stock Sunday afternoon; guess I should have followed through on my early thought to pick some up.
 
Check back....when they show "out of stock" that just means there aren't any over in the warehouse in the area where they pack and ship orders directly from Penrose. It doesn't mean that they're gone forever....necessarily.
 
I will post some build pictures soon. Looks like Estes has pulled this one from production. The Sahara is the only Pro Series II builder kit remaining. [emoji31]
 
FlyBy01 said:
I will post some build pictures soon. Looks like Estes has pulled this one from production. The Sahara is the only Pro Series II builder kit remaining. [emoji31]
Click to expand...

Truth

Scion, Panavia, and Sahara were essentially PSII SPEVs (spare part elimination vehicles). When they gone, they gone
 
Still have the Star Orbiter and Super Big Bertha kits available - if there are going to be more 29mm builder kits I think this is the likely way Estes will go - flyable on both 29mm BP motors and “full-size” 24mm BP motors too. We’ll see!
 
The BT80 airframe is fine, we just need a better selection of nose cones to go with it. iirc we only have the PNC-80K and PNC-80BB from Estes and BMS might offer another one or so plus BMS's BT80Heavy wall offerings.
 
Scott_650 said:
Still have the Star Orbiter and Super Big Bertha kits available - if there are going to be more 29mm builder kits I think this is the likely way Estes will go - flyable on both 29mm BP motors and “full-size” 24mm BP motors too. We’ll see!
Click to expand...
Those two kits have balsa wood fins. In the Rocketry Show Podcast Estes said they had trouble getting hardwood fins. I think this is just a business decision by Estes.
 
FlyBy01 said:
Those two kits have balsa wood fins. In the Rocketry Show Podcast Estes said they had trouble getting hardwood fins. I think this is just a business decision by Estes.
Click to expand...
IIRC the plywood from Estes supplier didn’t meet California consumer product safety standards so they switched to balsa - though the laminated style fins on my SBB seem plenty strong, not being a HPR guy I have no idea how they’d hold up to H and higher motors. As neat as the PSII builder kits were I guess it didn’t make sense for Estes to provide kits for other manufacturers motors.
 
Scott_650 said:
IIRC the plywood from Estes supplier didn’t meet California consumer product safety standards so they switched to balsa - though the laminated style fins on my SBB seem plenty strong, not being a HPR guy I have no idea how they’d hold up to H and higher motors. As neat as the PSII builder kits were I guess it didn’t make sense for Estes to provide kits for other manufacturers motors.
Click to expand...
I'll let you know in December how the fins hold up to an H motor. [emoji89]
 

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