Dodge Caravan Transmission

Okay, I'm way-way behind the times.

Yesterday my wife called me at work to tell me something was wrong with the auto transmission on our Caravan. It kept wanting to downshift on it's own, revved up to 5,000rpm, and wouldn't go out of 3rd.

So I go to the transmission shop thinking about the thousands of dollars we're about to dole out. They older gentlemen tells me that it's probably something to do with the computer that monitors the transmission, and not to sweat yet - no need to worry just yt.

Computers monitoring the transmission? Automatic transmission computer electronics.

Heck, the last time I ever saw a transmission is when I had to rip one down and repair it, back in high school. So when did computers and electronics hit the transmission area?

This can't be good. I'm seeing next year's vacation being spent in our backyard in a tent.

Dodge? I'm not surprised.

American cars are junk. If you want something reliable thats going to last, get a japenese car like a Toyota or Honda.

Unlike a manufacturer like Honda or Toyota, who completely redesigns its cars every 4-5 years, US cars are still based on antiquated agricultural technology thats been around for decades. Most american cars, they only update the exterior not the interior. Just look at the Cavalier. Its been on the same J body platform for almost 30 years now.

And just look at these new concept cars the big 3 are putting out. Everytime i see one of those cars, i cringe.

I can't remember who made the MPV, Toyota, I think, but I had my Chevy in at an AAMCO transmission shop for a $450 r&r and the owner told me that a MPV transmission took 40 hours to rebuild! I didn't even bother to ask how much THAT would cost

Dang Troy...
Aren't you about up for a stint of good luck?

It's been a few years since we had ours, but we had a Caravan too.

Had one episode where a pulley bracket retaining bolt broke on the front of the engine block...and they claimed it was not covered under warranty.

We bought it used, and it was in pretty good shape when we bought it. But I kept getting comments from everyone about getting rid of it before it hit 100K and I just couldn't figure out how a car could last for 100K miles and somehow know when to fall apart after that.

Well, ours hit 101K and the transmission broke three ways at once. It was leaking, and even when filled up some other part was locked up and the top gears were not functional and I forget now what the third one was.

Was never happier to be rid of a car. I'll walk before I ever own another chrysler product.

I like manual trannys - they shift exactly when I want them to! I put over 130K on a Chevy, 2 Fords over 110K and am on my 2nd Subaru with 100K+ and have never had a transmission issue with any of them.

I had an '89 Caravan back in my navy days. Yes, the transmission went out much like you described. I had the 3.0L Mitsubishi engine so the valve guides leaked and the engine smoked. My wife traded it in while I was in Guam and was happy to get $500 in trade.

YMMV.

Troy,
I had a Grand Caravan and had the exact same thing happen at about 70K. If I recall, it was a $250 electrical module in the trans that went out and had to be replaced. I got mine for free because the dealer test drove the van and hit a skunk.........not only did they do the work for free, but super detailed the van and gave me a gift certificate to my favorite resturant.
I (we) loved our Dodge. Put about 120K with probably less than $2K in repairs other than normal maintenance.
Now I'm one of those "right winged ozone burning jungle deforesting spotted owl killers" who drives a Yukon XL......and loves it!irate:


v/r
Jerry

We had a Grand Caravan two minivans ago. The transmission was fine but it had lots of other problems. We spent nearly a thousand dollars trying to repair the AC and it still didn't work. It was leaking in places that it shouldn't and at one point (when the kids were all small and in car seats) my wife called me from downtown (Akron, OH) because the sliding door fell off (almost). She sort of got it back on, tied it with bungees and string and drove slow to her parents house just outside town where I met her and fixed it. We replaced it with a Mazda MPV that we ran to well over 200K and hardly repaired or replaced anything except brakes and tires.

We didn't even try to sell the Dodge. We had friends who had the same van with similar problems but he was a mechanic for the city bus garage so we GAVE him our old one so he could have two and keep one of them running.

Our next van was a Chevy Venture which we liked so well we got a second one two years later when I sold my truck. They're good but not nearly as maintenance free as the Mazda. Alas, there are no Mazda dealers for 100 miles (and Madza vans are too small).

Troy

I've had lots of problems with the AC, brakes, and almost anything that holds fluids, but with my 5 minivans the trannies have been the best parts in the car. The first 4-speeds in the mid-90s had some computer issues but these were straightened out by the late-90s.

Our '86 Voyager 3-speed auto that we sold to a friend at 175K for $500 died after 325K miles, my '92 Caravan 3-speed auto has over 180K miles, my wife's 5-speed stick went well over 200K before we traded it for my wife's/daughters/friends old 2000 Grand Caravan 4-speed auto which now has over 200K, and my 2001 4-speed auto T&C has 160K and is still going strong.

Bob

Honda Odyssey- never a repair in the 5 years we've owned it- even use it for pulling a camper. Our Honda Civic is 13 yrs old with 160K miles and has only needed mufflers and tires and struts. My old Accord that I sold 5 years ago had 200K+ miles and same situation.

I grew up with my parents buying and fixing Fords and Chevy's and told myself I'd never put up with their quality. My Dad's 1975 Ford Grenada even had an extra jack thrown under the carpeting (carpeted over it!) as a result of a disgruntled auto worker. That told me all I needed to know about buying anything from Detroit. I realize most 'foreign' cars use plenty of US parts & labor, but are still overall way better in repairs.

It's very possible that it is the computer. Take it down for a diagnostic. They can tell in 5 minutes by the code it throws out.

I have a Dodge Intrepid. Its a 95, but I love it. It had some big time stalling problems. Like every other light it would stall out, and not start for like 5 minutes. I figured it was a clogged fuel line or filter. But before I went and did all of that work replacing the line, I took it down to my local Pep Boys just to see.

It was a bad sensor. Some sensor I had never heard of before. Took then 5 minutes to diagnose it, and 5 minutes to replace it. Best 200 bucks I ever spent. (The sensor was 150 bucks)

The cars these days are really strange. Not like they used to be. Used to be bad tranny meant taking the whole thing out and replacing it. I've had many a tranny resting on my chest in my time.

..Pat Butler said:

Honda Odyssey- never a repair in the 5 years we've owned it- even use it for pulling a camper. Our Honda Civic is 13 yrs old with 160K miles and has only needed mufflers and tires and struts. My old Accord that I sold 5 years ago had 200K+ miles and same situation.

I grew up with my parents buying and fixing Fords and Chevy's and told myself I'd never put up with their quality. My Dad's 1975 Ford Grenada even had an extra jack thrown under the carpeting (carpeted over it!) as a result of a disgruntled auto worker. That told me all I needed to know about buying anything from Detroit. I realize most 'foreign' cars use plenty of US parts & labor, but are still overall way better in repairs.

Click to expand...

Yep, i've had (3) Hondas in my life, all three cars i put over 200k miles in and the only thing i had to replace, besides normal wear and tear like brakes, was the timing belt which was standard maintanence. And i drove those cars into the ground. They were also manual, and even with 200k, i never had to once replace the clutch on those cars.

Before that, I had a chevy and ford which were nothing but problems, problems, problems . . .

Yup, we took it in yesterday to the Transmission place for diagnostics. They couldn't determine yet what it was all about. Said it looked liked like the transmission electronics module, but there was another fault code (Code B) that only the dealer can reset.

I'm at a loss to these things, even with my dad being a (airline) mechanic who was always tinkering with cars. However, even now he's stated that it's too much effort to fix the newer cars. They're not home mechanic friendly.

Hmm.
I've had american since 1988. Fords and Chevy's. Not much to say. I've had over 150K on many of them. Some I bought new, some used. Never had much trouble. My wifes Suburban just had a new Transmission put in at 120k, We could have gone with a $900 fix, but as we will keep the car for at least another 3-4 years we just had the whole thing rebuilt.

I notice that Toyota and Honda owners always say they have no problems, but they have just as large a service department, and it is always just as full as the Ford and Chevy dealers. I have friends that have Toyotas and Hondas, They keep telling me how great the cars are but they seem to be at the shop just as much.

I think a lot is just perception. Most Mazdas are built in the US at Ford plants, but the Mazda version always gets better quality scores. Same with the Toyota Matrix. Same car as the Pontiac Vibe, built by the same workers.

As for Japanese companies redesigning cars more often. Not really everyone works on a 2-4-6-8 schedule. 2 years a cosmetic update, 4 years a minor mechanical update, 6 years a cosmetic/mechanical tweek, 8 years an all new design. It costs so much to bring a new car to market, $5-10 billion last I checked, that an all new design is never a clean slate. There is always carry over from the old design.

Mark

It really isn't a matter of "too much effort", but different tools and a different skill set. In many cases, the car itself will tell you what's wrong, if you have the ability to read and interpret the fault codes stored in the onboard computer.

Every car sold after 1996(?) has a standardized connector under the dashboard for diagnostics, and you can buy a basic "code reader" to plug into it for well under $100. Most vehicles also have a way to retrieve the codes WITHOUT a separate code reader. For a Chrysler, you turn the ignition OFF-ON-OFF-ON--OFF-ON rapidly (within 5 seconds), and the trouble code will come up on the digital odometer display. The big advantage of the separate code reader is that you gain the ability to clear fault codes from the memory, and turn off the "check engine" light. Once you have the code, there are lots of places online that will translate them into english for you, like this one:

https://www.engine-light-help.com

In the last 6 months, I've repaired problems on my wife's car and my own with the help of one of these things. And one of the problems would have been a royal PITA to find any other way.

My car (Chrysler PT Cruiser) was idling very rough after a cold start, but would run normally once warmed up. A check with the scanner pulled a "P0135" code, which indicated a faulty oxygen sensor. $75 and 45 minutes to replace it myself saved big $$$ at a repair shop, not to mention the hassle of not having the car for a day or 2 while it is in the shop.

My wife's car (Geo Metro) started showing the "check engine" light, but there was no apparent problem. The scanner pulled a "P0455" code, which indicates "major leak in evaporative emissions system". Sounds serious, but it translates as a loose gas cap. Tighten the cap, and clear the code--problem fixed at NO cost.

Unfortunately, problems with systems other than the engine (including the transmission) often require specialized, manufacturer-specific code readers to figure out what's wrong. The only reason that we have an industry-wide standard for the engine codes and the diagnostic connector (OBD-II) is that it was forced on the industry by the EPA to make emissions diagnosis easier.

I wish this would have come up last week. I just paid $60 to my dealer to turn off a check engine light.


The gas cap was missing.


I knew THAT, but just hadn't had time to get to Autozone for a new one. I wanted the engine light checked because I had a long drive this week for work. If I was a little faster, I would have connected the dots before I spent the money.

Mutter, mutter, grumble, grumble...

Oh well.

Necromancer said:

Dodge? I'm not surprised.

American cars are junk.

Click to expand...

Careful! https://www.rocketryforum.com/showpost.php?p=595322&postcount=1

FWIW - We currently have a Grand Caravan that has 120K on it and it is doing just fine. This is our second one. The first one had the transmission go out at 100K and we got a remanufactured installed for $2000. It ran another 80K until a pickup truck smashed into it.

NECROMANCER-I have owned several (5) cavailiers and the only one that did not run at least 300K was the one that I hit a cow with (black angus at night). The cavalier is one of the most durable small cars ever made. I figure that is why Chevy quit making them, they were lasting too long.

Just my 0.02.

I got my 97 Dodge Stratus in 2002. It had about 80,000 miles on it. Now I am approaching 180,000. Never had a major issue.

AK:

Yes, there are a myriad of sensors in the drive train that can effect transmission shift. Part of the efficiency movement, choosing the perfect shift point for different driving conditions. I had a major fault in my wiring harness that pretty much toasted the whole thing. The car wouldn't shift correctly because half the computer stuff was shorted out and reverted to failsafe settings.

And proprietary codes are now a way of life. Just went through the same thing with my Camry. Dobbs could read the EGR sensor code, but there was another that they could not read. Turned out to be a miscellaneous vacuum switch in the emissions system. A trip to the dealer and $600 later I pass the State emissions test and can get my tags renewed. $150 for this part, $200 for that part, $250 labor. Round numbers, of course.

Yeah, well there are known transmission problems with auto. V-6 Hondas in the 2000 or so range. A friend of mine had his '03 Accord tranny replaced at about 99k under an extend warranty that Honda offered due to known design problems. He was really flipping out at first cause the warranty only went to 100k and he only had a slight slippage. The dealer wasn't convinced at first, but he eventually got them to replace it. Info

Also have an in-law who is on her third tranny in her Odyysey (same tranny as accord), all replaced under extended warranty

I have had 2 minivans.
First was the 95 Windstar.(Purchased new and sold at 80,000 miles) The largest interior space of any minivan ever made. Quiet and comfortable ride.25 MPG highway! Had 2 major repairs Warranty engine rebuild at 28,000 and non-warranty replacement of transmission at 70,000miles. Many minor repairs- Antilock Brake sensors , engine sensors, rotors .

2nd Minivan is a 2002 (purchased in 04)Honda Odyssey. Very loud hard Noisy ride. Very tight turning radius and 260 HP. Does a minivan need 260 HP? 21MPG highway. 1 major repair . Non warranty Transmission replacement@ 60,000. Minor repairs - Sliding door problems and lube. o2 sensors.

Have driven both vans to Florida a couple of times. I think the Windstar was an all around better vehicle.

There is very little difference in the latest built foreign and American Vehicles. Consumer Reports has done an injustice to the American car Manufacturers by claiming that the foreign Vehicles are far superior when in reality they may marginally better at best!

Necromancer said:

Dodge? I'm not surprised.

American cars are junk. If you want something reliable thats going to last, get a japenese car like a Toyota or Honda.

Unlike a manufacturer like Honda or Toyota, who completely redesigns its cars every 4-5 years, US cars are still based on antiquated agricultural technology thats been around for decades. Most american cars, they only update the exterior not the interior. Just look at the Cavalier. Its been on the same J body platform for almost 30 years now.

And just look at these new concept cars the big 3 are putting out. Everytime i see one of those cars, i cringe.

Click to expand...

As a trained mechanic I'll agree with you up to a point... the Japanese do BUILD some terrific vehicles, in that their machining and fit is just about the best there is... Their tolerances between parts are just TOP NOTCH-- not like the 'sloppy fit' of American parts. If a piston is going to expand, say .018 of an inch at operating temperature, the cylinder will be bored, at most, 1 or 2 thousandths over that, and I've seen them dead on for a 'perfect fit'.

That said, I don't like Japanese stuff much for two reasons-- first, they "over-engineer" so much stuff. My dad has a 4 cylinder Honda Odessy van and it was a terrific car, but the "service" lite would come on ALL THE TIME, because the Japanese are 'programmed' to service their cars very very precisely and don't do anything themselves; it all goes to the dealership/factory shop. So basically, every time it needs an oil change, the tire pressure checked, air filter checked, EVERYTHING, no matter how 'trivial' or easy to do at home, the lite comes on and you'd have to go to the dealer to know whether it was 'serious' or 'trivial'. Finally one of the mechanics there explained it to him and showed him how to turn the lite off without coming to the shop (since his extended service warranty was almost up). He had the automatic transmission go out in it, and they supposedly 'rebuilt' it five times and it would still get squirrelly and you'd have to let up on the pedal to get it to shift, like the old Powr-Matics from the 50's, which my dad was used to. If you accelerated too hard, the transmission would go through a violent vibration and try to decide which gear to go into, sometimes downshifting two gears and nearly redlining the motor. In talking with a transmission specialist I know, he told me he doesn't even work on those, because they are SO complex-- any little thing off by even a tiny amount and the transmission won't work right. Even using another brand of oil besides the "Honda" transmission fluid could cause it to have problems. Now that's just TOO finicky!

I've changed a broken timing belt on a Ford Escort Wagon on the side of the road in Hereford TX with only a screwdriver, pair of pliers, and three wrenches, but to change the timing belt on that Honda requires you to remove all the engine accessories (alternator, A/C compressor, etc.) and remove the engine mount on the right side to get the belt off. Shop rate for the job is $700. Rediculous! That's just over-engineering at it's worst. Even changing the air filter on that van was a PITA, because of the way the air cleaner box was shoehorned in under the hood.

For my part, I'll stick with American for the time being... heck, half the parts on any Ford you buy now are Mazda, Nippon-Denso, etc. Look at a Ford Ranger-- It's virtually the exact same truck as a Mazda B1600? or whatever the number is. The American stuff is just a little less FINICKY.

JMHO! OL JR

BTW-- I HATE the electronically controlled transmissions too-- they don't hold a candle to the old hydraulically controlled automatics. The main reason they switched over is that it's cheaper and easier to build a transmission using a handful of cheap electronic sensors and solenoid valves than all the intricately machined wormtracks and shift relay valves and precisely calibrated springs and mechanisms in a hydraulically controlled transmission.

In towing heavy loads, I REALLY hate the electronically controlled transmissions. The stupid things will 'learn' how to shift when you're driving all week without a trailer, but then you hook up to a trailer to haul hay on the weekend and the stupid computer doesn't know WHAT to do, because you're pressing the pedal to the floor to get moving, but accelerating slowly, under a heavy load, but at low speed, and the computer gets 'confused' by this conflicting sensor data... so it takes a while to "learn" how to shift with a heavy loaded trailer behind. You have to 'outguess' it, by knowing just how far you can push the accelerator before it goes 'squirrelly' and downshifts two gears or does something else stupid because the computer gets 'confused'. The old hydraulic transmissions were SO much better... a governor to sense the driveshaft speed and vary main line pressure to suit, and a vacuum modulator to sense engine load and vary the main line pressure, and a kickdown rod/valve to sense the throttle position (accelerator pedal) to drop MLP when you floor the car to pass, an internal regulator to set a steady MLP to be modified by the prior mentioned valves, and then three or four shift sequencing valves to respond to mainline pressure and shift the transmission up and down through the gears as the speed/load varies. SIMPLE. Now the stupid computer 'does it all' (and does nothing particularly well) OL JR